10 Replies Latest reply on Sep 16, 2012 7:34 PM by lasvideo

    New to PrPro with specific workflow questions


      Hi, All!


      I'm a 20+ year video veteran wading into the Premiere Pro pool this year. I have an extensive Avid and FCP background. Please don't hold that against me! I also realize this is long, but I'm trying to cram everything in so you can see where I've been to possibly re-route me, make it understandable, and at least a wee bit interesting.


      I'm currently running PrPro 5.5.2 on a MBP 2.8 GHz Intrel Core 2 Duo with 4GB RAM. My media storage is a 2TB Sonnet Tempo RAID partition over eSATA to an Express34 card on the MBP.


      I've sucessfully been doing AVC-Intra projects in PrPro for the last few months. This new project is different, and I want to see if there is any way to make my process more efficient. It's a very simple project, but it's very long. I'm finding as I do my workflow tests that the render, export and conversion process I had been doing for the short AVC-Intra projects (which were in the 5-7 minute range) are going to be very time consuming on this project, which has a hefty 2 1/2 hour run time over 14 modules. The editing is simple, if not cookie-cutter. It's creating the deliverables that's going to be the real bear here. I'm hoping your collective experience can offer me a better workflow that what I've cobbled together from my other knowledge and previous forum searches.


      The nitty gritty:


      These videos  are basically putting a narrator to PowerPoint presentation and prettying it up with a music stinger at the open and close and adding a nicer-than-PPT transition betweeen the slides. I have an AIFF audio track for narration, AIFF music file from SmartSound, PNG graphic files (converted PowerPoint deck), & an animated Apple PNG transition. (from the Digital Juice people. It's one of their "Swipes".)


      I started with a AVC-Intra timeline because that seemed to me to be the highest quality. I understand this was probably my first error. The renders are taking about run time for the module. With these elements and the following deliverables, what Sequence Settings do you recommend I should be using?


      My deliverables will be myriad, which is why I want to export out a high-quality master file out of PrPro and then do the mulitple conversions to other sizes & codecs in a compression app. I have Encore, Sorenson Squeeze, and Compressor at my disposal. I'm guessing Encore will be my friend here, but it's also the one I know the least.


      I tried exporting out a ProRes file. That took over 40 minutes on a 14 minute module. Then I converted that to a 640 x 360 H.264 to upload as an approval file. That took about 35 minutes. (I used Compressor becasue I have a droplet craeated for that and it's what I have been sucessfully been using to make small, good-looking files that my clients can reasonably download or stream).


      Next I tried exporting out the highest quality H.264 at 1920x1080 and tried converting that using my Compressor droplet. That took 50 minutes to export out of PrPro, but it saves me one step of converting to a full size H.264. What I'm not sold on is whether or not that file is the best file I should be using to make the other deliverables.


      What I will eventually need to deliver is a family of H.264 in various sizes from 1920x1080 to 320x180 & an authored DVD. So we're talking hours of processing for each one if I go with what I know.


      Since the only thing that moves in these videos are a handful of animated transitions (10-15 per module) and a fade in & fade out, my gut tells me I could make this happen faster if I only changed a few things in my workflow. I'm just at a loss as to what those things might be.


      Another little note. The client will wnat to  custominze these with different logos, so I will have to be able to get in, add or change a logo super, and re-export and re-convert all 2 1/2 hours multiple times. A more efficeint way to do that would be very helpful. Both for my sanity and my clients' budget.


      Any insight would be greatly appreciated! Thanks!!



        • 1. Re: New to PrPro with specific workflow questions
          Jim_Simon Level 8

          Exporting out a lossless Master and creating deliverables from that is probably the best way to go here.  UT is a good option.  It's free, lossless, and cross-platform.




          Now, as to the export times.  Run a module out to UT and report back what you're seeing for times.

          • 2. Re: New to PrPro with specific workflow questions
            debesch Level 1

            Do I need to change my Sequence Settings first? Exporting out lossless (Uncompressed YUV 10 bit 4:2:2 setting) of a 14 minute module says it's going to take an hour and 20 minutes, and the counter is going up. That's almost twice what I was experiencing with my previous methods. Which is why I settled on ProRes in my first attempt. The uncompressed settings were estimating much too long of an export. ProRes was half that.


            I've never heard of UT Video. What does it do that Adobe Media Encoder (which I erroneously called Encore in my original post. Sorry for any confusion), Sorenson Squeeze or Compressor wouldn't do for me? I already have three applications that are supposed to be the best offerings in the industry by the major players. What would I be gaining by using UT encooder? Does it have a faster encoding engine?


            Sorry for all the questions. I just want to wrap my head around this as best I can and avoid 24 hours of processing.



            • 3. Re: New to PrPro with specific workflow questions
              John T Smith Adobe Community Professional & MVP

              You have somewhat of a choice... fast export or high quality... If I was dealing with customers and need multiple delivery formats, I would do as Jim says

              • 4. Re: New to PrPro with specific workflow questions
                lasvideo Level 4

                I recently made the same transition. Do youself a big favor. Get this book. It will save you many a head and heart ache 



                • 5. Re: New to PrPro with specific workflow questions
                  RjL190365 Level 4



                  Those very long times are par for your MBP's CPU. No dual-core CPU-based system - PC or Mac, desktop or laptop - is as powerful as even a mediocre-performing quad-core CPU-based system, let alone an i7-based system. You see, that Core 2 Duo is handicapped by the lack of Hyperthreading, which means that you have only two threads. Worse, you are running a laptop with such a slow CPU, which means that not only you'd have to deal with the slow CPU, but also slow internal components and (in the case of your particular MBP) very slow external device throughput (hence, the need for an eSATA controller card in an ExpressCard 34 slot). Even intermediate files require massive disk throughput, which your particular MBP by itself is lacking (that system can't export at greater than 35 MB/s externally via USB 2.0 or 75 MB/s via FW800). Intermediate files really require sustained disk throughput greater than 100 MB/s in order to work properly.


                  In other words, you definitely need an entirely new system to run Premiere Pro satisfactorily, especially since the Core 2 Duo is the absolute minimum CPU required by Adobe to even run Premiere Pro CS5 or higher at all.

                  • 6. Re: New to PrPro with specific workflow questions
                    John T Smith Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                    >avoid 24 hours of processing


                    Adding to what was just posted


                    The computer I replaced in 2010 was based on the Pentium4 CPU (Windows XP with CS3) and when I was done editing my SD video and ready to create a DVD, I would start Encore before I went to bed, so it would have an ISO ready for disc writing in the morning


                    The computer I have now is described in http://forums.adobe.com/thread/652694 and my entire process of going from AVCHD to an SD AVI and then the encoding to ISO in Encore is just a bit over real time (maybe twice real time, but that is subjective, not based on a stop watch)


                    CPU cores and speed plus lots of ram (12Gig for my motherboard... 16Gig for newer technology motherboards) and multiple fast hard drives ALL make a difference


                    Your computer is, very simply, just barely able to run PPro... I have NO idea what is available in the Mac world, but to have "acceptable" speed, you need a new computer

                    • 7. Re: New to PrPro with specific workflow questions
                      the_wine_snob Level 9

                      Yes, the Export time will depend on the CPU, the I/O sub-system, the CODEC's of the Source Footage and the CODEC's used for Export, plus any possible MPE/CUDA GPU acceleration.



                      • 8. Re: New to PrPro with specific workflow questions
                        Jim_Simon Level 8

                        Do I need to change my Sequence Settings first?


                        Nope.  Just do an export.



                        I've never heard of UT Video.


                        UT is not a program, it's a codec that you install to your system and becomes one of the options under AVI (Windows) or QuickTime (Mac) in the Codec section.

                        • 9. Re: New to PrPro with specific workflow questions
                          debesch Level 1

                          Thanks for all your input. While I was compressing, I tried a suggestion from a colleague. I exported an XML out of Premiere Pro and imported it in FCP7. That took about 2 minutes. I rendered (8 min), exported (5 min) and converted (22 min). All this took only two minutes longer than it took Premiere Pro to just render the exact same timeline on the same computer.


                          I realize it's probably that I have some settings within Premiere that need attention and that a faster system would be beneficial across the board, but  I need this to happen quickly on the computer I have, so I unfortunately need to use the tool that works, and for this one, it's FCP7.


                          I was hoping this repetitive project would help me cement some Premiere Pro skills, but alas, that is not to be.



                          • 10. Re: New to PrPro with specific workflow questions
                            lasvideo Level 4

                            Its true, in order to take advantage of all CS6 has to offer, you really need a system that can maximize the power of the Adobe Mercury Playback Engine. If and when you ever work with Aodbe CS? in the future, you will find that it has a completely different workflow from FCP. This can be a boon for some projects and a curse for others, depending on the system you are using and the nature of the project.