8 Replies Latest reply on Jul 7, 2012 7:35 PM by the_wine_snob

    Questions about 1080p60 .m2ts

    whsprague Level 4

      I’ve been lurking here for a while, but don’t think I’ve posted anything.  I’m new to video and been studying how to make PE10 work on lynda.com.

       

      I have a Sony HX9V and Panasonic SDT750 cameras that take AVCHD footage, including an option for 1080p60. I am using Premier Elements 10 on a Toshiba Satellite laptop with an i5 processor and 8GB of ram.  There is not a video card and only one slow HDD.

       

      I’ve scanned and read here that 1080p60 is not supported by Adobe in PE10 and it seems troublesome for many.   Yet for me, it seems to works fine.  I use one of the 1080i30 or 1080p30 project presets. Using “Get Media”, and selecting a known 1080p60 file, then checking the thumbnail with a right click and “Properties” confirms it is in fact 1080p60 and an .m2ts file. 

       

      When “Sharing” (rendering) I select Share>Computer>Presets>select MP4 H264 1080p30>Advanced>Frame Rate and both 59.94 and 60 are offered.  The output file is not a .m2ts but is an .mp4.  If done on a single clip, the new file is a little larger than the original and I think that is because of the default rendering bitrate is a little higher than the original.  Both files play fine and are indistinguishable to my eye on a 55” TV using a media player.

       

      First, am I correct that the project presets only control the rendering for work in progress and that the final render reads the source file directly and then encodes to the selected output?  Or, does the project preset effect how the final render works?

       

      Second, If 1080p60 .m2ts is not supported why does it seem to work so well?  What am I missing?  Or, what should I be sharing with others that want to edit 1080p60 .m2ts file.

       

      Thanks.

       

      Bill

        • 1. Re: Questions about 1080p60 .m2ts
          the_wine_snob Level 9

          Bill,

           

          First, am I correct that the project presets only control the rendering for work in progress and that the final render reads the source file directly and then encodes to the selected output?  Or, does the project preset effect how the final render works?

          You are basically correct, that the Project Preset is for the editing and playback of the Timeline. Export/Sharing does read the data from the Source Files, to produce the output file, but "filters" that data, based on what appears on the Timeline (essentially telling the program which Frames to include, and how to handle them), so there IS some interaction, but it will be the Share Settings, that really affect the output file. Still, there is some interaction, so the choice of a Project Preset is mostly for editing ease, smoothness, and then playback.

           

          Good luck, and glad to hear that you are having good luck with the 1080p material.

           

          Hunt

          • 2. Re: Questions about 1080p60 .m2ts
            whsprague Level 4

            Thank you Bill for your reply.  I have looked in the Adobe help files and other training resources and it does not explain the relationship between project presets and the share settings as well as you did. 

             

            But, I'm still confused why people like Steve Grisetti would say, "....If you plan to edit your video in Premiere Elements, you must shoot in 1080i and have your project set up for it."  Or, John T Smith when he wrote, " ... I didn't save a link, but I "think" I've read in the past that 1080/60p does not work well with PreElements."

             

            I've been shooting in 1080p60 for months.  I more frequenly render with a YouTube or Vimeo preset, but can just as easily select a p30 setting and change the frame rate to a p60 setting that is provided by PreElements.  Why does Adobe provide the setting if it is not supported?

             

            Bill

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            • 3. Re: Questions about 1080p60 .m2ts
              John T Smith Adobe Community Professional & MVP

              >still confused

               

              1080p http://forums.adobe.com/thread/995191 some work, some do not

              -Not in PreElements http://forums.adobe.com/thread/1017428

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              • 4. Re: Questions about 1080p60 .m2ts
                whsprague Level 4

                Thanks for replying John. 

                 

                I've been reading everything I can find online this morning.  In one place, I learned that the project preset of AVCHD Lite 720p60 works well for 1080p60 video because the red line above the timeline does not show up like it did with the other settings I've used.  I tried it and the playback window flows smoothly.   That will save me some time!

                 

                With all due respect to those of you that have commited so many hours posting here, I think PE10 functions fine with 1080p.  My "new' project preset demonstrates the ability of PE10 to preview the work on the timeline.  The 59.94 and 60 selections for rendering are put there by Adobe for a reason and, because it's there, by definition it is "supported".

                 

                The only place that "support" seems limited might be in documentation.  I have failed to find it written in one spot that there are two easy steps to 1080p60 success.  Step one is to pick the above preset and step two is selecting a frame rate offered by Adobe in a drop down menu. 

                 

                The longest video I made in PE10 with 1080p60 source files was about 20 minutes.  I split it into two parts for YouTube, made some DVDs and a file for my media player and computer.  All went without any trouble.

                 

                My computer is an ordinary 2nd generation Intle i5 laptop with nothing special.  Perhaps the issues that come up for others may be computer related.  But, it is not PE10 limitations.

                 

                I have to admit that I have become a PE10 "fanboy" because of it's wonderful set of features that I'm gradually learning.  I think suggesting that PE10 is unusable for people that own any of the many newer 1080p cameras and camcorders only drives them to other NLE products.  In my experience, that seems unnecessary. 

                 

                Bill

                • 5. Re: Questions about 1080p60 .m2ts
                  John T Smith Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                  >In my experience

                   

                  OK... in YOUR experience 1080p works... others do not have the same result

                   

                  In #2 in the 1017428 link I posted, Steve Grisetti agreed that 1080p does not work... and he very literally wrote the book

                   

                  http://www.amazon.com/Muvipix-com-Guide-Premiere-Elements-Version/dp/1466286377

                   

                  So... my GUESS is that PE10 does not officially support 1080p, but "some" people get it to work

                  • 6. Re: Questions about 1080p60 .m2ts
                    whsprague Level 4

                    "So... my GUESS is that PE10 does not officially support 1080p, but "some" people get it to work"

                     

                    I do not mean to offend you or Steve.  I have read lots of posts from you, Steve, Bill Hunt and others.  A great deal of that reading these last months have contributed to learning my new video editing hobby.  And, thank you for your gift to me and others.

                     

                    I'm not trying to take away from that positive experience.  Instead, I am trying to suggest a function that might be less trouble than thought.

                     

                    1080p60/50 was not part of AVCHD 1.0, but is now part of 2.0.  When it was not part of the standard, 1080p60/50 was included in nearly every consumer camcorder I looked at, touched or read about in the last 2 years.  It may be combersome, but it is still an important part of the feature set for those that spent money on camcorders and cameras recently. 

                     

                    I'm trying to suggest that it might be a "few" that have some trouble and that leads them to post their problems.  Adobe sells PE10 all over the world and claim it to be the 'best selling' video editing software.  If even 100 people have trouble, they are a tiny minority.  It may be that "most" get it to work fine and never show up posting on trouble shooting forums.  But, the 100 are well heard until they get it figured out.

                     

                    Again, if Share>Computer>AVCHD>Presets: MP4 - H264 1920 x 1080p 30>Advanced>Frame rate has a drop down menu with 60p, Adobe's staff in India put it there on purpose.  In my book, that's "official support".

                     

                    If anyone reading this has one of the many 1080p60/50 cameras or camcorders sold in the last couple of years, shoot a two or three minute clip and try it.  Post back if PE10 works with it or not.

                     

                    Bill

                     

                    Added on edit:  I don't see anything here that says 1080p60 is not supported --http://helpx.adobe.com/photoshop-elements/kb/supported-file-formats-premiere-elements.html

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                    • 7. Re: Questions about 1080p60 .m2ts
                      John T Smith Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                      No offence taken... I just commented that it SEEMS that you are one of the very few who have 1080p working with PreElements... of course, as you observe, that may simply be a case of the "majority" of people who post here have a problem, while the "true" majority don't have a problem, and therefore have no reason to post here

                       

                      In fact, I would guess that the "majority" of people who ask questions here ARE those with problems, and the "true" majority does not post because they don't have problems

                      • 8. Re: Questions about 1080p60 .m2ts
                        the_wine_snob Level 9

                        John T,

                         

                        My general observations mirror yours.

                         

                        When we see four people with the same problem, it does seem like a lot, but considering the number of units of, say PrE, that Adobe sells, that is not enough to even factor. If you then can find and add all of the folk with that same problem, on say Elements Village, Muvipix and other sites, it might have significance, but only with extreme numbers. Seldom do we see posts saying "Everything work in PrE ____, on my system, with my camera's footage." They just seldom show up, unless they have otherwise spent time here.

                         

                        That does not discount problems, but usually points to something system, or setting-centric, or a common mistake.

                         

                        Start getting 20 "Me too's," and that can point to an issue, perhaps a Bug, or a very common mistake.

                         

                        Some of us are not really "power users" with PrE, as we spend much more time with other NLE programs, such as PrPro. However, most of us DO use PrE, and some to a higher degree, than others. Those, who ARE power users, might also not be exploring all possibilities of PrE, but only the materials that they commonly work with, in Projects that match that.

                         

                        I know that Steve Grisetti does work with a lot of different materials, and on both a PC and a Mac, for his books, and postings to Muvipix. Even with that broader spectrum of testing, I would venture that there is much that even he's not had a chance to try. If, for instance, he does not have a camera, that shoots 1080p, unless supplied with that footage, has probably not tried it.

                         

                        I know that I have not experimented with RED 2K, 4K or 5K footage, so only know what I read, from those, who have. If they had problems, I try to remember those. If things worked fine, I try to note their workflow and their systems, to help others.

                         

                        I think that it is wonderful, when people "push the envelope," and then take time to report, either their failures, or successes. Even a beta tester will never tape into all of the potential power, or find all of the pitfalls.

                         

                        Heck, more than half of the work that I have done in PrE has been trying to either replicate others' problems, or to find solutions for their questions.

                         

                        Still, in the forums, we mostly see the horror stories, and seldom really rave reviews from satisfied users. It is definitely a skewed view of things.

                         

                        Hunt

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