Cinema 4D and After Effects animation problem (object null for light not synchronized to the center) only if I use camera

[SanchezMusics]

Software: Cinema 4D R18 e After Effects cc 2017.1

With Cinema 4D I made the car.

With After Effects I want to apply a realistic light to the front light.

In Cinema 4D, the machine is animated in a null object.

Then I created a null object (for the light in After Effects) that I put as a child to the null object of the animation and it follows perfectly the animated path.

The problem arises when I use a camera.

If I do not use any camera, when I open the .c4d project in After Effects, the null object follows perfectly the center of the front light.

If instead I use a camera, the null object is not at the center of the lighthouse and does not follow the animation perfectly, why?

How can I fix it? I absolutely need to use the camera. Thank you.

[Mylenium]

You may need to bake the keyframes in Cinema 4D. These are weird bugs in the C4D keyframing stuff.

Mylenium

[SanchezMusics]

I've cooked the animation, and I even cooked the camera (I tried both with fixed objects and with the Nitrobrake plugin), but the problem did not disappear. What else can I try?

[Aaron Ecthelion]

You open .c4d file right inside After Effects via Cineware plug-in?

I have encountered this kind of problem before. My camera animation in C4D could not be imported into After Effects properly through Cineware plug-in. Then I baked my animation, and saved an .AEC file. Finally my animation was correct.

So, you can try the aec workflow, which I like a lot.

Cheers

Aaron

[SanchezMusics]

I open directly the .c4d file and without camera there works well.

The problem is when you use a camera.

I've also tried your method, but not i managed to make it work.

Anyway, whatever the method solves the problem, I have prepared two sample files, so as to be as clear as possible.

The room is that of the final scene with bake, the machine I made cubes to have the small file.

Nel file scene_1 - with camera.c4d Null objects do not follow the animation perfectly.

Nel file scene_2 - not camera.c4d Instead the objects follow perfectly the animation because there is not camera.

scene_1 - with camera:https://www.sendspace.com/file/8vey7c

scene_2 - not camera: https://www.sendspace.com/file/ii5484

Thank you very much for your help.

[SanchezMusics]

Please anyone help me solve somehow the camera problem that does not properly follow the null object?

Sorry for my english use google translator.

Thanks.

[Aaron Ecthelion]

Hey, bro. I have tested the scene files that you posted. And I find out why your problem appears. It is quite simple.

After extracting your scene data to After Effects via Cineware. You should select  Comp Camera as your working camera.

Then you will be good to go.

[SanchezMusics]

With the research I had already found this possible solution, but unfortunately it is not good because the framing is not correct. It is moved to the left (to your left looking at the screen) and does not match.

Perhaps the only possible solution is your method.

But I did not succeed.

Would you be so kind to set the file and attach it?

Thank you very much indeed.

[Aaron Ecthelion]

I just took a detailed look at your C4D scene file.

The root reason why your problem occurs is that your camera has some parameter keyframes that cannot be transferred to After Effects camera, such as Film Offset X, Film Offset Y. They cannot be transferred because AE camera doesn't have the corresponding parameters for them. So you can see that your framing is not correct when seeing through the AE camera which is converted from C4D camera via Cineware or AEC.

Hence, it seems like your problem cannot be solved, at least in my own knowledge.

But I got a little tip for you. If you want to transfer your camera animation to AE without problem, you should try to animate with some basic parameters, such as position, rotation, which AE camera has the corresponding ones, and try not to mess up with some parameters that AE camera doesn't have, as much as possible.

If you really want to solve this, you can redo your camera animation without messing up with too many parameters. But I cannot be sure if you can get the similar animation you want by doing so.

Sorry, I have no other workaround here for you.

Cheers

Aaron

[SanchezMusics]

Ok but if you bake the camera, after effects will have nothing to interpret, why does not the problem disappear?

Also too me understand after so many tests that the problem is exactly the two parameters offset X e Y.

Possible that Can there be no a solution to the problem?

[SanchezMusics]

One can find a way to simulate the offset (X - Y) in cinema 4d so that it after effects can interpret it.

Maybe with xpresso of cinema 4d, but I'm not very capable of using it.

Is there any guru of this software turns for these parts? O hai anche qualche nuova idea in mente da provare?

Thank you so much.

[SanchezMusics]

Anyone know a way to export the X&Y film offset settings on a C4D camera to an After Effects camera? Super annoying limitation.

[Aaron Ecthelion]

You might not understood what I said very well. Here I will make it clear.

You cannot see your scene properly through your AE camera, because some parts of your camera animation in C4D cannot be transferred. This makes your framing off in After Effects in your case.

In my knowledge, there is no way that you can export Film Offset X&Y to After Effects directly. But there may be some workaround.

If you want to compensate for this, you can set your AE camera as child of a null object and make some adjustments to the null. This may help but not sure if it can get exactly what you want.

Or you can re-animate your camera. Keep this in mind: Do not mess up with so many parameters that After Effects cannot interpret, and do it as clean as possible.

Aaron

[SanchezMusics]

It's been three days that I'm looking for solutions and doing a thousand tests, but I still can not solve it.

This morning I found this solution that should work very well.

The problem is that from the eight o'clock this morning I try, but I'm not able to do it.

The problem is also why google translator use and translation is not fine. And I do not understand good the steps to do.

Any person corteous can help me and apply this technique to my sample file I have attached?

I would be really grateful to you.

This is the solution I found for to have offset in after effects.

For mother-tongue people it takes only a few minutes to understand and apply the steps to be done.

Brother, can you devote please five minutes of your precious time?

This can also help many other people. It's a serious lack of offset in after effects.

SOLUTION:

So, I got off my lazy butt, and nailed it.

here's the zipped file, with C4D file including the expresso, the .aep file and a final AE project.

I am using a simple expression in AE to get the 2D shift data from the "shift_corrector" null.

So the procedure is the following:

1. make a null and assign the expresso. Make sure you input the correct output resolution in the 2 "constant" operators in Expresso (I used 640x480 resolution)

2. export that as you usually do in AE.

3. in AE, import the .aep project and duplicate the Comp. Name one "3D-elements" and the other "MAIN comp".

4. in the "3D-elements" comp, leave all the 3D data containers and the camera, solids and lights but remove the "shift-corrector" and the rendered image.

5. in the MAIN comp, leave the rendered movie and the "shift-corrector".

6. drop your "3D-elements" comp into the MAIN comp and apply the little script to the "position" value of the "3D-elements". You can do that with the "whip" BUT don't forget to adjust the values to reflect an added offset of half your X and Y resolution (look at the script and you will understand). e.g. the last part of the script reads: [temp+320, 240]

I added the "+320" and 240. The whip gives you: [temp,temp]

and that's that.

Works like a charm!

FILE:

My new file: whait moment please

Example author's file loaded by him: Example author's file loaded by himhttp://noseman.org/cg_talk/camera_shift_2_AE_test_01.zip

[Aaron Ecthelion]

Waiting for your new file

[SanchezMusics]

Here's my new file: https://www.sendspace.com/file/0mxiyn

Thanks brother.

[Aaron Ecthelion]

Sorry, dude. I think this method is not perfect for your scene. Let me explain why.

This method can only compensate for film offset X&Y, but your C4D camera has other parameter keyframed, such as Sensor Size, which  AE cannot interpret,either(This will change the look of your scene). So, by following the steps that noseman provided, whose name is Athanasios Pozantzis, your animation is still a little bit off in AE.

The project file is here: https://www.sendspace.com/file/1fxeq0

You can take a look. If you can understand those steps, you will have no trouble understanding what I said.

Aaron

[SanchezMusics]

Thank you very much for your availability.

Unfortunately, it is not good, I like to do things with utmost precision.

This is and serious lack of after effects.

It's really ugly limitation not be able to can use the crane camera in after effects.

We hope Adobe tries to do something to solve this serious problem.

Cinema 4d It is extraordinary. After effects It is extraordinary. Combined with cineware is fantastic, but there must be a full support.

Playing with limitations is sad. It passes almost the urge to use it know that it is limited and we can not do everything we would like.

And it's a very important thing I hope adobe does not underestimate. For example, making realistic lights car as in this example of the topic is fundamental that they communicate perfectly even with a crane chamber.

[Aaron Ecthelion]

I don't think Adobe will do anything for this. After Effects is a compositing program, not 3D. So the camera in AE is much limited, not mimicking real camera, which cinema4d camera does.No programs are perfect.

If you want precision, manually keyframing is a way to go. But it's painful.

Cheers

Aaron

[SanchezMusics]

We are in 2017 and after effects has made a lot of progress over the years, I think now obviously there is a need to think about better integrating 3d in the true sense of the word and not just fictitious.

Io penso che per adobe sia giunto il momento di avvicinarsi un pò più seriamente al mondo del 3d che si sta espandendo sempre di più ogni giorno. O lo integra in after effects un vero spazio 3d, oppure sviluppano un nuovo software. Suite Adobe ha tutto, ma manca una componente importante nel 2017, il vero 3D, not the fictitious one with 2D planes.

Imagine with a real integration between after effects and 4d cinema what can you create. Even just a real 3d camera will suffice. I'm sure if they want to do it, they find a way to solve this serious limitation.

Force Adobe, you're immense and you can do it succeed !

Will be a success with those beautiful minds of engineers working in adobe.

[Kevin-Monahan]

Hi SanchezMusics,

What did you do to solve this issue? Any advice you can give other users? Did anyone's advice help you here? Let us know.

Thanks,
Kevin