Lightroom changes exposure of pictures when they are clicked

[marcelv66180642]

Hi there,

I've been working with Lightroom (currently 5.7) for a long time but these last few months I noticed something really annoying, and I don't understand whats going on.

Whenever I import a bunch of photo's from my Canon 6D and import them in Lightroom, and I am working in the Develop mode, the pictures change very often (not always) as soon as I click on them in the row at the bottom.

The picture preview above looks okay for a second and then something happens as if the exposure goes down, making the look of the picture worse every time, so my guess is that the original look is the correct one....

It seems as if some kind of preset is done even though I dont do anything.

Did I enable some kind of auto-correction on the pictures or something?

Marcel

[JP Hess · Accepted solution]

I don't think so. If these are images that were just imported then Lightroom is displaying the embedded JPEG preview that includes all of the in-camera settings that have been applied. Lightroom does not read those settings. As soon as Lightroom imports raw images it displays that JPEG image until it has time to generate the preview of the raw image data. So if you haven't given Lightroom time to generate raw previews you would experience what you are describing.

[marcelv66180642]

Thank you for your answer,

With embedded JPEG preview do you mean the JPG that the camera saves with the RAW file on my card?

(I have set my camera to save both)

How can the default RAW image be different from the jpg image then? I assumed that the JPG and the RAW image is saved in the camera with the same settings I have in the camera? Or does Lightroom reset some of these RAW settings to a different value?

If for example I make a pictures with whitebalance completely towards blue colors, would the RAW picture look normal in Lightroom? I never gave this any thought before and never noticed it before...

Marcel

[JP Hess]

The raw image itself has an embedded JPEG preview. That is what is displayed in the LCD on your camera because the camera cannot read raw images either. I'm not talking about an extra JPEG image. This is a preview that is inside of the raw image. When Lightroom downloads you are brought images it depends on this JPEG preview in the import dialog and in Lightroom until it has time to generate the preview for the raw image data. Remember that Lightroom is a raw image editor/processor. But it takes time to generate  a preview from the raw data. The raw data is not image data, not pixels. That's why it has to be converted. And that's why Lightroom must use the embedded JPEG preview.

[marcelv66180642]

Hmmm okay but is it normal that this preview image looks better (lighter) than the converted image that Lightroom produces afterwards?

I assume the preview image is meant to match the photo you've taken, and not be different from the real image?

It has happened so many times that I think 'this is a great picture' when I see the image pop up on the screen, and that 1 second later LR does something with it that makes it look terrible and dark, and then I have to adjust all kinds of settings on the right to make it look great again ...

I've never had this issue before and I've been working with LR for years. So what could have changed in the situation that all of a sudden they are completely different? Could it have to do with colorspace settings or some other setting that has changed?

PS: Please check this example, the large JPEG (right) that is saved by the camera is also lighter and looks like the preview that I get for a short moment. So there definately seems something wrong with the way LR converts the RAW into an image in LR?

[Just Shoot Me]

marcelv66180642  wrote

Hmmm okay but is it normal that this preview image looks better (lighter) than the converted image that Lightroom produces afterwards?

I assume the preview image is meant to match the photo you've taken, and not be different from the real image?

No what you are seeing initially is the Embedded JPG image and that follows whatever settings you have set in your camera for capturing JPG images.

RAW is RAW Sensor data. A JPG is processed from that sensor data by the camera.

[JP Hess]

What you are seeing is normal  and to be expected when shooting raw. There are a few ways to minimize this effect, but it won't work with all images. You will probably still need to make adjustments to your images. With all of my cameras that I have used in Lightroom I have taken a newly imported image that resembles what I take normally. I like to take a lot of landscape and scenery pictures. I make adjustments to that image to make it look the way I want it to look initially. Then I save new camera defaults for the camera.  After that, whenever I import new images or click on the Reset button on an already imported image, those settings that I have chosen to be my default settings will be applied to the image. My experience has been that I have been able to cut down considerably on the amount of it just means that I need to make.

What Lightroom imports is really the "raw" image data. None of the in-camera adjustments that you make will be read by Lightroom. This is because every camera maker designs their own raw file format and there is no consistency in that format. So Adobe imports the raw data, ignores all the camera settings, and gives you more of a raw display. It's up to you to fine tune Lightroom so that it works the way you want it to work. When you set defaults for a camera, they are defaults for that camera model. And you can even make the default settings specific to a Serial number. So you can have as many default settings saved as you need.

[marcelv66180642]

Thank you very much!

I will try that, it's just strange that I havent noticed this before, maybe I wasn't paying enough attention to it!

Marcel

[troyecol]

This is the standard answer for explaining the change in appearance of images as they are opened in Lightroom but one of the aspects of this explanation that seems perplexing is that Lightroom takes, sometimes considerable, time generating previews when images are imported (and one can see subtle changes to the thumbnails as this happens). But when images are opened up (in Develop module) there is another change in appearance. It seems simplistic to suggest that Lightroom is ignoring all the previews previously generated and starting all over with the embedded jpeg. If so what is the point of generating previews on import?

[JP Hess]

troyecol  wrote

It seems simplistic to suggest that Lightroom is ignoring all the previews previously generated and starting all over with the embedded jpeg. If so what is the point of generating previews on import?

If Lightroom didn't display the JPEG preview then there would be no image displayed until the raw preview is generated. That could prove to be confusing as well. And I think you have it backwards. The JPEG preview is displayed first. Lightroom replaces that preview with a preview of the raw data once the raw preview has been created.

[elie_dinur]

Actually, the preview made shortly after import by reading the Raw data and applying the default conversion is a highly compressed and low resolution (preferably at a resolution close to your monitor resolution) sort of jpg that can be quickly redrawn after each change in the editing and is used only by the Library, Print and Book modules’ displays, not the Develop module which creates its own display based initially on data from the Raw file stored in the Camera Raw Cache folder and then supplemented by reference to the original file or to a Smart Preview. This allows for faster redrawing of the preview during editing because if the image is zoomed in, only the section actually on screen at that moment needs to be updated. If the Raw is a DNG with Quick Load Data embedded, LR does not need to access the CR Cache.

The Library preview is saved in Adobe RGB space. The Develop module display is in Melissa RGB space. But the color management translates them both to your monitor space, so they should look virtually identical. If you see a difference, it is usually because of a problem with the display profile.

[troyecol]

Thanks, this is helpful. I'm not sure why I see the shift as the images are rerendered in Develop. Note once this happens the alteration is carried over to the LIbrary previews. The problem first cropped up 3 or 4 years ago and I see it on monitors (and I think computers). Not all images but when it happens it is a real pain. Does Lightroom maintain its own display profiles or use the system profiles?

[elie_dinur]

LR always uses the operating system default, but apparently its CM uses the profile differently than, for instance, Photoshop. I have seen numerous cases, over the years, in which LR acted as though the profile was corrupted although other applications, including PS, had no problem with it. Often recalibrating the monitor was the solution - or calibrating/profiling instead of relying on a maker supplied "canned" profile.

[troyecol]

Thanks for the useful insights.

[troyecol]

I think you are missing my point. I concur there is an embedded jpeg and that the appearance changes as Lightroom generates previews. BUT at times the appearance of the image changes again when first used; hence something else is going on. elle_di's post adds some clarity.

[elie_dinur]

"...it's just strange that I havent noticed this before, maybe I wasn't paying enough attention to it!"

Maybe you have changed your camera settings; for instance turned on Auto Light Optimization or Highlight Tone Priority. Maybe you set a different Picture Style, switched it from the flatter ones like Neutral or Faithful to a "jazzier" P.S. like Standard or Landscape. Or changed the custom parameters of a P.S., sharpening, contrast, saturation and hue. These image characteristics are all products of the processing the camera does in order to make jpgs and they are not inherent in the Raw data. Lightroom does not do them by default nor does it automatically read metadata notations and try to recreate camera processing. It does its own Adobe processing and Adobe's opinion about what makes for a good default starting point for Raw editing and the camera maker's (Canon, in this case) opinion about what makes for a good looking and camera-selling jpg are likely to be quite different.

Nevertheless, as Jim has indicated, you can change LR's defaults to accord more with your own desired starting point. Change the default camera profile from Adobe Standard to one of the reverse-engineered imitations of Canon's profiles, for a start. Just remember that Adobe processing is not Canon processing and they never can be entirely identical. Personally, I like what I can do with Adobe tools; if I wanted to recreate Canon processing, I would use the software provided with the camera.

[Sarah24641405dvlv]

THIS IS THE WORST! It ruins the workflow, adds hours of time to the shoot processing. I'm so frustrated myself. I have this  on video. It vanishes so quickly its like it isnt happening. Ive had this issue for years.

[TheDigitalDog]

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@Sarah24641405dvlv wrote:

THIS IS THE WORST! It ruins the workflow, adds hours of time to the shoot processing. I'm so frustrated myself. I have this  on video. It vanishes so quickly its like it isnt happening. Ive had this issue for years.

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This is a five year old post (with a correct and accurate answer) so what exactly is your problem with Lightroom Classic? 

[JP Hess]

Things have changed dramatically (in my opinion) since this thread began years ago. Now, if you want your images to import and look more the way you expect them to look, you can set your own defaults more effectively than you could previously. I like to suggest users watch and implement the techniques taught in this tutorial. It works well for me, and provides an excellent starting point for new imports for my work.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XGCnR9qEqA4&t=29s