How do change colour density in a print file?

[sara_keirw66224227]

Hi All

My printer keeps rejecting my print file as they tell me there is too much colour in the images for uncoated paper. The colour profile is uncoatedfogra29 and they ask for colour density of 280% but apparently the images are 290%-300% can anyone help me with that needs changing? is it the photoshop images or can I do it in the print file? I am unfortunately not a graphic designer so dont' really know what to do.

Best Regards Sara Keir Wright

[Derek Cross]

Are you exporting to PDF/X-4?

[sara_keirw66224227]

I don't think so. The person that made the print file I think just used the High Quality print option in in design. But I am not sure.

[sara_keirw66224227]

I have added an image of one of the image infor. Could this be the problem?

[Derek Cross]

The High Quality Print setting is for desk-top inkjet printers.

I see you're images are already in CMYK, it's best to work in RGB and let the software do the conversion.

Also the Effective resolution of your image is much higher than it needs to be.

Do you have a special reason for printing your images on uncoated stock?

[sara_keirw66224227]

OK let me check how it was saved.

I can't see it in the info so have asked the graphic designer. Will get back to you when I know. But would that be the problem or is it that the original CMYK images have too high a colour density?

[sara_keirw66224227]

Yes It's exported to High Quality print, then in colour conversion its converted to uncoatedfogra29 as we were told to do by the printer.

Now they say:

"Files are checked, but they are not OK for printing.

There are still too much color for uncoated paper. It has to be maximum 280% for uncoated paper. At the moment some the most darkest pictures are with color content 290-300%."

I wonder how I fix that?

[Frans v.d. Geest]

That is because CMYK Images are not converted to a profile as standard, just RGB Images are! You could do a CMYK to CMYK but that messes up K text. Use Photoshop to convert the image and update it in InDesign or use Acrobat Pro on the PDF.

[sara_keirw66224227]

My problem is that the photographer just send me So I change the RGB images? but how, where do I see the density?

[rob day]

My problem is that the photographer just send me So I change the RGB images? but how, where do I see the density?

It sounds like the printer doesn't understand how profiles and total ink limits work. The Uncoated FOGRA29 (2004) profile allows 298% total ink when an RGB image is converted to that profile. If the 280% ink limit really is critical for their drying time, they'll have to recommend another profile–Uncoated GRACol 2013 has a 280% ink limit. Keep in mind that CMYK profiles do more than enforce ink limits—they also affect color appearance.

Both InDesign (Separation Preview) and Photoshop (Info) will let you read Total Ink densities. If you sample an RGB (0,0,0) swatch you can find the total ink for the document's assigned profile. So here I have UnCoated FOGRA29 assigned to my document and Separation Preview shows me the output CMYK values assuming the destination is Uncoated FOGRA29.

InDesign's Sep Preview also has Ink Limit which will highlight total ink violations for images that have been converted to CMYK

[sara_keirw66224227]

Hi Rob

But Can I change the colour density in inDesign? Or What do I do? The printer is not replying.

[Derek Cross]

Maybe consider getting another printer.

[Danny Whitehead.]

Well, yeah.

Taken literally, their specs are impossible to adhere to, as the recommendation of the FOGRA29 profile directly contradicts their requirement for 280% TAC. If they're doing a reasonable volume of four colour work on uncoated, I'd expect they face this issue all the time. If they don't have a FOGRA29 280% TAC profile to supply, they can either fix the specs, fix the files using a device link conversion, run the job with 300% TAC or lose the job.

[Danny Whitehead.]

You can't change the TAC in InDesign without a colour profile that specifies it.

[rob day]

But Can I change the colour density in inDesign? Or What do I do? The printer is not replying.

I run into printers who are very good on press but don't necessarily have a complete grip on color management and conversions.

If you want to stay with the printer and they are going to reject the 300% total ink, you could make the conversion with another uncoated profile and then assign FOGRA29. In that case you should not cut corners and insist on a printed contract proof.

So here's an example using Uncoated GRAcol to make the conversion from the original RGB images:

I can then assign the FOGRA29 profile which will give me a preview of the color appearance without changing the CMYK values. Because the uncoated profiles are similar the shift in color appearance is small:

If I place the image in my InDesign document with the FOGRA29 profile assigned there are no ink limit violations.

[sara_keirw66224227]

Thanks Rob, I'll try and see if it then works.

[sara_keirw66224227]

The RGB's were converted to the Uncoated Fogra29 profile and then uploaded in InDesign. I think it's the original iamges that are a problem, but I am not sure.

[Danny Whitehead.]

When you convert to CMYK, the ink limit (also known as Total Area Coverage/TAC, and 'density' by your printer) is determined by the CMYK profile you use.

Did the printer ask you to use the Uncoated FOGRA29 profile? The FOGRA29 profile that ships with Adobe CC has a 300% ink limit. If they need 280%, tell them this and ask them to supply with you a profile with their required ink limit.

[sara_keirw66224227]

Hi Danny, Yes the printer said to use Uncoated FOGRA29. I will just forward them what you said and await a new colour profile. I suspect they use an old system.