6 Replies Latest reply on Oct 3, 2012 9:02 AM by Peter Spier

    Bugs? Or is it me?

    Peter B. Bailey Level 1

      I'm getting very frustrated with this latest version of ID.

      1. I want to simply copy and paste in place two columns from a left master page to a right master page. It doesn't work. I go to that right master page, choose "paste in place," and, it appears to place the items back again on the left master page, the original page. I end up having to duplicate the columns on the left page and drag them over to the right page.
      2. Why does ID choose to balance columns when I haven't asked it to? I've changed a wide column format into two columns. All of my text will fit in the first, left column. But, ID chooses to halve my overall text depth and send half over to the second column. No, I don't have "balance columns" checked.
      3. I'm forever lost when it comes to master pages. What am I missing? If I create a new master page and I apply it to an existing page, it should now reflect the attributes of that master page. Shouldn't it? It's not working for me. An existing one column page stays a one column page, though the master page is a two column format. I'm having to literally go into each page to make these changes. And, that's nuts.

       

      Thanks,

      Peter

        • 1. Re: Bugs? Or is it me?
          Peter Spier Most Valuable Participant (Moderator)

          1) That's normal. On a facing pages spread, part of "in place" includes the page side. You can leave it selected, then subtract the page width from the x-coordinate in the Contol panel.

           

          2) That's a bit of a puzzle. You checked the Contol panel to see that the icon for balance columns is not active, right? It might be part of an object style applied to the frame, or set as the default accidentally, but I'd expect it to show in the panel...

           

          3) when you apply a new master page you apply new master objects, so you'd have a new two-column frame (if there's one on the master) behind the existing text frame that was overridden onto the document page when you added the text. If you want that frame to become two columns you should edit the master page that was currently applied, changing the master text frame on that master from one to two columns and pages based on that master should then update.  Changing master pages if you've used master text frames pretty much always ends up with a mess you need to untangle, in my experience.

          • 2. Re: Bugs? Or is it me?
            Peter B. Bailey Level 1

            Thanks, Peter.

            1. What's normal about this? How do I "subtract the page width" as you describe?
            2. I know what my problem is here. I had "Basic text frames" chosen in the object styles above, something I never have used.
            3. I'm only creating two separate columns here because it wouldn't respect me changing my original one-column format to a two-column format in the master page(s). It simply does not update for me when I make those changes to the master page.

             

            Peter

            • 3. Re: Bugs? Or is it me?
              Peter Spier Most Valuable Participant (Moderator)

              Even when you have rulers set "per page" ID seems to remember the coordinates in terms of which side of the spine an object is on (probably so you can change the ruler origins and per page/spread settings without things flying around).

               

              In the control panel, on the left end, when an object is selected you should see the Transform Proxy and then a pair of stacked fields for the x and y-coordinates of the spot that's selected in the proxy. Next to those are width and height fields, then horizontal and vertical scale fields. I actually read the original post backwards (I'm pleading sleep deprivation and a headache today), so instead of subtract you need to add the page width to mov an object fro the left page to the right. To do this, just click in the x-coordinate filed after the current value and type + and then your page width, including the units if they are differnt from the horizontal ruler units in use. ID will do the math. To move to the left from the right page, you subtract the same amount.

               

              Absent some other object style, all text by default uses the Basic Text Frame object style, so you probably never noticed it. My guess would be the balance columns setting got changed accidentally.

               

              If you have a one-column text frame on Master A, then place text into it on you document pages, that master frame is overridden on the pages where you added the text. As long as you don't make any changes to the frame(s) on the document page it retains it's connections to the master frame. Subsequent changes you make to the text frame on Master A will also happen on the document pages where master A was applied. If you've done anything to the overridden frame, however, you lose the connection for the changed attribute. It turns out that the number of columns in a multi-column frame is tied in some way to the frame dimensions (not really surprising), so if you change the frame size on the document page, a subsequent change in the number of columns on the master would have no effect. Basically, this means that if you use master frames the best policy is to never alter the text frame on the document page if you can avoid it.

              • 4. Re: Bugs? Or is it me?
                Peter B. Bailey Level 1

                I do have my rulers set to "page."

                1.) Yes, I can see how I would move an object using the control panel tools. But, I'm not moving, I'm copying. And, I'm kind of astounded that I can't just use "paste in place." I changed from facing pages to non-facing pages, and, it still behaves the same.

                 

                2.) Thanks. Yeh, I answered this one for myself. I've never used those object styles before. I must've been fiddling around one day.

                 

                3.) I guess I realize this now. When I changed my text frame on my master page from one column to two column, it blew away text on my document page(s)! Why in the world would I ever want that?

                I haven't modified my frame sizes on my document pages. It's all from the master. But, that behavior, blowing away my text, is simply not kosher.

                 

                Thanks.

                • 5. Re: Bugs? Or is it me?
                  Peter Spier Most Valuable Participant (Moderator)

                  But you are not pasting in place, really, if you are pasting onto the opposite page. I may not have been entirely clear, either. I meant to go ahead and do the copy/paste in place, the with the pasted objects still selected do the shift in the control panel. Not as convenient as paste in palce alone, but completely accurate. If things are snapped to guides, though, I usually forget about copy/paste altogether and just hold down the Alt/Opt key and drag the copy (and hold the Shift key to constrain movement to horizontal or vertical), depending on the smart guides or page guides to tell me the position is correct. It's actually very fast that way, once you get used to it.

                   

                  "When I changed my text frame on my master page from one column to two column, it blew away text on my document page(s)! Why in the world would I ever want that?

                  I haven't modified my frame sizes on my document pages. It's all from the master. But, that behavior, blowing away my text, is simply not kosher."

                   

                  It certainly isn't, and it isn't normal, either. Is ID fully patched?

                  • 6. Re: Bugs? Or is it me?
                    Peter Spier Most Valuable Participant (Moderator)

                    Actually, are you sure the text disappeared and didn't just reflow and leave a blank page or pages at the end of the story? I'm not doubting you, just reminding you that two column text normally fits more on the page than a single wide column.