31 Replies Latest reply on Jan 15, 2013 1:27 PM by JFPhoton

    Deciding on CPU & RAM configutation for Laptop.

    Peter Studt Level 1

      Hi All,

      I am looking to buy an Asus G75 ex-demo laptop.

       

      I use PPro CS5.5, mostly with HDSLR H2.64 video. It will be Win7 (Home Premium or Pro, depending on RAM).

       

      Relevant specs.

      GTX660M 2GB GDDR5.

      1TB 5400RPM HDD (which I intend to replace with a 512GB SSD and 750GB 7200RPM HDD).

      17.3" Full HD screen.

       

      There are two variations of CPU & RAM I have to choose between:

      A:

      i7 3820QM - 4 Cores 8 Threads, 2.7GHz, 3.7GHz with Turbo, 8MB Cache, 45W TDP

      16GB (4x4GB) 1600MHz DDR3

       

      B:

      i7 3720QM - 4 Cores 8 Threads, 2.6GHz, 3.6GHz with Turbo, 6MB Cache, 45W TDP

      32GB (4x8GB) 1333MHz DDR3

       

      I have three questions (greedy):

      Will the mobile GTX660M do a decent job? My desktop uses a GTX480 which seems quite capable, would the 660M be comparable to that?

       

      Which combination of CPU & RAM would be preferable? The faster CPU combo is a little more $, and it seems like a minimal upgrade as far as clock speed goes but the increase in Cache seems significant.

       

      I'm not sure of the best way to utilize the SSD? I know to put project folders on it, and the sound files PPro creates when conforming audio will benifit being on it. Would it be silly or sensible to copy media onto it while working on the project then deleting them when done?

       

      Does this all look like a machine which will give a smooth and prompt editing experience or are there things I am missing?

       

      Ok I guess that is 4 questions .

       

      Thanks as always,

      Peter.

        • 1. Re: Deciding on CPU & RAM configutation for Laptop.
          JFPhoton Level 3

          ...as someone who uses an Asus G73jw and same work pattern, I am guessing the choice of more memory may make the most difference.....32GB is reported to provide faster performance with CS6.....but,you need Windows Professional for that......home edition limits memory to 16GB. For fastest drive speed,you may want to try 512GB crucial m4, with the brand new firmware for your media drive......this has the marvell controller to handle video better than Sandforce. Of course, you would also want a healthy backup strategy via the external ports.

          • 2. Re: Deciding on CPU & RAM configutation for Laptop.
            Peter Studt Level 1

            JFPhoton wrote:

             

            ...as someone who uses an Asus G73jw and same work pattern, I am guessing the choice of more memory may make the most difference.....32GB is reported to provide faster performance with CS6.....but,you need Windows Professional for that......home edition limits memory to 16GB. For fastest drive speed,you may want to try 512GB crucial m4, with the brand new firmware for your media drive......this has the marvell controller to handle video better than Sandforce. Of course, you would also want a healthy backup strategy via the external ports.

            How have you found editing on your G3jw?

             

            I am leaning towards the faster CPU and less RAM but what you say is true I think. My desktop pc has 12GB and is a great experience for most of what I have been doing, so I thought the better CPU would be of bigger benifit.

            I was thinking of Samsung 830 or Corsair Force GS (I know, it is Sandforce).

            Were you suggesting using 2 SSD's?

            The 1TB 5400rpm drive will go into an external caddy and do back up duty.

            • 3. Re: Deciding on CPU & RAM configutation for Laptop.
              John T Smith Adobe Community Professional & MVP

              Things may have changed since these articles were written, but you might want to read about using an SSD

               

              SSD and Video Editing http://forums.adobe.com/thread/902915?tstart=0

              -and http://forums.adobe.com/message/4492104

              • 4. Re: Deciding on CPU & RAM configutation for Laptop.
                JEShort01 Level 4

                Peter,

                 

                First, for me the cpu/memory choice is a no brainer - go with the ever so slightly slower cpu and twice the RAM.

                 

                GTX 660M should be a great laptop GPU for CS. Regarding the comparison of the GTX 660M vs. GTX 480 however, while core/speed are not radically different, the memory bandwidth on the GTX 480 is 177.4 GB/s vs. only 64.0 on the laptop GTRX 660M GPU. I cannot speak to what this means for editing, but some in the know around here seem to think that memory bandwidth is important for CS6.

                 

                Regarding drives, I would suggest speding the budget this way:

                - 256GB SSD (Crucial M4?)

                - 750 7200rpm 2nd internal drive

                - external 3.0 single drive or maybe even a 2xRAID 0 external solution

                 

                Adobe CS really begs for drives and laptop drives, even 7200rpm variants, are not the fastest drives around. So, without using the external drive (or array) you can still run CS, and with the extrernal connected (when and where that is doable) it will run faster and have more space. (i.e. all files on single 7200 internal or moving cache, scratch, and outputs to ext. drive(s) when available).

                 

                Finally, question 4... Regarding how to use the SSD, I would suggest experimenting putting various files (media cache, media cache db, etc.) on it and see if it helps. I would not be suggesting the USB 3.0 rotating drives however if I did not feel strongly that rotating drives are the only contender for a budget concsious laptop Premiere CS system.

                 

                [Note to someone building the ultimate laptop solution for Premiere CS where the budget is closer to $5,000, I would be saying SSDs all the way! 3-spindle laptop loaded with 3x512GB SSDs]

                 

                Regards,

                 

                Jim

                1 person found this helpful
                • 5. Re: Deciding on CPU & RAM configutation for Laptop.
                  Peter Studt Level 1

                  John T Smith wrote:

                   

                  Things may have changed since these articles were written, but you might want to read about using an SSD

                   

                  SSD and Video Editing http://forums.adobe.com/thread/902915?tstart=0

                  -and http://forums.adobe.com/message/4492104

                  It's hard to know where we are, the subject of storage and SSD is complex. At least drives seem to have stopped 'dissapearing' and reading various forums it is clear if not crystal that progress is being made.

                  A laptop presents cirtain limitations, 2 Drive bays (assuming the optical drives is required, and I would like to have it) and USB3. This is why I am thinking of a 512GB SSD, giving it space to be more than just a OS and Application Boot drive. Most of what was being said in the links was related to a desktop environement where there is space and connections for mutiple high speed drives.

                   

                  Thanks, there are many links contained there aswell as Harm's extensive experience which is never to be ignored!

                  • 6. Re: Deciding on CPU & RAM configutation for Laptop.
                    Peter Studt Level 1

                    JEShort01 wrote:

                     

                    First, for me the cpu/memory choice is a no brainer - go with the ever so slightly slower cpu and twice the RAM.

                     

                    Hi Jim,

                     

                    The best solution would be the fast CPU with 32GB of the fast RAM but that would amp the cost up considerably and Im not even sure would be available. As the documentation around the PPBM says, MPEG encoding is RAM intensive whereas H2.64 is CPU intensive... AE will use the RAM. I'm just not sure there is much else that would benifit from it so much, whereas they would benifit from the faster clocks and cache... Argh!

                     

                    GTX 660M should be a great laptop GPU for CS. Regarding the comparison of the GTX 660M vs. GTX 480 however, while core/speed are not radically different, the memory bandwidth on the GTX 480 is 177.4 GB/s vs. only 64.0 on the laptop GTRX 660M GPU. I cannot speak to what this means for editing, but some in the know around here seem to think that memory bandwidth is important for CS6.

                    There are no 'broad' bus in the 6xx GPU cards, I'm dissapointed. Also being mobile it is a 'cut down' card with less Cuda Cores. It's good to hear encoraging comments about it. I figure it's not a 680 but at least it is Keplar which is good for the battery.

                     

                    Regarding drives, I would suggest speding the budget this way:

                    - 256GB SSD (Crucial M4?)

                    - 750 7200rpm 2nd internal drive

                    - external 3.0 single drive or maybe even a 2xRAID 0 external solution

                    I'm not even sure RAID 0 is possible through USB?

                    Currently I can buy 2x 256GB Samsung 830s' cheaper than 1x 512GB Samsung 830 SSD, but I can't fit that in. Although it seems wise to minimise writes to a SSD, surely this is the main thing preventing them from being utilized to their full extent. I have read a few people talking down the dangers of NAND chips 'wearing out', but some things like the windows page file would seem to be a worse case for repeated writes. Then again, look at a hybrid drive and what the SS cache pressumably has to endure, it is just ordinary MLC NAND as far as I understand?

                     

                    I figure I have Two drives in the Laptop and one slower external, any more and the mobility is compromised.

                     

                    Thanks for your input, I am still uncertain, but the information and ideas are all highly appreciated.

                    Best,

                    Peter

                    • 7. Re: Deciding on CPU & RAM configutation for Laptop.
                      JFPhoton Level 3

                      Editing Canon DSLR MOVs has worked fine on my G73jw. I am still using version 5.03, because of reports on this forum that 5.5 and 6 had changes which introduced stuttering with the DSLR files, which did not occur with 5.03. As seen in the PPBM5 benchmark test results, there was a change that affected "cacheing", and has led to slower MPEG DVD encoding.

                       

                          As your two laptop choices are very similar in CPU speed, the increase in memory would definitly be the better choice... if priced reasonably.

                       

                         From what I have read , things ARE changing for the better concerning SSDs and video use on them.  Right now, the Plextor and Corsair Pro series have the Marvell controller which provides higher write speeds for the "incompressible data", such as digital video.....Sandforce write speed can drop 50%.

                             Even with my SATA II G73JW, my PPBM5 test scores were higher using two SSDs....one in each bay......higher than when using a Seagate Momentus XT Hybrid as the project drive.    The SSD reliability question is getting to be less of a concern as more improvements are made.....how can you argue with a single drive that does over 500MB/second vs. an HDD that does 105MB per second??   This is important when talking about a laptop. You can see for yourself on the PPBM5 website the higher results of laptops that have more memory and quality SSds in them......mine is still ranked 5th, ( under the laptop tab). You will notice laptops with way faster CPUs than mine performing slower because of less memory, spinning HDDs, versions 5.5 and 6 with the cache problem.

                           I just bought on sale a crucial m4 512GB for $339....the new firmware  for it was just released a few days ago......even with SATA II, not III on my machine, I know it will perform faster as the project drive than my spinning Momentus.....AND be less vulnerable to damage from shock. Your new machine should scream past mine....esp. with 32 GB of memory,and your video card will be WAY better than my 460m. I do know,( and verify on the PPBM5 site) that having a spinning drive as your second internal drive will be slower than a large Marvell controlled quality SSD. Only for a laptop it may be best to take advantage of the SATAIII speed and use two high quality SSDs.......256 GB for OS, Programs, and page file....then, 512GB as project drive,( all else....media, cache files, previews, exports, etc.)

                           I am not sure what external ports you will have, of course, the new Thunderbolt port would be ideal.......when using USB III, I initially got no more than 100MB/second when using an SSD, ( Corsair F120), in a USB III external dock. However, after researching the USB III controller in my Asus laptop, I found a newer driver and installed it. After that Windows reported over 220MB/ sec. transfer speed. Too bad Asus does not have the Thunderbolt yet, or, an eSATA port with a FAST CONTROLLER to allow full internal speed.

                      1 person found this helpful
                      • 8. Re: Deciding on CPU & RAM configutation for Laptop.
                        Peter Studt Level 1

                        Hey there, thanks for getting back to me

                         

                        I noticed your Asus up there at the pointy end of the PPBM5 list. I'm sure that list ends up raising more questions than it answers... I guess one thing is clear (ish) is that the fastest CPU is not going to get the best results everytime, perhaps even that 'all' SSD config can work and give awesome performance! And yet, look again, there are 4 laptops above yours that don't even have one SSD... Also I notice those two Lenovo W520s' are both using Quadro GPU and not even top end ones!!!

                         

                        What it does not show clearly is that having 32GB of slower RAM is going to be the best option for me, infact the first laptop to show 32GB of RAM is 17th in the laptops list with 16 laptops having 16GB or less RAM being faster performers... Unfortunately PPBM6 is not up and running that I can find, not that I am using CS6 but I assume that all the latest and 'greatest' setups would be using it and we cannot see them benchmarked.

                         

                        That Crucial 512GB for $399 sounds like an awesome deal, unfortunately down here in NZ we don't seem to get the same deals, according to Pricespy the cheapest Crucial M4 512GB is NZ$678 = ~US$554. To get 1x 256GB and 1x 512GB is going to cost around NZ$1000 (~US$817) and the 32GB RAM laptop is looking at NZ$2380 (US$1994) compared to NZ$2565 (US$2095) for the faster RAM/CPU setup. I guess it's one drawback of living here in beautiful New Zealand the rest of the world think we are sheep and need to be fleeced!

                         

                        When the G75VW was launched in the US I thought it came with Thunderbolt, then I saw models with FireWire but the model I am looking at, which is representitive of what's available from Asus G series here in NZ comes with Display port which is actually not that bad an option IMO. No ESata, just 4 USB3 ports, and at the end of the day, the USB3 can work quite nicely as you pointed out. There is one other consideration in relation to the Drive bay sata configuration, that I need to Reference before stating it here, but it is proving hard to locate. It is related to the 2nd drive bays sata version...

                         

                        Going to get some dinner now before the Japanese F1 starts!

                        Best,

                        Peter.

                        • 9. Re: Deciding on CPU & RAM configutation for Laptop.
                          JFPhoton Level 3

                          .....some "refurbished " Asus laptops come with a 750GB 7200 rpm HDD....this you can clone onto a 256GB quality SSD, then, you can  use the  750GB drive as the large project drive......in combination with using a third drive, ( via the USB III port).....and according to Harm's 3 drive setup suggestions...you will still get solid performance, ( esp. with highly compressed AVCHD or, DSLR MOVs).

                           

                             In the U.S. , Tiger Direct and New Egg sell these for a vastly reduced price. Yes, your CPU will be MUCH faster than mine.....tearing through the H.264 3 or 4 times faster than mine. I still do not understand why Adobe releases newer versions of PPro that abandon certain technologies and causes problems that previously did not exist.  In addition, it seems every release requires a beefier computer than before to attain top performance,( i. e. CS6 needing a 32GB memory minimum for best performance). So, if you switch to the "cloud", and start using CS6....you would want the 32GB memory, if possible. I believe Exotic PC is already selling 32GB laptops, ( although they may not be Asus).

                           

                             New tech developments are always around the corner....external Thunderbolt drive arrays are being introduced that are blazing fast...( see storagereview.com). Its hard to wait sometimes!

                          • 10. Re: Deciding on CPU & RAM configutation for Laptop.
                            Bill Gehrke Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                            Peter,  be careful when just comparing total scores on PPBM5 and make sure you are comparing the same versions of Premiere.   The goal forCS6  was not improved performance, it was a zillion added featuires to satisfy new users to convert to Premiere from the competition.  As a result the scores are typically a little higher than CS5.5 scores.  We cannot control users of PPBM5 to have the same optimazations like tuning the OS so you have to just look at trends.  You should also compare individual benchmarks as opposed to total score and see how that affects your decisions. 

                            • 11. Re: Deciding on CPU & RAM configutation for Laptop.
                              JFPhoton Level 3

                              ......if you look at the laptop results, you will see another Asus G73JW listed....way down, ranked past 600. You can see that machine is slowed by not enough memory, (  8GB...I have 14GB ), and the use of conventional 7,200 rpm HDDs.  There could also be "Windows tuning issues", but, I doubt,in this case,if it applies...because his MPE time was 19 seconds....the same as mine, when I used the Seagate Momentus XT as my project drive,instead of the Corsair F120 SSD...( a full 2 seconds slower than with the Corsair).

                                    The laptop showing 32 GB of memory is hampered by an older video card that has only 1GB of DDR3  memory....not DDR5.....like the newer cards.......my 460m has 1.5GB of DDR5. That 32GB laptop claims to use 4 hard drives....configured with two separate RAID 0 arrays !!

                                   In short, as stated so many times in general here on this forum.....if a properly balanced machine can be created....it will provide better performance. Also,Bill has mentioned before that the OS drive need not be an SSD.....once the PPro program is up and running....it is the speed of the project drive that matters.....the OS SSD would be for convenience as boot times and program starts are faster. In a laptop an SSD may be more sturdy and prevent shock damage. The top laptop is using a RAID 0 setup for the project drive....illustrating the speed gain with a fast project drive. Older SSDs were hampered by slow writing speeds.....at the time, I chose the Corsair F120 SSDs because they were the highest performing read  and write SSDs tested by storagereview.com.  Now, the newer SATA III interface in the laptops offer a huge speed increase potential  for single SSDs in a laptop. Thus, a laptop equipped with : an NVidia 680m video card , Windows 7 Professional, 32GB system memory, 2 internal high quality SSDs, ( 256GB OS drive and 512GB project drive) should really do well. The best SSDs for video use  seem to be the Plextor and Corsair Pro models that feature the Marvell controllers, ( not Sandforce). They claim read and write speeds of over 500MB per second..especially with "incompressible data"...(like video files). The downside is that these SSDs are expensive.....a much cheaper Marvell based SSD is the Crucial M4.....however, it tests at over 500MB/sec. read,but, only over 200 MB/sec. write.

                                    It appears that decent performing portable solutions are possible,but, as usual, will carry a high price tag compared to a desktop. I noticed the top raked laptop is using a Quadro 1000m card.....although it only has DDR3 memory, it appears that because it has 2GB of video memory it is not hampered. This suggests that the more video memory, the better...along with a fast i7 CPU!!!

                                     I would love to see the test results of a newer laptop, configured as mentioned above! I am waiting for newer laptop models with Thunderbolt to appear before considering a new purchase.

                              • 12. Re: Deciding on CPU & RAM configutation for Laptop.
                                Peter Studt Level 1

                                Hi guys

                                 

                                I wonder if it might be fair to say that system tuning can make or break an editing machine? Perhaps even more so when talking about a laptop since their OS is so much more entwined with the machine (out of the box) with various bloatware and adware playing around like tribbles in a starship! I have to say that buying an editing laptop has been a frustrating experience compared to building a desktop machine, trying to learn about them is like breaking code since they're such closed systems and not really intended to be altered from their out of the box state. Most are designed for Gaming, Business or All in one type scenario (shudders!) unless your paying top dollars for a high end HP Elitebook or something similar.

                                 

                                Recently I read on a forum that the secondary drive bay of the G75 is only SataII, the trouble is I can not be 100% sure it is true or not. I have read more recently that both bays are SataIII but the optical bay is SataII, this makes more sense to me. Also with GPU's, the M on the end means they are often not closely related to the destop versions in various specs and features, perhaps mobile Quadro is less dissabled than the GeForce cards? They certainly don't feature at the top of the Desktop category!

                                 

                                Currently I have no plans on shifting to CS6, I have no reason to leave CS5 and I have not heard any compelling reasons to do so. I understand the commercial motivation to 'snag' new customers with features that will feel more familliar to them, but new things come with new bugs, CS5 does what I want to do, pretty trouble free, I am content.

                                 

                                On the CPU RAM decision: I am thinking that in the future I can upgrade RAM, relatively easily, but the CPU is not really upgradible. I can buy 32GB 1600MHz Corsair Vengence or Kingston HyperX RAM for ~NZ$400 (US$326) (and it will most likely be cheaper by the time I decided to do it), and then I would have fast CPU and the fast RAM. If I went with the slower CPU with the 32GB of slower 1333MHz RAM I would be CPU stuck and have less reason to upgrade the RAM and so kinda RAM stuck also. I think we are all agreed that even with 16GB RAM this machine will be no slouch and will not be struggling with my current needs. The perception of satisfaction and enjoyment connected to owning a computer has never been solely about the realities of simple functionality, for me the knowledge that everything is 'premium' rather than 'value' seems important, even if it means having less of it...

                                 

                                With the drives, I am leaning towards 256GB Samsung 830 to start with, as OS/Apps with a Seagate Momentus 750GB 7.2K RPM media/project drive (Hybrid or standard?) with the 1TB 5.4K RPM (original drive) in an external caddy for export/backup. This will give me a chance to experiment with SSD and see how it fits my levels of expectation.

                                 

                                Thunderbolt seems pretty powerful, 10Gb/S is hard to argue with! There is a way to go before it becomes mainstream though. In the meantime we have USB which for now does a fantastic job

                                 

                                Thanks guys, I apprecite the input v much!

                                Peter.

                                • 13. Re: Deciding on CPU & RAM configutation for Laptop.
                                  JFPhoton Level 3

                                  ......a note.....my Asus, and others like it, have only 3 accessible memory slots on the back. The 4th is inaccessible under the keyboard, requiring a complete disassembly to change the stick....and to void the warranty.  It would be better to buy the machine with 32GB of matching memory already installed.....the differences in the two CPUs are minimal.

                                   

                                         Both internal drive bays are SATA III.....optical may be SATA II. As Scott has said from ADK on this forum,( who makes custom PCs for video editing and laptops ), a minimum 256 GB SSD is good because you can put the page file on it.   Using the 750GB will work fine in the second bay......a cheap USB III external dock can give you the flexible option of plugging in different external drives at will,( i.e. one big one for backup, another swapped in the dock for a third editing drive,etc,). Exporting to a 5400 RPM drive may be slow.......you may want to consider a large 7200RPM drive.

                                  • 14. Re: Deciding on CPU & RAM configutation for Laptop.
                                    Peter Studt Level 1

                                    JFPhoton said:

                                    ......a note.....my Asus, and others like it, have only 3 accessible memory slots on the back. The 4th is inaccessible under the keyboard, requiring a complete disassembly to change the stick....and to void the warranty.  It would be better to buy the machine with 32GB of matching memory already installed.....the differences in the two CPUs are minimal.

                                    I watched a youtube video of a service tech dismantling the G75, it has two RAM slots behind the keyboard and two more easily accessible ones located with the Drive Bays, it seemed quite straightforward getting to the hidden slots. Being ex-demo means that Asus give 3 months warranty. I am about to send a mail asking about RAM, they say they will upgrade the RAM but keep talking about uprading the 16GB of 1600MHz with 32GB of 1333MHz CL9, I would prefer 1600MHz CL9... They also say the 3820 has sold but they have a 3840 for not much more

                                     

                                    JFPhoton also said:

                                    ...a cheap USB III external dock can give you the flexible option of plugging in different external drives at will,( i.e. one big one for backup, another swapped in the dock for a third editing drive,etc,). Exporting to a 5400 RPM drive may be slow.......you may want to consider a large 7200RPM drive.

                                    yes, I agree about the 5400RPM drive, it would be better to export to at least the internal 7200RPM drive, or even the SSD C: drive. There is the optical drive bay where another drive could live, using an external USB BD/DVD drive. They will upgrade the DVD combo to a Blu-Ray combo (BD ROM DVD Writer) for NZ$100 but if I was going with a HDD in there that would be wasted money... Could you carry the removed optical drive around with the laptop and swap it out when required, or would that be impractical? It sure is tempting to install a 3rd drive!

                                     

                                    It's getting to the point where I have to 'pull the trigger' soon, I feel the pressure mounting

                                    • 15. Re: Deciding on CPU & RAM configutation for Laptop.
                                      Peter Studt Level 1

                                      A quick update on where I'm at with my laptop:

                                       

                                      I have put a deposit on it and am waiting for it to arrive from where ever it is that they arrive from, 'The Factory'!

                                       

                                      Specs, for better or worse:

                                      Asus G75VW BBK5

                                      Screen + 17.3" 1920x1080, 60Hz, Matte

                                      CPU + intel i7 3840QM - 4 cores, 2.8GHz - 3.8GHz, 8MB Cache

                                      GPU + nVidia GTX660M - 2GB GDDR5

                                      RAM + 16GB (4x4GB) 1600MHz CL9 DDR3

                                      C Drive + Samsung 830 256GB SSD (if the 840 pro is available I will consider getting that instead, they will wait for the machine to arrive before getting drives)

                                      D Drive + Seagate Momentus XT 750GB 7.2K rpm, hybrid HDD

                                      F Drive + 1TB 5.4K rpm in USB3 external caddy.

                                      OS + Windows 7 Professional

                                       

                                      Backpack which I am yet to shop for

                                       

                                      Pros:

                                      It should be a grunty and well balanced portable video editing system for NZ$3000

                                       

                                      Cons:

                                      3 months Asus Warranty since it is an ex-demo machine (I am putting faith in the people supplying it to support me if need arises, he says not to worry).

                                      For some reason it has no Bluetooth?!? Does have wireless though.

                                      Only DVD writer optical drive

                                       

                                      Things to do:

                                      Upgrade DVD writer to BD writer.

                                      Get a faster 7.2K rpm drive, either in optical drive bay or just USB3 will work that out in the future sooner or later...

                                       

                                      Thoughts:

                                      Can't wait!

                                       

                                      Will update when it arrives in a couple of weeks.

                                       

                                      Best

                                      Peter

                                      • 16. Re: Deciding on CPU & RAM configutation for Laptop.
                                        JFPhoton Level 3

                                        ...once up and running, go to PPBM5 website and run the benchmark test......it should do well. The CPU and video card with the Mercury Playback on will be fast. The 750GB Momentus has tested faster than the 500 GB version I have, and should be OK......although the fastest performance would have to be  with a second internal SSD, because of no eSATA port and the "iffy" speed of the USB III external port.

                                            Mine appeared to increase from 105 to 220MB/sec. after installing a recently found newer driver for the onboard USB III controller....but, that is going by what the little window is reporting during a transfer, not "Tune Pro" HDD test.

                                             In the future.....esp. if using After Effects a lot, it may be possible to install Windows Professional, 32GB memory,( 1366 vs. 1600 speed difference would be negligable), a second large and fast internal Marvell SSD as"project drive" yourself. Then,via USB III, use the 750 GB supplied drive,( in a dock, or, small enclosure) for backups.  A cheap USB III dock would allow you to plug various HDDs,or,SSDs at will for great flexibility.....3.5" drives as well.

                                                Too bad you do not have access to the U.S. outlets here like Tiger Direct, new Egg, or, B&H that sell these machines at a discount.....an Asus laptop similar to yours was $ 1,399 U. S. recently with Blu-Ray player.   Good Luck with the machine, and I look forward to seeing your test results!

                                        • 17. Re: Deciding on CPU & RAM configutation for Laptop.
                                          Peter Studt Level 1

                                          JFPhoton wrote:

                                          The 750GB Momentus has tested faster than the 500 GB version I have, and should be OK......although the fastest performance would have to be  with a second internal SSD, because of no eSATA port and the "iffy" speed of the USB III external port.

                                          This raises three things for me right now:

                                          1/ Because the secondary drive is just 'Data' there's no mucking around involved in swapping the drive with any other drive.

                                          2/ I may have to update USBIII drivers on mine...

                                          3/ It would be really useful if the optical bay was plug and play, like a Sata II dock. Far too sensible I guess but I reackon Asus could make that work very tidily (or just include eSata I guess).

                                           

                                          In the future.....esp. if using After Effects a lot, it may be possible to install Windows Professional, 32GB memory,( 1366 vs. 1600 speed difference would be negligable), a second large and fast internal Marvell SSD as"project drive" yourself. Then,via USB III, use the 750 GB supplied drive,( in a dock, or, small enclosure) for backups.  A cheap USB III dock would allow you to plug various HDDs,or,SSDs at will for great flexibility.....3.5" drives as well.

                                          OS will be Windows Professional already.

                                          I have not used AE a whole lot, it hasn't been necessary for most of what I have been doing. Although the way it uses RAM for realtime preview just gobbles the GBytes up. It is a consideration but not key.

                                          I am definately planning on picking up one of those USB Docks! It took seeing them a few times to click what they were (a bit slow i guess ) but they are very handy hardware to have I think.

                                           

                                          Too bad you do not have access to the U.S. outlets here like Tiger Direct, new Egg, or, B&H that sell these machines at a discount.....an Asus laptop similar to yours was $ 1,399 U. S. recently with Blu-Ray player.

                                          Eeeek! Don't say that ! On the positive side, atleast we are moving into summer right now .

                                          It is kinda frustrating seeing the deals and the selection available to you all over there but I guess we have to make the best of what we can get to work with and not spend too much time lamenting the general state of things. Buying a laptop with the editing power that these machines have is a special and wonderful opportunity. I hope to be too swallowed up in frenzy'd creativity to be looking at the grass on the other side of globe.

                                           

                                          I went to a local shop today and saw a bunch of 17" G series Asus laptops (G73, G74, G75) and have to say they look extremely sleek and sexy! just amazing!

                                           

                                          Thanks man!

                                           

                                          Peter.

                                          • 18. Re: Deciding on CPU & RAM configutation for Laptop.
                                            JFPhoton Level 3

                                            Peter,

                                             

                                            I am confident your machine will do well with  PPro. Your second internal drive speed will determine the performance speed while editing....your vid card, memory and CPU are fine. Look again at the top laptops on the PPBM5 test results......the fastest performance is attained by the Lenovo using a 2 drive RAID 0 array as the"project drive". Your 750GB Momentus has a larger and faster SSD cache in it ,than mine does.....in tests, it has shown much improvement over the 500GB model I have.  With my now 2 year old machine with SATA II, there was a two second slower performance using the Momentus vs. the F120 SSD as the "project drive" on the PPBM5 test.

                                                  With SATA III in your machine, I would be so tempted to want to place a Corsair,or, Plextor Pro Marvell SSD in the second drive bay  to see if the machine could go as fast,or faster, than that RAID array Lenovo!!! Then, the supplied 750GB could be the 3rd drive, which could be a perfect backup solution in a high speed USB III enclosure,or USBIII dock. However, with the better performance of the 750 Momentus right out of the box, its larger cache should give you  a good result to begin with!  

                                            • 19. Re: Deciding on CPU & RAM configutation for Laptop.
                                              Peter Studt Level 1

                                              Hi all,

                                               

                                              I am having serious (in my opinion) problems with my laptop purchase, I wonder if someone could help me? The story is long and drawn out with a display issue, an improper shut down issue, and a CPU issue.

                                               

                                              Right now I would appreciate if someone (JFPhoton) could run HWINFO on their laptop, plugged in and in performance mode, and let me know if the CPU voltages continually fluctuate?

                                               

                                              The cores on this laptop (at the shop currently) are randomly, not all at once but sometimes 1, 2, 3 or 4 cores, going from 0.91V to 1.2V all the time, up and down. The shop says "This is normal behaviour". I just find this absurd!

                                               

                                              The display was fine when it arrived but I wanted to remove the partition they installed so they reccomended I do an 'F9 factory restore to whole Hard Drive' but to take the second HDD out first. I took it out and booted up before doing the restore and there was a blue bar at the left of the screen and the colours had gone weird. I am linking a thread I started at ROG website with pictures of the screen, the images are.

                                               

                                              (I took the laptop to a friends place, came back and started it up and the screen fixed itself. The shop said "It never happen while it was here, no problem".)

                                              G75_Screen Issue.jpg

                                              G75_Screen Issue_closer.jpg

                                               

                                              Last issue is when I hibernate the machine, then resume, 5-10 minutes later the laptop just blacks out, then reboots. The shop technician updated BIOS and drivers and said "It's not happening now don't worry".

                                               

                                              I am concerned the shop is just brushing me off. I have requested they send it back to Asus for a 'real' check up. I'm not even sure the shop have even removed the back panel... Please help.

                                               

                                              Peter.

                                              • 20. Re: Deciding on CPU & RAM configutation for Laptop.
                                                JFPhoton Level 3

                                                I believe you made a big mistake in trying to eliminate the partition  on the SSD......you should have left it alone.......with an SSD, having the two partitions would have no effect on editing,or, anything,really.

                                                For an editing rig, to free up valuable space on that SSD, you would want to get rid of the "hibernate" feature anyway, and make sure your pagefile is on the SSD, ( Faster).

                                                you said at first the machine ran great.......then after getting rid of the partition everything went bad. Turn off all the power saving crap settings on your rig......set everything to maximum with no "sleeping", etc.

                                                 

                                                A demo is a lot different than "refurbished" or new....who knows what may have been done to it?

                                                 

                                                Download free MSI Afterburner to monitor your GPU temps and behavior.....test it with PPro at the PPBM5 website and see how it does. If the machine went to a shop that is not an official ASUS repair center...that is bad!. Only send it to official repair with the RMA number under warranty...hurry.

                                                   If the machine is not running perfect.......try and get a credit toward a new one, if a refund is out of the question.

                                                    Coincidently, MY laptop is now acting up!!! With only one month left on the warrany, my GPU fan is very loud and grinding!!!. All GPU temps are OK and machine runs perfect,but, I see my problem IS COMMON with this, and similar Asus laptops. After finding out about this problem, I WOULD NOT RECOMMEND ANYONE BUYING ASUS LAPTOPS as they are using crummy, cheap parts and assembly techniques. Also, their customer service is horrible. Other problems persist on their laptops, like cheap, lousy touch pads,etc., that I am finding out about. I am also experiencing the external USB III dock repeatedly going "offline" ...some one said to make sure no cell phone is nearby and that seemed to have helped...I've read USB III has a conflict with 2.4GHz devices.

                                                   It is too bad, because the machine's performance has been stellar....at a cheap price !! But, as always, "somethings gotta give!!!"

                                                • 21. Re: Deciding on CPU & RAM configutation for Laptop.
                                                  Peter Studt Level 1

                                                  Hi mate,

                                                   

                                                  After all your recommendations and such, you never did the simple thing I asked! Could you or anyone please let me know if CPU Core voltages (in other words the frequencies) should be continually fluctuating, Plugged in, and in Performance mode, with nothing running? Simple as that???

                                                   

                                                  I don't want a lecture please.

                                                   

                                                  Currently, I have uninstalled the Asus power software, I am using Windows power software.

                                                  On any setting other than 'Performance' the cores settle down to idle and all core voltages sit constantly at 0.91V, as I think they should do. When I set it to 'performance mode' the cores start fluctuating, constantly, never settling down.

                                                   

                                                  Event log has many entries like below.

                                                   

                                                  Session "Circular Kernel Context Logger" failed to start with the following error: 0xC0000035

                                                   

                                                  Anyone?

                                                  • 22. Re: Deciding on CPU & RAM configutation for Laptop.
                                                    JFPhoton Level 3

                                                    .....voltage is not frequency. Look up error message on Microsoft site........ask Eric or Scott on this forum about voltage issue and if its a problem. Your machine may be ok unless still shutting down.....use hdmi on external tv or monitor to test graphics.....better than analog vga. I haven't looked at voltage behavior....only temps.......who cares, as long as machine runs normally.

                                                          My question is who originally loaded the factory state image onto the SSD in the first place, and what was put back on it during the restore.....something could be corrupted or missing

                                                    • 23. Re: Deciding on CPU & RAM configutation for Laptop.
                                                      Peter Studt Level 1

                                                      Hiya, thanks for getting back.

                                                       

                                                      The screen issue did NOT arise after the F9 restore. The first time I saw it was directly after removing the second HDD (in preparation for the factory restore). It had nothing to do with the restore.

                                                       

                                                      At the end of the day it is not the theory I am trying to examine, it is the behaviour that the shop is claiming as normal behaviour. Using HWINFO I can see the 4 bars that indicate the frequency of the cores (as I understand it) dancing around constantly, at the same time the VID fluctuates in sync with the bars. If Eric or Scott would care to comment I would sincerely appreciate it .

                                                       

                                                      All temps seem normal: CPU Max 89C running WPrime, GPU Max 62C running Furmark.

                                                       

                                                      I would attach an external monitor via HDMI but the laptop is not here now and my primary monitor does not have an HDMI input (Viewsonic vb2650wb) just a VGA and a DVI.

                                                       

                                                      Who loaded the factory state image onto the SSD? I think it might be the shops instalation. I have asked them twice to send the laptop to Asus but they are infuriatingly Asain in their communication! Which is why I am so frustrated, havying to describe things over and over again to them like they are just not wanting to hear what I am saying... I am soooo frustrated with it all.

                                                      • 24. Re: Deciding on CPU & RAM configutation for Laptop.
                                                        Peter Studt Level 1

                                                        Just to let those who have been following this know, I have got the laptop back (a while ago now). The screen issue has not returned and everything seems to be running pretty well. I'm pretty chuffed also to see my laptop (Petes Puter) is the leading laptop in the PPBM5 database

                                                         

                                                        I have had a couple of issues with PPro, Encore and AME crashing during rendering but I suspect that was due to using still images at the native resolution of my 5D MKII. The problem does not seem to be consistent but it is consistant with what I have experienced using other computers, I suspect it is a RAM limitation because I seem to be able to use larger images now with 16GB than I used to be able to with 12GB of RAM. I can watch Windows task manager's representation of RAM usage, go up and down as it renders each still, and sometimes it just rockets straght up to 16GB then crashes. Perhaps I should have gone for the 32GB of the slower RAM...

                                                         

                                                        Note: Adobe Media Encoder and Adobe Encore will benifit from more RAM!

                                                         

                                                        Cheerio,

                                                        Peter

                                                        • 25. Re: Deciding on CPU & RAM configutation for Laptop.
                                                          Bill Gehrke Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                                          Peter, congratulations on your PPBM5 scores.  Your only high score is your disk I/O.  That CPU is doing a great job as shown by your low MPEG and H.264 scores.  The GTX 660M is doing a great job on the MPE code.

                                                           

                                                          Notice that the four best laptop scores are all from Premiere 5.03.  When you upgrade to 5.5 or 6.0 your scores will unfortunately increase.  That is why we caution people at the top of the page to filter by versions to get true comparisons.  Generally as Adobe adds more features it means more code which unfortunately means higher benchmark scores.

                                                           

                                                          I really like that ASUS!

                                                          • 26. Re: Deciding on CPU & RAM configutation for Laptop.
                                                            Peter Studt Level 1

                                                            Thanks Bill.

                                                             

                                                            My project drive is a Seagate Momentus XT with the SSD cache on it, I'm not sure if the cache is fully functional until the files are accessed afew times? I have noticed sometimes it behaves very SSD like after working on a project for a while. My original plan was to use the C drive SSD for the Project drive but that was assuming a 512GB C drive. I guess at the end of the day it is doing the job quite satisfactorily so I will probably continue on as is.

                                                             

                                                            I currently have no plans to upgrade from 5.03, I am used to it and it seems fine to me right now.

                                                             

                                                            Agreed, it is likable. It does it's work with a snappiness that I am enjoying, and it is not as heavy as I expected it to feel.

                                                            • 27. Re: Deciding on CPU & RAM configutation for Laptop.
                                                              JFPhoton Level 3

                                                              Congratulations Peter !!!

                                                               

                                                              Like I thought...your Asus is screaming!!!......burying my 2 year old Asus G73JW !!!....practically DOUBLING the performance of my laptop with version 5.03 !!!  I too, am sticking with that version, for now.....have read about "caching issues" and newer DSLR problems with the newer versions that were not present in 5.03.

                                                               

                                                              After 2 years, my only problem with the G73 is an intermittent noisey GPU fan, ( a common problem on this model). I recommend turning off machine, when not in use to minimize wear on this cheap fan. I'm using the free MSI Afterburner to monitor GPU temps......all OK for now.

                                                               

                                                              In my machine., ( which is SATA II ), I am now using 3 SSDs......"C" is older Corsair Force 120...."D" is Crucial 512 GB M4, ( bought cheap on sale), for projects and  source video,( media)....."F" is another F120 in external ,cheap USB3 dock for previews and all cache files. Each drive is reporting over 220MB per sec. read speed with HD Tune Pro.

                                                               

                                                              I also have the Momentus XT drive.....I recently put it in my daughters crappy Dell laptop to boost its lousy speed, ( it had a WD "Blue"...or, "Blew" HDD @ 5,400rpm ). That Dell is now WAY faster and the M4 performs faster in my machine than the XT.

                                                               

                                                              Now that SSD prices have come down ...and are still falling.... I believe your performance may even BE FASTER with a large SSD as your project,(media), drive......not to mention more power saving AND less danger of shock damage!!

                                                               

                                                              With your SATA III interface...I am wondering how your machine would do with a Marvell controlled killer SSD...like a Plextor Pro, or, similar...( these have tested well with "uncompressible" data files, like H264....equal write speed with read speed). Sandforce seems to suffer a hit on video write performance. With a speed difference of 130 MB/sec. vs. 300 to 500MB/sec.....I would think an SSD would improve your test results further AND your editing performance.

                                                               

                                                              However,your CPU and memory are king....esp. with handling highly compressed DSLR material !!!!  Makes me want a new rig!!  Reducing file size of stills,or, compressing them will stop any choking during editing....using Raw,or, plain full size images will choke it.....after all...the video is only 2 megapixels, while a Canon produces 18 megapixel stills !!! Unless you are zooming in to the sub-atomic level,  compressing stills should be OK !!!

                                                               

                                                              I am waiting for Asus to come out with a laptop that has a Thunderbolt port.....for much higher speed external storage. Then, a portable "G RAID",or, similar, can be connected to laptop AND then can be connected to desktop for easy work switching of work environment.

                                                               

                                                              The Asus saved me A LOT OF MONEY at the time vs. the other high performance laptops....I hope yours works well for a long time !!!   I must thank Harm and Bill for all their posts and articles which prevented me, 2 years ago, from buying junk that would not work !!!

                                                              • 28. Re: Deciding on CPU & RAM configutation for Laptop.
                                                                Peter Studt Level 1

                                                                Hi JF

                                                                 

                                                                Yes you were right, it is 'screaming', not like a banshee though!

                                                                 

                                                                When it renders you can definately hear the fans wind-up (not sure but it seems like one fan cools the CPU and the other cools the GPU?) but they are not a whine, they don't have any harsh frequencies going on in there and they seem to be doing a good job of keeping the temps down. Have you investigated replacing one or both of your fans? I find fans when they are noisy are almost like having a headache, I don't like them. I have left the auto sleep function in place so even when I leave the laptop turned on it nods off pretty soon.

                                                                 

                                                                Your three SSD's sound very nice! Probably soon I will invest in another SSD to replace the D drive and use that HDD in an external caddy, as the prices come down on SSD's it is more reasonable to use them for working drives. It's interesting, now I have an entry in the PPBM5 table I seem to see things in it a bit more clearly, like when you buy a car that you never really noticed much on the road before and all of a sudden they are all over the place heh, but you can see some machines on there that should have much better scores and then you look at the I/O score and understand why it is not much higher up on the table. It's making me want to fix the I/O of this laptop just so it can match the other scores, even though 100 is not a disgrace by any means.

                                                                 

                                                                It has been a while since I was researching but the Samsung 830 I am using as C drive is not a Sandforce drive, it is something different and even though it is leaning towards the reading side of things, it deals with compressed material fairly well. Having just looked at prices here in NZ, the plextor is not cheap, infact prices have not budged that much. I like the look of the Samsung 840Pro but it is even more expensive and I don't like that the non Pro model is 3 bits per cell.

                                                                 

                                                                I know, I should resample images down in size, but I do pan and zoom within images (maybe not to sub-atomic levels, haha). I had one image that was a panorama made of 11 5D MKII images, it was 27,000 pixels wide and made a great non-interupted pan, it was a bit of a bottleneck though, needing to be pre-rendered for preview and did crash when rendering. It suprised me that PPro let me add it to the timeline so I persisted with it, in the end though I resampled it down to about 15,000 pixels wide (from memory) and it rendered ok. It's hard to get a handle on how PPro works since this image is much larger than others that caused issues... Anyway, I have adjusted my work flow .

                                                                 

                                                                Thanks for your input JFPhoton during this trying and difficult purchase, I am deeply grateful to people like Harm and Bill and others who make this forum an invaluable resource for us editors! Long may the forum and my laptop continue serving our creative needs, amen!

                                                                • 29. Re: Deciding on CPU & RAM configutation for Laptop.
                                                                  ECBowen Most Valuable Participant

                                                                  I apologize Peter, I did not notice your question before directed at us. The Behavior of systems or laptops fluctuating voltage, speed or both is completely normal and something you will see far more aggressive on laptops than desktops. The reason this is so is a couple fold. The Primary reason is the EIST and C-States support for CPU's. These are standards that Intel established to allow CPU's to lower MHz/GHz to save power along with putting cores into different sleep states when not used. Obviously when you lower the MHz of a CPU and start putting cores into sleep, the CPU requires far less power to function. This is why the voltage fluctuates as you see it. Now this has far greater effect in laptops than desktop because of battery life. Essentially your CPU has the largest Power draw most of the time unless you have a laptop with a discreet Graphics card. Since the EIST and C-States can cut CPU power draw significantly when power is not really required, this is an easy way for manufacturers to increase battery life significantly. Laptops also have ACPI profiles in the bios along with power management firmware often via the Keyboard firmware that further increases the low power states allowing further improvement of battery life. These particular power management profiles are specific to the manufacturer and will be specific to your laptop model. I hope that helps.

                                                                   

                                                                  Eric

                                                                  ADK

                                                                  • 30. Re: Deciding on CPU & RAM configutation for Laptop.
                                                                    Peter Studt Level 1

                                                                    Hi there Eric,

                                                                    I appreciate your apology, and accept it without resentment

                                                                    There were times during the purchase of my laptop that I did feel kind of trapped in a contract with so many uncertainties and doubts, the main certainty by default was that this machine was a lemon in fact, and all my questions seemed to be unheard or not addressed. Perhaps I was not asking in the correct way, but we can only ask in the best way we know how

                                                                     

                                                                    My concerns over the CPU have pretty much gone now. I cannot really see the point of the 'Performance Power Plan', as  far as I can work out it does not give any extra processing power, it  just makes the CPU more immediately ready to 'process' but the processing is no faster...  I'm not sure but I don't have it set on 'Performance Mode' anyway. I still have a continued uncertainty about the GPU and the screen since it apparently just 'fixed itself'. Asus said they did all the tests which does not completely ease my doubts but everything seems to be good sofar.

                                                                     

                                                                    As far as the battery goes, it lasts for about 2.5 - 3.5 hours I guess depending on what I am doing (I have not really measured it closely), which is quite acceptible to me. When I bought the laptop I picked up an Everki backpack to carry it round in and there is plenty of space for the fairly large power brick to plug into mains power.

                                                                     

                                                                    Thanks for your reply Eric

                                                                    All the best

                                                                    Peter

                                                                    • 31. Re: Deciding on CPU & RAM configutation for Laptop.
                                                                      JFPhoton Level 3

                                                                      Hey Peter !

                                                                       

                                                                      ....your battery life seems great to me !! My G73JW would only go about 1.5 hours when new......no matter WHAT setting I used !! Most of the time, I would be plugged in to a hotel outlet.....on the plane, even with the 120voltAC outlet under the seat of a 737.....the 150watt draw of the brick was too much...YOUR machine may work  on the plane, with the lower wattage...not sure.

                                                                       

                                                                      I always use " high performance " mode, with all performance limiting features turned OFF, to prevent throttling,or, sleeping, or disconnecting external drives when you are working!!

                                                                       

                                                                      Note : when using USB3 port to connect an external drive.....MAKE SURE you FIRST go to device manager and navigate to "USB3" root hub. There, under" properties", make sure you "uncheck" the button which allows Windows to "automatically turn off device" when not in use !!!!   Otherwise, you will experience REPEATED and RANDOM occurences of that USB3 drive going OFFLINE !!!...even, WHEN WORKING!!!