Using Master pages

[MartinRTR]

Hi There

Can anyone help me with master Pages.

Master Pages are a thing of beauty and, if i could only 'master' them would save hours and hours - but one thing eludes me. Making changes on the master page seems to apply the change to the document pages only randomly. Now as I understand computers are totally binary, don't have a personality and therefore don't things randomy I have to accept that it's the user (that's me!) at fault and not the machine.

So - what am i doing on those pages wher the changes don't apply? I didn't think anythbing but there MUST be. Possibly related to this and deeply irksome – is that on some pages, when I make a MP change it simply plonks the chnage on top of the existing item in the document rather than replace it. What possible setting i ask myself what I need that for?!

To simplify the question – How can I ensure that all changes made on the MP are applied to the relevant document pages as an 'over-write' every time?

Thanks

Martin

[Alma_Strutt · Accepted solution]

Hi Martin

it would be good to see a screen shot of the problem you're experiencing but by default changes you make to a master page are automatically applied to associate pages.

It sounds as though you have some overrides going on in your document and they behave differently depending on what you're asking the document to do. There is also the option to detach a master page item and that also allows the object to behave in a different way.

If you would like to post an example of the trouble you're experiencing we can get to the bottom of the problem or if you prefer to check out the Adobe help link on Master Pages see below.

Learn how to use master pages in InDesign

[MartinRTR]

Hi Alma

Thanks for that

In the end I think posting my question was more about venting my frustration than asking for an answer!

I will just have to work my way patiently through the link above

Thanks for your reply

Martin

[Barb Binder]

Here's how I teach master pages, Martin:

1. When you make a new document (let's say it is 12 pages) and you fill out the New Document dialog box with paper size, margins, columns, etc. all that information is added the the A-Master
2. All body pages are assigned the A-Master as a default, so they all get the same paper size, margins, columns, etc.
3. When you add objects to the A-Master (page numbers, running heads, graphics, etc.), the new objects are immediately picked up by all the body pages because they are assigned A-Master

When you need multiple page layouts, you can create additional master pages. These can be based on the A-Master or not. Let's say you make a B-Master that is based on A-Master. You change the layout. Now body pages can use A or B. Elements added to B are only picked up by body pages using the B-Master. Add an element to A, and all the pages linked to A will update: B-Master which is based on A, plus body pages using A and body pages using B. A-Master is the parent master, and in my example, all pages are linked to A.

When this gets confusing (and this is the basis for your question), is when you begin overriding elements on pages based on the A-Master (master pages or body pages). If you want a change on a master to be reflected on the pages, don't override them.

So - what am i doing on those pages wher the changes don't apply?

One of two things:

• To override specific master items on a document page, press Ctrl+Shift (Windows) or Command+Shift (Mac OS) and click the item (or drag to select multiple items). Change the selected master items as desired. The item can now be selected like any other page item, but retains its association with the master page.
• To override all master page items on a document spread, target the spread, and then choose Override All Master Page Items in the Pages panel menu. You can now select and modify any and all master items as you wish.

Once you override any master item, its dotted bounding box becomes a solid line to show that a local copy has been created. Once you override any master item, changing it on the master will not be reflected on the body pages.

[ACWaters]

I am wondering about items on a page that appear to be interfering with the ability of the Master Page items to show up. I have two frames, one with an image, one without, that are on top of the the Master Page folio and I can not see the Master Page folio unless I move these two items over and then select the Master page folio using the technique described above.

Is there a way to set Master Page Items to be "on top" of all other elements on a page so they show up over any images or color frames you might place on the page without having to Command Shift select them every time?

I appreciate any insight anyone has on this matter.

[Steve Werner]

The way to solve your problem is with the use of layers. On the Layers panel create a new layer for your master page folio that is above all other layers. On your master page, select the frame the page number is in. On the Layers panel, the little square which appears on the right side of the current layer is a "proxy" for the item selected. Drag the square up to the new top layer you've created and you'll move the page number to that layer. (The selection color will change, reflecting the new layer it's on.) That item will now always appear in front of objects on other layers, whatever page they are on.

[ACWaters]

Fantastic. Thank you!!

[M3JIA]

Command + Shift and Click. I've used in InDesign for over 10 years and didn't know this shortcut. thank you so much, very helpful

[jane-e]

A screen shot of your Pages panel would be useful—make sure it is wide enough and that we can see all of the Master Pages.

[harpg60316040]

Hi - I am having this issue as well. I've created a Master page and am inserting unique content (text and images) on the actual pages. When I recently updated the Master, some of the pages reflected the change, some didn't. I used Control + Shift to add the unique text and images. Then, I needed to change the inside margin on all pages and therefore had to move the placement of some objects. Why would some pages reflect the moves and some not, even though all pages have had the unique text/images added in the same way?

[Migintosh]

Barb has written the answer to your question above, but here's what's causing your issue:

harpg60316040  wrote

I used Control + Shift to add the unique text and images.

[harpg60316040]

• To override specific master items on a document page, press Ctrl+Shift (Windows) or Command+Shift (Mac OS) and click the item (or drag to select multiple items). Change the selected master items as desired. The item can now be selected like any other page item, but retains its association with the master page.

This last sentence from Barb's answer is what I'm not seeing. The retaining association is what I want but am not having happen consistently. There obviously has to be a reason but have not pin pointed it.

This "swap pages" mention from another reply may give a clue?

[harpg60316040]

Finally, if an association is lost, perhaps there's a way to reestablish? Have not been able to find anything on that yet. Thanks for any help!

[harpg60316040]

Oops, just found it.

Reapply master items

If you’ve overridden master items, you can restore them to match the master page. When you do this, the object’s attributes revert to their state on the corresponding master, and will once again update when you edit the master. The local copy of the object is removed, and the master item cannot be selected, as indicated by its dotted border. You can remove overrides for selected objects or all objects on a spread, but not across an entire document at once.

• Do one of the following:

  • To remove master overrides from one or more objects, select objects that were originally master items. In the Pages panel, target a spread and choose Remove Selected Local Overrides in the Pages panel menu.
  • To remove all master overrides from a spread, in the Pages panel, target the spread (or master spread) from which you want to remove all master overrides. Choose Edit >Deselect All to make sure that no objects are selected. In the Pages panel, choose Remove All Local Overrides in the Pages panel menu.

[rob day]

Finally, if an association is lost, perhaps there's a way to reestablish?

If you use Remove Selected Overrides, you would lose the content—you would need to copy the content first and then override and replace.

The problem is when you swap pages the association is with the original MP item:

So Remove Selected Local Overrides does this

If I copy first I can override the left rectangle and Paste Into:

[harpg60316040]

Thanks, that's a good tip and works easily. Still not 100% sure what swap means but that's OK. Really appreciate your visuals and quick response.

[rob day]

I meant if I reorder the pages in the 2-3 spread by dragging them in the pages panel.

[rob day]

Why would some pages reflect the moves and some not, even though all pages have had the unique text/images added in the same way?

When you override a master page object without making any changes, it is still linked to its master and will respond to a change from the master. If you make some kind of change to the overridden object, it will continue to respond to a change from the master, with the exception of the changed parameter(s). For example here I’ve overridden the rectangles on page 2&3, change their fill colors, and moved the page 2 rectangle:

If I go to the page’s master and change the positions and fill colors, the page 3 rectangle responds to the move, but not the color change because all I did was change its color on the override. The page 2 rectangle doesn’t respond at all because I changed both its position and color after the override:

Also, if you swap pages after an override and a position change, the overridden master page items get effectively detached from their masters with new masterpage items added to the swapped pages

[harpg60316040]

OK - makes sense and thanks. It's what I thought but not quite what I'm experiencing... unless... By "swap pages," do you mean even if you reorder pages or add pages before, for example? If that happens, are the overridden master page items detached from their masters? If that is so, maybe that explains it. I'm not sure if you'll be able to see this...

Page 7 picked up all position changes as expected accept 1 (everything is shifted over to the right slightly). Pages 3 and 5 only picked up a few of the position changes, most were not picked up. Content was added to all three pages in the same way.