File merge & Audio sync issues in Pre. Elements with .mts-->.mp4

[texasjefe742]

Hi,

I am having two issues with importing/converting .mts (AVCHD) files into .mp4 to edit with in A.P.E 15. This problem started in APE 14 which is why I bought 15.

1) If I import .mts files into APE, there does not appear to be a way to merge the files into one file. (I am not talking about grouping) files. The .mts files are properly audio synched, but they have sound gaps at the end of each file, that will fix when the clips are merged. Is it true that APE cannot merge .mts files, or, is there an APE solution for it?

2) Now, if I convert the AVCHD into an .mp4 file and load it into APE, even after conforming, the audio is not synced. I understand this is because the camera may have used variable frame rates, and the converter and editor cannot compensate for the inconsistent frame rates in clips, and thus the synch is lost. Is is true that APE cannot auto-fix these sync issues when conforming files?

I am testing external conversion program suggested by external web posters. These tools are Any Video Converter, Handbrake, and Filmora.

Filmora can merge the files and gets closer on the synch on a conversion of 1 AVCHD file to an .mp4, but it does not fix them.

Your suggestions and solutions are heartily welcomed, and I would love to find out these issues are fixable in APR. If they are not, please suggest outside tools that have worked.

[moved from Premiere Pro to Premiere Elements forum by mod]

[Ann Bens]

I am having a bit of trouble with your workflow.

Are these mts files one long take and chopped up in 20 minutes segments?

Or are these just random clips.

If so I would put them on the timeline and trim each clip 1 frame.

BTW Elements can make one mp4  file out of many clips

But what you are doing now is double encoding.

[Bill Sprague]

There is a history with some AVCHD cameras.  Using SD cards created a file size limit.  I think it was 4GB.  If I remember, it was about 20 minutes at the highest quality 1080p60 setting.  Both Panasonic and Sony cameras came with software that would join those sections together seamlessly without rendering losses.   Panasonic's was called HDWriter.  I forget what Sony called theirs.  For example, the software would transform the three parts of a continuous hour long recording on the SD card to one seamless file on the computer HDD.   It was lossless and fast.

Depending on a lot of things, if one used software other than what came with the camera to join the files, there could be a one or two frame glitch in the audio.   Somewhere the design of AVCHD has some secret sauce in it for the proprietary software to knit the 4GB chunks together.  

You may not be able to completely resolve this using only Premier Elements.

[Ann Bens]

I might can if you copy entire card to hdd first and then Add Media.

this way Elements will probably use the metadata properly.

[Bill Sprague]

Ann Bens wrote:

I might can if you copy entire card to hdd first and then Add Media.

this way Elements will probably use the metadata properly.

Ann,

It has been a long time since I recorded an hour long continuous video with my 2010 Panasonic camcorder.  It was one of the first that would do 1080p60 AVCHD.   The forced 20 minute files joined seamlessly using Panasonic's HDWriter.  Premier Elements left a one or two frame gap.

In the AVCHD system, the camera makes a few extra files with each primary .mts file.  The extra files are used only by the camera itself and the proprietary software that comes with the camera.  No NLE will use or even see the extra files.  Both the Panasonic and Sony software had a few extra tricks they could do that normal NLEs didn't. 

(If it hadn't been a questionable decision to migrate to 4K, that Panasonic camcorder would still be primary in my kit!)

I stopped worrying about it when I figured out that nobody would ever watch long, continous videos.  Clips longer than 5 seconds and videos longer than 5 minutes only guarantees sleep.

Bill

[Ann Bens]

No NLE will use or even see the extra files.

NLE do use those files.

[Bill Sprague]

Ann Bens wrote:

No NLE will use or even see the extra files.

NLE do use those files.

Due respect Ann, but I disagree.  Which of the NLEs?  And what does it do with them?

My Panasonic AVCHD camcorder creates four files with the same "first" name and different extensions.  The are:  *.mts, *.cpi, *.mpl and *.vpl

For a couple years I carefully copied all off them to my computer using the Panasonic software.  As I learned Premier Elements, a little of Windows Movie Maker and a little of Sony Movie Studio I learned the .cpi, .mpl and .vpl files did nothing and I've deleted all off them from my computer.   Before I deleted them I did exhaustive research to find their purpose.  Outside the camera and any proprietary software belonging to the camera, there is no known purpose. 

For a few years I've been using Lightroom for file management.  I put the card in the computer, Lightroom finds the still image files and the video files, including the .mts and will import and copy them to my computer.  It leaves everything else behind.

The only thing that doesn't function is the Panasonic HDWriter program that I abandon due to severe editing limitations. 

Premier Elements 9, 11, 13  were, and now 15 is, fully functional without any of the extra files. 

[Ann Bens]

They are used in the background.

[Bill Sprague]

Ann Bens wrote:

They are used in the background.

I guess we disagree!    On my computer I can't find any effect of those three extra files in Premiere Elements.  They appear useless.

Bill

[texasjefe742]

I appreciate the discussion! Thank you.

I make long continuous files because these are oral history interviews. Though, maybe I will have to break the video files up.

I would try clipping a few frames if editing, but the simple problem is that it's the audio at the end of each mts file that mutes for 60 frames, while the video is continuous. If there's a way to mitigate that with audio transitions and effects, I'm game for that.

I will look at the camera and brand and see what may be suggested if anything or if relevant proprietary software exists from the company point of view, but I expect nothing from major corporations, and even here Adobe seems inadequate in caring enought to address this issue.

I have always trashed the meta files. I can keep and copy them but again, I doubt that's going to do anything, unless there is proprietary software that uses them.

Thanks again! This discussion does give me new angles to test.

[Bill Sprague]

texasjefe742 wrote:

........I will look at the camera and brand and see what may be suggested if anything or if relevant proprietary software exists from the company point of view, but I expect nothing from major corporations, and even here Adobe seems inadequate in caring enought to address this issue.

If it is a Sony camera the software is probably called "PlayMemories Home" and is easy to get online.   If it is a Panasonic, it is probably called HDWriter and it should be on a disc included with the camera.  Last I looked, HDWriter was not available online.

I once googled for methods to join the 4GB sections.  Somebody posted a solution I never tried.  It was a complex copy instruction using the Command line in Windows.  Essentially it to the separate 4GB files and copied them into a new single file.  It was claimed the audio gap disappeared.  I didn't ever try it. 

Another approach has to be done in shooting.  Once I was recording a lecture at a conference.  The only camera available had a 30 minute recording limit.  At 25 minutes I started looking for a pause long enough to stop and restart the recording.  I got it to almost disappear in post by covering the gap with a transition.   The actual speech was not interrupted.   Only a bit of drinking water out of a bottle disappeared.

Good luck with your project!