18 Replies Latest reply on Jun 26, 2013 3:12 AM by SiliconPixel

    Responsiveness of CTI with heavy effects

    SiliconPixel Level 1

      Before I post a feature request, I just wanted to check others also see this behaviour:

       

      If I have a number of non-realtime effects applied to clips in a project i.e. Magic Bullet looks combined with color correction filters etc, I suffer from a laggy CTI. Now that's not too much of a problem and is to be expected. However, when you're navigating around and pushing space to play, this causes a problem most times because the playback will start at the previously rendered frame not the new selected frame.

       

      So, if I position the CTI at a new place on the timeline and press play before Premiere has rendered the frame, playback will happen from the previous location. Very frustrating and slows down the edit.

       

      Seems to me, what should happen is that Premiere should remember the new CTI location and start playback from there - as you might expect.

       

      I wonder if it's the thrird party effects that are breaking the playback position?

       

      Anyone else seen this?

       

      Paul.

        • 1. Re: Responsiveness of CTI with heavy effects
          Jim_Simon Level 8

          Not here.

           

          What kind of media are you using?

          • 2. Re: Responsiveness of CTI with heavy effects
            SiliconPixel Level 1

            I have seen this several times before in earlier versions over the years.

             

            I'm using XDCAM EX 1080 25P from a Sony PMW350.

             

            Also have a mix of Colorista II and MBLooks on some shots.

             

            Paul.

            • 3. Re: Responsiveness of CTI with heavy effects
              lasvideo Level 4

              This seems a moot point if you just render those clips that need it. Then your timeline will play just fine.

              • 4. Re: Responsiveness of CTI with heavy effects
                SiliconPixel Level 1

                Lasvideo - no I don't think you understand - maybe I didn't explain it fully.

                 

                This happens whilst editing and moving the CTI around the timeline, yes you can render and that probably will help but as soon as you make any changes or edits, the problem will continue to occur. You can't render after every edit and move of the CTI. It's not just a playback problem but fundamental to the edit process.

                 

                It's not just the clips with the third party effects on either that cause the problem.

                • 5. Re: Responsiveness of CTI with heavy effects
                  lasvideo Level 4

                  Yes, I guess I dont understand

                   

                  When I apply enough effects to a clip so that it cant playback I immediately render it.  If I shorted / trim a clip 3 seconds before that rendered clip it should have no effect other then shortening the timeline.

                   

                  My approach..render all clips that need rendering to playback in real time.

                   

                  Sorry if Im not comprehending your issue correctly.

                  • 6. Re: Responsiveness of CTI with heavy effects
                    SiliconPixel Level 1

                    This is driving me mad - happens even on timelines with no effects at all - if you're speedily working through some edits, the CTI will keep on jumping to the start of the sequence Frustrating!

                    • 7. Re: Responsiveness of CTI with heavy effects
                      Greg Baber Adobe Employee

                      Is the CTI sluggish when working on clips with no effects on them as well?

                       

                      Is the CTI responsive, but when you click on play it goes back to start of the sequence?

                      • 8. Re: Responsiveness of CTI with heavy effects
                        SiliconPixel Level 1

                        Hi Greg,

                         

                        The CTI is super smooth and playback performance is excellent. The issue is that during a fast paced session, if I use the mouse or keyboard shortcut (mainly with shortcut) to move to a new clip on the timeline and Immediately press space bar to play, the CTI jumps to the start of the sequence and starts playing.

                         

                        It's as though premiere needs a few moments to initialise the clip and if you play before this has happened, it plays from the start.

                         

                        If I move to the new clip (like an edit point or in/out point) and give it a few moments (maybe half a second or more), playback is fine.

                         

                        Footage is Sony XDCAM 1080P mp4 files from a PMW-350 in the relevant xdcam sequence.

                         

                        I can post a screen capture if that helps?

                         

                        Many thanks,

                         

                        Paul.

                        • 9. Re: Responsiveness of CTI with heavy effects
                          SiliconPixel Level 1

                          Hi,

                           

                          I've not updated or chased this issue for a long time but it's still happening and still causing a lot of grief.

                           

                          As an update, the issue actually happens with no effects at all applied to the clips - so just raw XDCAM footage on the timeline. When moving the CTI I always have to give it a second or so before hitting the space bar for playback, otherwise the CTI jumps to the beginning of the sequence - how frustrating is that!

                           

                          Has anyone else seen this issue?

                           

                          Maybe I need to escalate it - or wait to see if CC version of Premiere fixes it?

                          • 10. Re: Responsiveness of CTI with heavy effects
                            SiliconPixel Level 1

                            I've just done a bit more testing - on another machine...

                             

                            The problem also happens on this other machine although not as much as the time between jumping to the new clip and pressing space bar for playback is much shorter if it's to fail and reset to the beginning of the sequence.

                             

                            I tested this by simply loading some XDCAM footage and randomly placing a number of clips onto the timeline. I then use shift-up or shift-down to jump to the next edit on the timeline and IMMEDIATELY press space to play - if this is quick enough, the CTI will jump to the beginning of the sequence. This does happen very regularly when I'm editing as I use a shuttle pro 2 with buttons assigned to next and previous edit, so the time between jumping to the edit and pressing play is pretty short - as you would normally do during edit.

                             

                            Not sure if this is also the case for non-XDCAM footage though.

                             

                            I'm still thinking this is because PPRO hasn't initialised the clip for playback or queued it up for playback and rather than waiting for it to be ready,  it resets to the start of the sequence?

                            • 11. Re: Responsiveness of CTI with heavy effects
                              Richard M Knight Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                              I have a similar problem with EX clips, if I press play quickly after moving the CTI the yellow 'dropping frame' lights and the playback stutters, if I give it a second or two the green 'frame not dropped' indicator lights and playback is fine.

                              • 12. Re: Responsiveness of CTI with heavy effects
                                jamesp2 Level 1

                                What you describe, or similar behavior, occurs with AVC-intra and AVCHD footage as well, with or without fx applied -- move rapidly through the timeline, cut by cut, with the up or down key, and there's a lag, before PPro is able to display and play the correct frame, though I haven't noticed reversion to the begining of the T-L.

                                 

                                The only instaneous playback/update seen so far is with standard definition DV footage, though if you work your way through an AVCHD timeline, cut by cut, it will become more responsive once all the ground is covered-- some sort of buffering, probably.  How long it lasts is another question....

                                • 13. Re: Responsiveness of CTI with heavy effects
                                  SiliconPixel Level 1

                                  Thanks Jamesp2,

                                   

                                  Seems like it's a design flaw in playback then - on the face of it, it would seem a relatively easy thing to fix but who knows. Lets see how the new version responds - I kind of think it'll be the same though.

                                  • 14. Re: Responsiveness of CTI with heavy effects
                                    Jim_Simon Level 8

                                    When I first posted in this thread I was using DV.  Since then I've upgraded to the GH2 and am shooting hacked AVCHD.  I do see the same kind of sluggishness, especially with GOP footage.  Sometimes I have to wait up to 5 seconds for PP to 'catch up' with a sudden movement of the CTI.  Just part of doing business with such compressed footage, I guess.

                                     

                                    I do notice a significant improvement using I-frame footage, though.

                                    • 15. Re: Responsiveness of CTI with heavy effects
                                      SiliconPixel Level 1

                                      Do you see the CTI reset to the start of the sequence though?

                                       

                                      a slight lag in playback I could accept if the CTI stayed in place but when the CTI jumps back to the start of the sequence and I then have to work out where I was is a huge PITA

                                      • 16. Re: Responsiveness of CTI with heavy effects
                                        Jim_Simon Level 8

                                        I don't see the CTI jump, no.  PP just remains unresponsive while it works to catch up.

                                        • 17. Re: Responsiveness of CTI with heavy effects
                                          SiliconPixel Level 1

                                          Ah, maybe a slightly different issue then - generally my system editing XDCAM EX footage etc is super quick - just this issue that's been bugging me over the last year or so. But it's certainly a much faster workflow and significantly more robust than I have previously been used to over the last 15-20 years or so with various Matrox edit cards etc

                                          • 18. Re: Responsiveness of CTI with heavy effects
                                            SiliconPixel Level 1

                                            Just solved it! Hurrah!!!

                                             

                                            It turned out that it was the configuration of my Shuttle Pro 2 - I was mapping the keyboard shortcuts SHIFT-UP and SHIFT-DOWN to two buttons. But there is an option in the shuttle config called smart release - I disabled this for both buttons and it now works as expected. Hurrah!

                                             

                                            I'll post this as a separate thread in case anyone else experiences it too.