Color in Photoshop and Lightroom is different than in Windows Explorer

[Awitmer]

Hello all!

I am having some trouble with Photoshop and Lightroom that I would like to have some help with. Please and thank you! I am using a dell laptop with the latest version of Windows 10 installed and I also use I1profiler to calibrate my display.

Ever since I calibrated my display the color of my pictures in both Photoshop and Lightroom is considerably different than when I view the picture in the windows photo app. I can see the biggest difference in skin tones which appear a lot more redder in Photoshop and Lightroom both. Does anybody have any ideas for me to try?

Thanks so much!

[Per Berntsen]

When you did the calibration, a monitor profile was created that accurately describes your display.

Photoshop and Lightroom use this profile in order to display correct colors.

Most other programs (like Windows Explorer) do not use the monitor profile, and displays photos without any correction.

IOW, Photoshop and Lightroom are right, Windows Explorer is wrong.

Windows 10 is known to install low quality, or even defective profiles through updates, so check that the profile you created is set as Default under Color management in Windows.

Press the Windows key+R, type colorcpl and hit Enter.

The dialog that opens will show you which profile is set as default. It should have (Default) after the profile name.

[Awitmer]

I just now checked and made sure that the profile I made is set to be the default profile and it is. Does this mean that I will need to go through all my 16,000+ pictures and re-edit the color to make it look right??

[Per Berntsen]

Lightroom and Camera Raw have problems with version 4 profiles, so to be on the safe side, recalibrate, and make sure that you are creating a version 2, matrix-based profile. See post #9 in this thread: Re: ACR and PS6 images aren't the same

And yes, I'm afraid you will have to re-edit your photos.

[marlon.foto]

I'm curious because I'm having the same issue. I recently sold my iMac and have been working on my PC. I bought myself a fancy BenQ monitor with the built-in calibration and everything. I love the way my photos look on my calibrated monitor, but then when I export them and view them on my 2nd monitor in Windows Photo Viewer or on Facebook they're more red. What should my workflow be? I want the final jpgs I deliver to my clients to look good on THEIR screens and Facebook pages and emails, etc... Anyone have any ideas?

[Per Berntsen]

marlon.foto  wrote

I want the final jpgs I deliver to my clients to look good on THEIR screens and Facebook pages and emails, etc...

The only things you can do is to work on a calibrated monitor, and export photos intended for screen viewing with the sRGB profile.

And you can tell your clients to calibrate their monitors, and only use color managed applications to view your work.

Apart form that, you have zero control over how your work will look on other people's monitors.

The Windows Photo viewer is in fact color managed, so the reason your photos do not look right on your 2nd monitor is probably that it isn't calibrated. If you view your work in a non-color managed application on a wide gamut monitor (I have a feeling that your BenQ might be wide gamut), you will see quite a dramatic increase in color saturation - try opening a jpg in Internet Explorer or Paint.

So on a wide gamut monitor it's an absolute must to use only color managed applications to view images.

[marlon.foto]

Okay, I'll try be a bit more clear! I'm talking about making my jpegs look like they do in LR on my expensive, wide-gamut BenQ monitor.

When I was editing on my iMac the .jpegs exported from Lightroom looked like they did as I was editing them.

Here's what's happening with me:

1. Edit photos in LR on my BenQ; everything looks great!

2. Export .jpgs in sRGB colour space

3. Open .jpgs on calibrated monitor in Windows viewer = red photos

4. Open .jpgs on 2nd sRGB monitor in Windows viewr = red photos

5. Upload .jpgs to Facebook page = red on BenQ monitor, red on Asus monitor

Essentially the photos only look good originally in LR on my BenQ monitor, or if I right-click and open them up in Photoshop on my BenQ monitor. As soon as a drag the programs to my 2nd monitor they become redder and more like how they appear (on both monitors) outside of the Adobe programs.

I would like my exported .jpgs to have consistent colour with how they're edited.

I can make a video on my iPhone and upload it to Dropbox if I'm not being clear!

[Per Berntsen]

marlon.foto wrote:

1. Edit photos in LR on my BenQ; everything looks great!

2. Export .jpgs in sRGB colour space

3. Open .jpgs on calibrated monitor in Windows viewer = red photos

4. Open .jpgs on 2nd sRGB monitor in Windows viewr = red photos

5. Upload .jpgs to Facebook page = red on BenQ monitor, red on Asus monitor

1. OK
2. OK
3. The Windows Photo viewer is color managed, and should display correctly. If you mean the Photos app (Windows 10), it is not color managed, and will display over saturated.
4. So the second monitor is not wide gamut? Is it calibrated?
5. What web browser are you using? Internet Explorer and Edge are not color managed, and for all I know, Facebook might strip out the profile. (I'm not on Facebook, so I don't know) The only web browser that will display untagged images (with no color profile) correctly is Firefox, with Color management mode set to 1. It will assign sRGB to untagged images.

[marlon.foto]

Hey Pat, just wanted to say I appreciate you bearing with me here and all the advice!

I'm wondering if the calibration software for the BenQ just doesn't work properly. My ASUS monitor is a gaming monitor, definitely not wide gamut. I posted a few wedding photo previews for the bride & groom from last week's wedding. I just dragged Lightroom to my ASUS which was set on a default sRGB mode and I got more consistent files from the exports. So when I edited the photos on my ASUS, exported them, and then viewed the jpegs on my ASUS & BenQ in the Windows Viewer, or on Firefox they looked a lot truer than when I used LR on my BenQ and the resulting jpegs were too red.

[Per Berntsen]

I'm wondering if the calibration software for the BenQ just doesn't work properly.

I'm not familiar with BenQ monitors, but It seems that they come with software calibration, that can be used on its own, but that also supports hardware calibrators. If you haven't used a hardware calibrator for the calibration, I would strongly advise you to do so.

[Abambo]

Possibilities depend on the monitor obviously as BenQ commercializes more models than one.

[marlon.foto]

Per Berntsen​ Abambo​

The monitor is an SW2700PT and I use my Spyder4 sensor, but it has its own software called Palette Master. I'm just having trouble getting a sense of colour management in Windows since I'd been a Mac user for over a decade for my professional uses. I only used PC's for gaming so never much paid attention to my monitors.

Yesterday I was just making some quick edits for wedding previews and I just made my BenQ use a standard sRGB profile and put my monitor on sRGB mode and then when I uploaded the photos they seemed more consistent with what was on my screen, my iPhone, and my wife's laptop screen. I know not everyone's screens are calibrated, but there must be some reason the calibrated BenQ was causing me to compensate someway by make my photos over-red so when they were exported to jpeg everything was skewed.

The problem is THIS morning I'm editing photos of food packages for a company and everything needs to be perfect in CMYK, and I don't know what to do! Luckily I used my colour chart with the shoot, so I can just use the ol' info panel in PS to make sure everything matches up, but as a professional photographer I'd like to be able to trust my own eyes!!!

[Per Berntsen]

I found some screenshots of Palette Master on this page BenQ SW2700PT Monitor Review

Lightroom doesn't like version 4 profiles - if you calibrated with v.4, recalibrate using version 2 instead, and see if that makes any difference. Also make sure that Profile Type is set to Matrix.

[marlon.foto]

Yeah the first thing I did when I got the monitor was Google that stuff. So I've always had it in V2/matrix! I think I'll have to call BenQ and start dealing with them lol.

[Per Berntsen]

And you haven't accidentally set the color mode to something else than Calibration in the on-screen menu?

[marlon.foto]

Yeah I have Calibration 1/Adobe RGB/sRGB on my hotkeys!

[Per Berntsen]

Let's try a little experiment.

Copy the image below to your computer, then import it in Lightroom, or open it in Photoshop (Since you haven't said anything about Photoshop, I assume that images display the same in PS and LR, in which case you can just open it in PS)

View the image at 100%, then take a screenshot of it. (and close it, to avoid confusion later)

Open the screenshot in Photoshop, go to Edit > Assign Profile, and choose the monitor profile.

Then go to Edit > Convert to Profile, convert to sRGB, save the screenshot, then post it here.

This should show if there are any differences between your screen and mine, and at least give an indication as to whether there is something wrong with your monitor profile.

I have a calibrated Eizo, and I'm pretty certain that the profile is correct, and that images display correctly.

[marlon.foto]

Per Berntsen​ First off I'd just like to thank you again for keeping up with me here. You're a saint!

Ok, so I followed your steps, and not much was changing as I was going through the profiles. However, the photo looks dull on my BenQ but fine on my ASUS (the gaming monitor) I'll post the screenshot for you:

Dropbox - 2017-07-01.png

Here is the image as it appears on each monitor:

BenQ: Dropbox - 2017-07-01 (1).png

ASUS: Dropbox - 2017-07-01 (2).png

So you can see the exact same image appears different on both monitors. The BenQ is calibrated using Palette Master software, and there is also an ICC profile associated with the BenQ in Windows' color management setting (do I need the ICC profile if the calibration is saved on the monitor itself?)

So my problem is whenever I'm editing photos on my BenQ, I'm oversaturating them, so when they appear on other monitors they're all messed up!

[Per Berntsen]

Yes, I see the problem, the BenQ looks very dull.

However, I forgot to tell you to embed the sRGB profile when you saved the screenshots. Or maybe you did, and the profile was stripped by Dropbox. So what I'm seeing at my end might not be entirely true.

So I have to ask you to do this again, with the profile embedded, and just post the screenshots here, rather than using Dropbox.

And you don't need to include the entire desktop, the Photoshop window is enough.

When you assign the monitor profile, you have to use Benq profile for the Benq monitor, and the Asus profile for the Asus monitor.

If in doubt, open the Color Management dialog to identify the profiles.

And yes, you need the ICC profile, color management depends on it.

[D Fosse]

I lost completely track here. First the problem was oversaturation, and now it's undersaturation...which is it?

I think we need to recapitulate for a bit, just so we're all on the same page.

• disregard non-color managed viewers and browsers, such as Windows "Photos". Only Lightroom and Photoshop can be trusted here. This is especially evident with a wide gamut monitor, which will never display correctly without full color management.
• the monitor profile needs to be an accurate description of the monitor's actual response. If you change any setting in the monitor, the profile is invalidated and you need to make a new one.
• Lightroom and Photoshop load the monitor profile (from the OS) at startup. If you change profile, the apps need to be relaunched to update the profile.
• and just so you don't get confused by the terms here - the profile is not the same as the calibration. The profile doesn't adjust anything, it's just a description, used in a standard profile conversion. It works at a much higher precision level than the calibration.
• the only way the BenQ can undersaturate, is if it is set to the sRGB preset, but the profile describes wide gamut behavior. If this is the case - double-check your settings.

Just wanted to clarify a few things, not to interfere in the proceedings

[marlon.foto]

Hey D, my apologies if I'm not being clear.

It was just a matter of photos looking screwy if they were edited on my BenQ SW2700PT and then converted to sRGB through Lightroom; the resulting jpegs were looking too red and saturated once I was viewing them on _any_ other screen (my Surface, my ASUS screen, my wife's MacBook, my iPad, my iPhone etc...)

I was just looking for some colour management advice since I've only been using a Windows machine for Adobe programs for a week. This is was never an issue on my iMac where I would just calibrate every week with my Spyder4 and then jpegs would end up how I wanted them. I've been a professional photographer for 10 years now.

I know that profiles are loaded on start up. I know that ICC profiles are different than a calibration.

I've been searching on Google all week and pouring through many reviews. I found a blog where the reviewer says he made 2 different calibrations: 1 to use in sRGB and one for Adobe RGB, because the BenQ monitor allows you to switch through both.

I just want to nail down a workflow and I honestly think I'll just be calling BenQ on Monday and asking a few questions. I just want to know when I calibrate should I start from the sRGB mode on the monitor, or the Adobe RGB? When the calibration ends and turns it into an ICC profile do I have to change that AS WELL as the monitor setting (ADOBE/sRGB) when I want to work in either space? If LR uses ProPhoto RGB should I be editing using an sRGB preset on my monitor because that's my final output? What workflow should I use if I'm going to be editing with CMYK as the final destination or Adobe RGB? etc...

[D Fosse]

marlon.foto  wrote

I just want to know when I calibrate should I start from the sRGB mode on the monitor, or the Adobe RGB? When the calibration ends and turns it into an ICC profile do I have to change that AS WELL as the monitor setting (ADOBE/sRGB) when I want to work in either space?

It's pretty simple once the basic concept is understood. The key to the whole thing is what I wrote above:

• the monitor profile needs to be an accurate description of the monitor's actual response.

Normally you wouldn't use any particular preset on the monitor - you just want it's native, full capabilities. In that case you need to use an icc profile that describes this response.

You can also set the monitor to the sRGB preset, for use with non-color managed applications. That means the monitor's behavior is changed, and the "native" profile is no longer valid. So you make a new profile that describes this "sRGB-ish" behavior.

You can manage these profiles manually, in Windows' Color Management dialog. Some more advanced calibrators will take care of this so that when you make this change of presets in the calibration software, both the calibration and the profile are replaced at the same time (as they have to be).

In either case, Lightroom/Photoshop must be relaunched, so that the new profile is loaded at application startup.

[Per Berntsen]

Thanks for coming to the rescue, Dag.

the only way the BenQ can undersaturate, is if it is set to the sRGB preset, but the profile describes wide gamut behavior. If this is the case - double-check your settings.

marlon.foto has stated that the color mode is set to Calibration in the on-screen controls, and the screenshots (if they are to be trusted without an embedded profile) show significant desaturation. So what else could be going on?

He also asks a question that I'm wondering about - what preset should the monitor be set to when doing the calibration?

The way I read your answer it might not matter, could you clarify? It seems that this particular monitor has to be using one of the presets.

Some years ago, the advice often given was to set the monitor to factory default, there was usually an option for this in the on-screen controls.

marlon.foto - have you tried setting the monitor profile to Adobe RGB, that is in Windows Color management, not on the monitor.

If that fixes the issue, I'd say something is wrong the profile you created when calibratinf.

[marlon.foto]

Hey Pat, I honestly believe the problem is something having to do with the calibration being built-in & also applied through Windows. I have a hunch that the monitor is compensating through hardware, and then the ICC profile is making the same corrections through Lightroom so what I'm seeing in a final version isn't accurate.

I called BenQ this morning (very friendly) and they have a specialist who deals with all the calibration issues. He's only back on Wednesday due to holidays in the US but I will follow up after our conversation if you're interested!

For now I just have the monitor on its own sRGB mode (the factory calibration was OK) and I've been able to just get work out with that. I always take a shot of a grey card, and can edit skin tones with the info pane in CMYK so that'll hold me over until I get some assistance!