9 Replies Latest reply on Jun 28, 2012 3:25 AM by Colin Flashman

    [CS5.5] issue with stacking order on spreads when pages change

    Colin Flashman Adobe Community Professional

      Have recently had a situation where items on a right hand page have "disappeared" behind an item placed over the reader's spread in a layout using facing pages.

       

      For example,

       

      Picture 2.png

      this spread has 3 elements: an item of type per page, both brought to front; and a green background sent to back. all fine so far.

       

      i have then deleted the last two pages from the file... still going great guns...

       

      Picture 5.png

      i then delete the first two pages from the file... then the preverbial hits the fan.

       

      Picture 6.png

      the type on page two is gone! oh no!!! the reality is that the type is now BEHIND the green background.

       

      I am aware that had the green background been split in two at the spine, the result would be this:

       

      Picture 8.png

      but it's too late now.

       

      has anyone else experienced this phenomenon and is it safe to call this a "bug"? anyone wanting to attempt the following steps can download a PDF containing the indesign file as an attachment within the pdf from this url: http://colecandoo.files.wordpress.com/2012/06/spreadfail.pdf

       

      colly

        • 1. Re: [CS5.5] issue with stacking order on spreads when pages change
          Michael Gianino Level 4

          Do you want the green background on all pages? If so, putting it on the master page (and not releasing it on the document pages) will prevent your problem from happening.

          • 2. Re: [CS5.5] issue with stacking order on spreads when pages change
            Laubender Adobe Community Professional & MVP

            @Colly – FWIW it's already present in InDesign CS3. Never noticed before, because I used master pages or separate layers for background and text frames.
            I'd call it a bug, because removing pages should not mess up the stacking order of page items on different pages.

             

            Uwe

            1 person found this helpful
            • 3. Re: [CS5.5] issue with stacking order on spreads when pages change
              Colin Flashman Adobe Community Professional

              Thank you Michael.

               

              The green is an example only. I agree that your master pages answer; or putting the background on a separate layer - would solve the situation if this was something as plain as a colour background, but in this case the green is there as an example only.

               

              This was a real-world incident where the cross-over was an illustration and, as a result of removing the first two pages, type above the cross-over on the right hand page slipped behind the cross-over.

               

              I have tried changing the numbering options at the start of the document (e.g. make pages 1 & 2 to be i & ii; and then make what was page 3 to become page 1) and this still fails.

               

              Have also realised my first attached pdf didn't contain a working indesign file . try this link: http://colecandoo.files.wordpress.com/2012/06/spreadfail1.pdf

              • 4. Re: [CS5.5] issue with stacking order on spreads when pages change
                Laubender Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                @Colly – and the bug is hitting always if you remove a even number of pages starting at page 1. If you remove an odd number of pages, the stacking order is preserved. If you remove 1 page two times in a row starting at page 1, the bug hits again.

                 

                Uwe

                1 person found this helpful
                • 5. Re: [CS5.5] issue with stacking order on spreads when pages change
                  Michael Gianino Level 4

                  Although the green block is, for practical purposes, on both pages, to InDesign, it's really only assigned to the left page of the spread. For example, if you start with this:

                  ss1.jpg

                  …which has a green box in the background, spanning both pages of each spread, and yellow boxes on odd pages and magenta boxes on odds…

                   

                  …and you delete page one, you get this:

                  ss2.jpg

                  …where the yellow and magenta boxes have switched sides, but notice that the green box that had been across both pages is now only on the odd pages. That's because the green boxes were actually assigned to the even pages, which have now shifted to become the odd pages, and the box stayed with it's page.

                   

                  Now, here's what happens when you delete page 2:

                  ss3.jpg

                  Except for page one, which hasn't moved or changed, the screen shots from removing page one and page two look the same, because I only removed one page at a time. That caused the pages to switch sides.

                   

                  Now, here's what happens when you remove pages one and two at the same time:

                  ss4.jpg

                  This is what you are getting. As best as I can guess, the reason that the green box is above the yellow boxes is because the left page of the spread is higher in stacking order than the page on the right. My guess is that the stacking order of the objects on each page is reaffirmed when pages are deleted. And in this case, I don't think it matters whether you delete them one at a time or two. Here is a screen shot of what it looks like when I delete page one, then delete page two right afterward (actually, since page two had become page one, I had to delete page one the second time to delete the original page two, but you know what I mean):

                  ss5.jpg

                  This screenshot looks the same as the previous, even though this one had two pages deleted one at a time, and the previous one had two pages deleted together. I can't say whether this is a bug or not, but I assume that the engineers at Adobe didn't choose this behavior on purpose. It's probably a side-effect of some other choice that probably makes perfect sense.

                   

                  I think the answer is to either  place objects that span a spread on the master, or to use layers if the master option isn't practical for the job you are doing.

                  • 6. Re: [CS5.5] issue with stacking order on spreads when pages change
                    Colin Flashman Adobe Community Professional

                    Thank you both Michael and Uwe.

                     

                    This is the first time I've encountered an issue like this. Can only hope that this forum thread serves as a warning to others in similar circumstances.

                     

                    Will also report it as a bug. Whether it's confirmed as a bug or not is another issue.

                     

                    Again, many thanks

                     

                    Colly

                    • 7. Re: [CS5.5] issue with stacking order on spreads when pages change
                      Laubender Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                      I think the answer is to either  place objects that span a spread on document pages on the master, or to use layers if the master option isn't practical for the job you are doing.

                       

                      @Michael – this is certainly true. But if we get a document from a customer or a colleague to work on, we could run into problems with that bug.

                       

                      Uwe

                      • 8. Re: [CS5.5] issue with stacking order on spreads when pages change
                        Laubender Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                        @Colly – I found something like a workaround, something you could do that the bug is not hitting:

                         

                        Before removing the pages, uncheck "Allow Selected Spread to Shuffle", so that all spreads in the pages panel get [] like that:

                         

                        [1]
                        [2-3]
                        [4-5]

                         

                        That should prevent the reordering of the page items on a spread.

                         

                        In your case [2-3] (spread 2 of your doc) should do!

                         

                        Uwe

                        1 person found this helpful
                        • 9. Re: [CS5.5] issue with stacking order on spreads when pages change
                          Colin Flashman Adobe Community Professional

                          @Uwe

                           

                          I like this workaround! Just need a time machine to go back a week ago to when I had the original file open!!!

                           

                          Nevertheless, bug reported to Adobe.