After Effects CC 17 crashes repeatedly on preview

[siliconmana]

All afternoon AE has been crashing on preview at half resolution on a 344MB 4:39 min clip that contains audio. It won't play more than a few seconds then loops and/or crashes.
-I've muted audio in preview panel.
-Followed a video on a potential fix that indicated to raise raise [prefs>memory>RAM reserved for other applications] to 7G. No difference.
-Repeatedly cleared disk cache - no difference.
Actually haven't been able to work all afternoon because of this issue. Must have had near a dozen crashes.
There's not any massive footage in project and comp only has the one 5min clip without effects.

Comp settings: 1080p @ 25fps

AE CC 2017 v.14.1.0.57

OS: win10
CPU: i7 4790K
MB: Gigabyte Z97X-UD3H-CF
RAM: 16G
GPU: Geforce GTX-980

SSD & 7200rpm Optical Drive

[Szalam]

What format and codec is your footage?
Also, have you considered updating to the latest version of AE?

[Kevin-Monahan]

Hi DianeJ,

Are you still facing this crashing problem? If not, let us know how you solved it. If so, please let us know so we can assist you further.

Thanks,

Kevin

[siliconmana]

Szalam - At that stage, the footage was native .mxf from Canon XF-100. Forget codec offhand, regardless footage from my camera has never caused a problem before. Have latest version of AE installed.

Under windows event logs, keylight plugin was cause of crashes.

Spent 0ver 10hrs between chat, phone, remote desktop support and that was just one day.

Sebastian the operator I was last on phone with, ran out of options and submitted a bug report to technicians.
Result: Nothing, nothing at all, even though they knew I had an urgent project requiring Keylight.

Eventually, after numerous more crashes, I managed to render out the keylight video through AME.

At some point, on operator Sabastian's advise, I upgraded to 32G ram from 16. It didn't make any noticeable difference tbh. This was not a complex project. It was one 1080p 4min clip with Keylight with crop to region applied. That's it. Other than Keylight, no effects, no nothing.

I needed to be able to work on this section as a comp, not an avi and thus the result was far from satisfactory.

I had so many issues, all I could do was back to square one, import AE comps into Pr as pre-comping was not solving issues in AE.

Then, on last Pr update, AE comps would no longer preview properly in Pr, and this is the first time in years I've ever encountered preview problems in Pr, which makes me consider this new version of Pr is buggy too.
In AE, I then had to render off comps to uncompressed avi, and then import back into Pr to compile, which meant I lost ability to edit directly.

These work-arounds are NOT a solution to these issues and greatly increased production time, expense and stress levels as every step of the way required a rethink and another work around. This should not be happening.

Also, FYI, latest version of AE will not update PS files imported as comps. The previous version did, in a haphazard manner, the latest version, not at all. I tried everything. Right click in project window 'reload footage' nothing.

The only work around is to re-import the file, and watch file extensions as files with names such as 'file 01-001' seeim to be very confusing to AE, and at one point, I could not actually even reimport the file. I had to rename it to something completely different, then at another time I had two files 'file 01-001', 'file 01-002'. AE could not distinguish between 001 and 002, and no matter how many times I tried to import 002, AE imported 001. Again, I had to rename files.

Additionally, on the umteenth time I called Adobe support, the operator had not even BASIC knowledge of AE and was insistently attempting to give me advise that even I knew was completely incorrect. Unbelievable.
With buggy software, incompetent support operators, how Adobe can get away with charging for AE in it's current state.

[Szalam]

dianej38942313  wrote

AE could not distinguish between 001 and 002, and no matter how many times I tried to import 002, AE imported 001. Again, I had to rename files.

I would be willing to bet a little checkbox turned off would have solved this problem. If there are sequential numbers on Photoshop documents (or JPEGs, PNGs, etc.), AE will often default to assuming it's an image sequence. See this image of my AE import dialog:

If that box is ticked, AE will import all three PSDs as a single video file with three frames. And it'll look, for all the world, like it's imported the wrong document. I'll bet that's what happened in your situation. It wasn't that AE was having confusion about the file names, it's that it was being told to do something that you didn't mean to tell it to do.

As far as your issues with Keylight go, MXF files are often highly compressed (a flavor of H.264) and Keylight has been known to occasionally wig out with long GOP codecs. Many accounts on these forums of it working fine and then suddenly, on one clip (or a series of clips) it suddenly doesn't want to work.

There are potentially two easy solutions to this.

One is to transcode any footage you need to key into a production codec (DNxHD, Cineform, etc.) - annoying that you have to do that extra step, but the problems all go away.

The second is great if you have a simple compositing job and that's to use the Ultra Key effect in Premiere Pro and just do your compositing there. Ultra Key does a great job keying on most shots (better than Keylight in some cases) and doesn't have the same issues AE and Keylight sometimes do with long-GOP footage.

A frustrating issue, to be sure, but one that is pretty easily worked around. I wish I could have told you all of this before you had to go through all of that stress!

[siliconmana]

"I would be willing to bet a little checkbox turned off would have solved this problem. "

If only it was that simple. Unfortunately, I have no need to import Psd files as sequential. They are imported either as comp/comp or comp/retain layer size.

'MXF files are often highly compressed (a flavor of H.264)'.
Actually, Canon XF codec, their form of .MXF is .262 or, mpeg2.

'One is to transcode any footage you need to key into a production codec (DNxHD, Cineform, etc.) - annoying that you have to do that extra step, but the problems all go away.'

I wish, I tried rendering using numerous codecs, including DNxHD to no avail. Keylight was still crashed in first seconds of render.
Eventually, I removed some of the fine tuning in Keylight, and rendered out an uncompressed avi with alpha through AME.
I then imported into Pr, used Ultra-Key, as you mentioned, yet this work-around severely restricted SFX on this one small, yet integral component of project which was not possible having then to compile in Pr.
Sure, I could render clip out again through Pr, re-import render into AE with transparency, however time constraints coming up with continuous work-arounds made this impossible given I was also working on another clip for an architectural projection with it's own complications of a very different nature.

[Szalam]

dianej38942313  wrote

"I would be willing to bet a little checkbox turned off would have solved this problem. "

If only it was that simple. Unfortunately, I have no need to import Psd files as sequential. They are imported either as comp/comp or comp/retain layer size.

That's what I'm saying; you don't want to import them sequentially, so that checkbox needs to be turned off, but it was probably on automatically.

dianej38942313  wrote

'MXF files are often highly compressed (a flavor of H.264)'.
Actually, Canon XF codec, their form of .MXF is .262 or, mpeg2.

Yes, you're right. Still a long-GOP codec and usually transcoding helps with it. But, apparently, not in your case.

[siliconmana]

Szalam  wrote

dianej38942313   wrote

"I would be willing to bet a little checkbox turned off would have solved this problem. "

If only it was that simple. Unfortunately, I have no need to import Psd files as sequential. They are imported either as comp/comp or comp/retain layer size.

That's what I'm saying; you don't want to import them sequentially, so that checkbox needs to be turned off, but it was probably on automatically.

Yes true, the default import setting has 'sequential' checked. It's very annoying. I wish there was a preference to change it.

Importing multiple psd files, I'm very careful to turn off the sequential checkbox on all files. I do not work with sequential images.

[Kevin-Monahan]

Hi,

It was one 1080p 4min clip with Keylight with crop to region applied.

A four-minute clip for compositing a keying shot seems rather long. That said, there are reports here on the forum of After Effects crashing with the Keylight effect applied.

• One user indicated setting the Pre-Blur parameter to 0 helped.
• Running the application as "Administrator" or repairing Adobe folder permissions (by renaming them) can also help.

Can you try those things?

Is this the warning you're getting? After Effects error: Keylight out of memory. (4) ( 25 :: 241 ) or just "After Effects has stopped working."

Let us know.

Additionally, on the umteenth time I called Adobe support, the operator had not even BASIC knowledge of AE and was insistently attempting to give me advise that even I knew was completely incorrect. Unbelievable.

That's pretty disturbing. I can look into that for you to see what's going on. When reaching support, ask for the "Video Queue" to make sure you are routed correctly. If you have any similar issues, send me a PM.

Thanks,
Kevin

[siliconmana]

A four-minute clip for compositing a keying shot seems rather long. That said, there are reports here on the forum of After Effects crashing with the Keylight effect applied.

You say 4 min of keying is long? In Sfx? I'm a video artist not an editor as such so much to learn still on a technical level.

The next work around that was on my bucket list was to edit the clip into shorter sections, say 1m or 30s, then stitch together after keying?

Initially I'd tweaked many settings including subsettings, in Keylight as I was following a Lynda.com tutorial on Keylight. It was my first green screen setup and missed some annoying shadows that I only saw later after importing. Keylight removed most though one persistent spot could only be removed using ultra-key in Pr, when I finally managed to render out of AE through AME. Consequently I'll be more careful in the future. Though somewhat relieved to know others have experienced similar issues! >.<

• One user indicated setting the Pre-Blur parameter to 0 helped.
• Running the application as "Administrator" or repairing Adobe folder permissions (by renaming them) can also help.

Can you try those things?

After collapsing in complete exhaustion and illness post event, I'm working up to going back in these two projects and see how much further I can push/workaround AE to achieve the final results I'd envisioned. As such, I'll look into these settings.

The Pre-blur parameter is in Keylight?

I'm running admin account, or do you mean right click .exe and run as admin that way?.

How can I repair Adobe folder perms and will that impact projects?

I guess the test will be whether the clip can be directly rendered out of AE, as the workaround was to render through AME eventually. Honestly, it was a blur in the end of trying one thing after another just to get it out of AE given it was a small though vital component of the project.

Is this the warning you're getting? After Effects error: Keylight out of memory. (4) ( 25 :: 241 ) or just "After Effects has stopped working."

Let us know.

I'll look into this. The logs were windows crash logs.

If you could tap my memory though, I believe AE has it's own crash logs? Where will I find them?

That's pretty disturbing. I can look into that for you to see what's going on. When reaching support, ask for the "Video Queue" to make sure you are routed correctly. If you have any similar issues, send me a PM.

Indeed. There should be records on my file of the contact with support. Otherwise I do have some chatlogs from live chat and possibly dates and times.

I'm reasonably sure all calls have been directed to the AE team, and this incident was after spending 8-10hrs on a previous fruitless live chat/remote session and two calls. Result: A report was sent to dev team. That's it. With a two day deadline for two clips! Nothing. I just had to wing it with time consuming workarounds which compromised the final outcomes of both projects.
On this occasion, again I was transferred to the AE team, that's why I was in such disbelief

Your offer to PM in case of future issues with support is  greatly appreciated!

These projects have made me aware that my knowledge of formats and codecs is embarrassingly outdated and wondered if you could provide links to best practice for importing and exporting? For instance, I'm a little confused about DNxHD, this is an Avid codec for Media Composer?  And seems to be also an .mxf extension, same as my Canon XF-100?

Most of my work is geared toward live video performance, so output formats generally used are either QT .dxv for Resolume or .264 for web or other live video applications.

[Kevin-Monahan]

Hi DianeJ,

You say 4 min of keying is long? In Sfx?

Most definitely. Most green screen shots only last a few seconds. That said, these times are a-changing.

If you have a need for such long shots like in a live performance and quality is not a huge deal, there are ways to get that same effect much easier as you shoot.

Have you ever checked out products like this? Product - Veescope Live: Chroma Key, Green Screen, Blue Screen, Vectorscope, Waveform Monitor,RGB Pa...

Might make your life a little simpler in the future.

It was my first green screen setup and missed some annoying shadows that I only saw later after importing. Keylight removed most though one persistent spot could only be removed using ultra-key in Pr, when I finally managed to render out of AE through AME. Consequently I'll be more careful in the future. Tho

You can often crop out these areas so you don't have to key them. Check that out.

The Pre-blur parameter is in Keylight?

Yes. Screen Pre-blur.

I'm running admin account, or do you mean right click .exe and run as admin that way?.

How can I repair Adobe folder perms and will that impact projects?

This should help with running After Effects as an administrator.

The easiest way to try new folder permissions is to rename the folder inside your Documents > Adobe folder to "Old Adobe." You will lose any preferences you set prior to renaming the folder. Other than that, you can always move older project files and such to this new folder if you desire.

I guess the test will be whether the clip can be directly rendered out of AE, as the workaround was to render through AME eventually. Honestly, it was a blur in the end of trying one thing after another just to get it out of AE given it was a small though vital component of the project.

Your export should be the same whether using AME or the Render Queue. You should be able to use the Render Queue with certain formats.

I'll look into this. The logs were windows crash logs.

If you upload those crash logs to dropbox or Creative Cloud (or what have you), I can forward them to the developers.

If you could tap my memory though, I believe AE has it's own crash logs? Where will I find them?

You can find those on Windows here.

Indeed. There should be records on my file of the contact with support.

I can take a look at the case notes and see if I can remedy any issues related to that agent.

These projects have made me aware that my knowledge of formats and codecs is embarrassingly outdated and wondered if you could provide links to best practice for importing and exporting? For instance, I'm a little confused about DNxHD, this is an Avid codec for Media Composer?  And seems to be also an .mxf extension, same as my Canon XF-100?

Most of my work is geared toward live video performance, so output formats generally used are either QT .dxv for Resolume or .264 for web or other live video applications.

Typically, you want to record and composite with high quality files like DNxHD, which you mentioned. You can also use Cineform with similar results. Once your editing and compositing is done, you can export for the web in the H.264 format.

Hope this info has been helpful. If you have further questions, please let us know. You can also PM me.

Thanks,
Kevin