Mac or PC??
Hi Jeff, my machine is a PC. I have also followed the famous recordbreaking long thread on this site about all the Mac issues with the same nVidia Quadro 4000, describing exactly the same errors and concluding that disabling the MPE takes the pressure off the OpenGL engine of the Quadro and should therefore be a workaround. I was hoping that as soon as there would be a Mac solution, the PC solution wouldn't be too far away.
Yet, it seems like I am the only one having this problem on a PC.... but I am sure it has something to do with drivers and the right order of installation. It is almost as if the OpenGL driver is trying to 'double' itself or something, I don't know. Yet the lack of a partner certified nVidia driver for CS6 is something I got quite suspicious about.
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I would not look at Mac issues at all, has no bearing on what happens on the PC side of things. We build turnkey PC systems with Matrox and Quadro 4000 and have not seen issues, and I'm on the Matrox forums daily and not familiar with this either so it seems you have a unique situation there. I would suggest contacting Matrox support directly, as they are very helpful and can remotely view and adjust your system.
Safe Harbor Computers
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disabling the MPE takes the pressure off the OpenGL engine
That sounds strange, because OpenGL and CUDA processing are two different things.
[moved to hardware forum]
Hi Jim Simon,
OK, I understand. So obviously it's a CUDA problem, nevertheless recalling the error screen 'The NVIDIA OpenGL driver detected a problem with the display driver' , this probably means that the nVidia driver is reacting to something else...
but then, I understand that the CUDA driver is included in the nVidia driver itself (that is also functioning for OpenGL)... So it's one aspect of the same driver fighting the other then? And how should Matrox be involved in this...?
Hi Jeff, thanks for the reply. Wow, that would be completely wonderful; I will contact Matrox and see what they can come up with.
And yes, it is a unique situation -sigh- as always, I'm afraid.
I'll be back to report whether this got solved or not. Thanks!
Hi Jim Simon,
It has been a couple of days now and I simply had to return to this forum. I have been struggling with this Matrox-Premiere-nVidia thing for months and have asked many people for advice, from Adobe, nVidia and Matrox. Just a few moments ago I found out, that Adobe Premiere Pro CS6 drivers DO NO LONGER SUPPORT the Matrox RT engine.
This comes to me as a complete surprise. I simply can not believe that, in all this time I spent trying to explain the issue to Adobe experts, NO-ONE ever thought of mentioning this no less than radical change Adobe all of a sudden made to its CS6 version; I never knew this until I coincidentally stumbled upon it on the Matrox website.
It should be pretty obvious this Adobe software change is at least 99% responsible for, if not a 100% cause, of the failures I am experiencing. I always knew that something in PPro must have been changed, although fiercely denied by Adobe. I knew it because CS5 always worked and still does - the problem exists only with CS6 ! So something had to be altered in CS6 and now I have found out WHAT.
Clearly the nVidia card gets stuck because it is receiving huge amounts of data that used to be sent to the Matrox breakout box. Of course, for PC monitoring of the video, the CUDA side of the nVidia card is used, but it cannot both handle PC monitoring AND output to a breakout box it doesn't recognize because it's a Matrox thing.
Is there a way to "tell" the nVidia card it should only process on-screen monitoring signal (within Premiere) and still have the PPro video output sent to the Matrox MX02 ? Simply put, is there still any possibility of monitoring video from PPro on an external monitor at all? And hopefully, by the use of an MX02 ? I'd be delighted to hear.
Adobe Premiere Pro CS6 drivers DO NO LONGER SUPPORT the Matrox RT engine.
should be the other way around:
Matrox NO LONGER SUPPORT Adobe Premiere Pro CS6.
Adobe supplies a program that works perfectly well on its own. If Matrox decides to offer a card or box or whatever, to be used in combination with that program, THEY, Matrox have to supply the drivers to make it work. This is nothing new, l'histoire se repête. Matrox has always been plagued by lagging with their drivers, sometimes with almost a year, but with the increased tempo with which Adobe releases new versions, their problems become more clear. This is mainly the cause that Matrox is not very popular here.
I admire and respect your affection with Adobe, but I can not but haste to inform you that Matrox already has drivers available for download that were specifically designed for Adobe Premiere Pro version 6.0.3.
So they have already met their 'requirements' quite some time ago. Furthermore I think it's both a pity and a missed opportunity to keep stuck with bad experiences from the past without actually looking around in the present. I know about Matrox's Dark Ages, but that was back then. Things have changed, I can assure you.
Of course, I have no other binding to Matrox than the fact I happen to own an MX02 LE, of which I keep reading and hearing that it is especially designed for and working well with Premiere. I seem to be an anomalic exception, which I am trying hard to disqualify for ;-)
I know Premiere works well on its own, but what good is a well-working editing program if you can not monitor it on a regular tv-screen for the sake of quality check? Now Adobe doesn't come up with Break-Out-Boxes of their own, do they? So is it so strange that third parties "decide to offer a card or box or whatsoever" as you call it? If it weren't for this kind of hardware the whole Premiere program would be quite worthless, honestly. Not to be taken seriously in terms of professional editing for let's say, television, with a herd of customers breathing hot breath in your neck while they attempt to judge their precious footage on a minimal section of the same PC monitor that runs the Adobe Premiere program.
Sorry if this sounds a little cynical, but it's soooo easy for a big player on the market like Adobe to push away collegues that provide hardware to make a program like Premiere useable.
Anyway, if there is a way to get Premiere working WITH video output instead of simply "on its own" without investing month salaries, I would have no problem dropping Matrox...
Hi Lewiz, here's the deal with CS6 and Matrox. Adobe has completely changed the way their software interfaces with third-party hardware, whether it be Matrox, Black Magic, AJA, or other vendors. This is not Matrox's doing. With CS6, Adobe introduced the "Mercury Transmit" feature and is now writing the bulk of the code to handle the video i/o with outside hardware, rather than the other way around
Where Matrox and others used to have custom Sequence Presets that were required for Premiere to "see" the third-party hardware, CS6 now allows ANY existing Adobe preset to work with output cards, and Adobe then hands off the video to the card for output. This is nice, making the interface more transparent, plus the controls are more standardized between vendors (all cards are accessed via Edit > Prefs > Player).
The downside to this setup for Matrox is that since Adobe changed the rules, and Matrox is not writing the core drivers, is that the Matrox RT capabilities are no longer exploited. So yes, Matrox effects are no longer RT and do require (a short) render, but this should have NO bearing at all on your Quadro 4000 card as you seem to think.
Please consider that there are likely thousands of MXO2 users out there, using CS6 and Nvidia cards, and yours is the only system that is crashing constantly with the error you see, so this is a unique situation. How can I say that? Because I'm on the Matrox forums everyday, plus we have a LOT of Matrox customers that I interact with, and I USE THIS SETUP myself, and it works JUST FINE.
So I understand that you're trying to make sense of it and have rationalized that since Matrox is no longer RT that it must be the cause of the problem, "overloading" the graphics card somehow, but that line of thinking is totally off base. In fact, the last few months, posts from PC users on the Matrox forum are almost non-existent - everything there is Mac-related right now, which tells me the CS6 drivers for PC are very reliable.
Please contact Matrox support and they should be able to help you get to the bottom of this. I should ask, do you have any third-party plug-ins installed? This could possibly be part of the problem with Nvidia. Also, have you tried running CS6 without Matrox, to see how stable it is, or is not? Only takes 2 minutes to uninstall Matrox and see....
Safe Harbor Computers
well, at least your setup looks impressive. Of course I would like to know what hardware you're using to break video signal out of the computer?
The other thing, and I'm sorry to say but for me, this is the proven end of the negative Matrox saga, is that I just de-installed every trace of Matrox, then installed Premiere CS6 again but IT STILL CRASHES consequently so I am afraid this is really an Adobe-nVidia Quadro 4000 combination issue.
In fact of course, the presence of the Matrox breakoutbox shouldn't be of ANY influence on the functioning of the Adobe MPE. The MPE simply speeds up video processing for Premiere within the PC, but is not at all dependent on whatever breakoutbox. I tested this in Premiere CS5, which works great by the way, and whether I switch the MPE to 'software only' or to 'GPU acceleration' has NO influence on the signal that is sent to the external monitor. So GPU acceleration is not at all necessary in CS5 to be able to use external monitoring, it just speeds up the playback of Premiere with effects or multiple layers and so on.
As Jeff Pulera said, turnkey systems based upon Matrox and the nVidia Quadro 4000 are built every day without any issues, so these crashes I'm experiencing are really still a mystery. But haha, I'm not giving up. Just seen another reaction coming in, I'll read that first. Cheerio!
I contacted Matrox but to no avail yet, although I expect them to reply soon.
Thanks for your explanation; I am indeed trying to make sense of this, very hard at the moment. When you tell me Adobe has rewritten their software to have outside hardware handling the i/o, I wonder if that includes the MPE? I found out, when I de-installed Matrox, the problem persists in exactly the same way. I ALSO found out that with CS5, switching between software only and GPU accelerated makes no difference on Matrox output, as I expected, it simply speeds up Premieres playback when processing effects, multiple layers and so on. So the "Matrox factor" is not really important; the crashes occur with CS6 and nVidia....
You mention third-party plugins, what kind of plugs would that be? Only for Premiere or also for AE, for instance? Like Red Giant plugs? Are there any known 'troublesome' plugins? And is there a way to make sure that the CUDA capabilities of my Nvidia card are actually properly used? Like a GPU activity monitoring or something...? Of course, under CS5 it looks like it's working but just to make sure.
Could a removed version of the Avid Media Composer have left bugging remnants somewhere in the system?
Sorry to bother you with all these speculations, I will also search the registry for Avid keys and stuff.
I don't know of any effects plugins that are known to cause issues, but wanted to ask so that we are considering all possibilities. I do a lot of tech support, and often times when someone has an issue that other people aren't having, it comes down to "What are they doing different?"
I've seen several posts on these forums lately with people saying "I'm trying to export my 10 minute video and it says 30 hours to render, what is wrong with Adobe", but they fail to mention they have applied a third-party DeNoise filter, which takes ungodly amounts of time to render. We need all the facts.
In all honesty, I don't know how much "stuff" you have on your C: drive, but sometimes you are time and money ahead to just reinstall Windows cleanly and be done with the issues. People spend hours, days, weeks, months being dogged by weird issues, when an afternoon of work will often completely revitalize the system and give them their life and sanity back. Just a thought if you can't resolve soon.
Hi Tom. A word to the wise. I had a problem exporting to QT H.264 from PrP on my HP Z820.
With the help of an expert my system went thru the most extensive and thorough troubleshooting process.
When that didnt reveal what was causing the problem I went and did a complete reinstall of Windows and tested things as components were added (I.e., CS6 suite then plugins, etc.)
This process never did identify what was causing the problem, other then the possibility of changes within the QT H.264 codec.
So dont immediately jump into the "wipe the slate clean process" before extensive testing.
I will keep that in mind as the next step. For now, I took out all of the Matrox stuff, manually cleaning the register, and I removed the entire Master Collections 5 and 6 of Adobe, used the Adobe removal tool etc. Up until now the problem persists, it's definitely not a Matrox thing.
So next will be re-installing I guess. Still I'm convinced it's a stupid setting somewhere or a 32/64 bit issue or something. I'll see if I can find anything.
My idea exactly. Thanks for your reply!
My name is Vic from Matrox support. I would love to remotely connect into your computer and try a few things, in order for you to get back to editing, instead of troubleshooting!
If possible, please email email@example.com. In the subject line, put attention Vic, and include the URL of this thread.
I cannot locate you in our database.
If possible, please know which motherboard you have in your PC. I would like to verify drivers, setup, security options, updates etc.
Sometimes a simply making a new windows admin account is all it takes, and logging into it.
I appreciate your offer, thanks !
I must stress the fact however, that this appears to be an nVidia issue rather than Matrox. I de-installed and register-removed every Matrox entry and key yesterday, but to no avail. It seems that somehow CS6 and my nVidia card can NOT work together considering CUDA. The only workaround is to disable the Mercury Playback Engine.
Today I did a full and clean re-install of Windows 7 and first installed the most recent nVidia driver for the Quadro 4000, followed by Adobe Application Manager and with the help of this program I installed Premiere CS6, that is all that's installed on the entire machine as it is now.
Guess what? IT-STILL-DOES-NOT-WORK.....
If it weren't for the fact that CS5 does work with MPE on, I would almost start to think my nVidia 4000 is f*ck*d *p, but this is not possible. Or could it be? And if so, is there a way to check it?
I will contact you somewhere in the near future, my motherboard model is Intel s5520sc.
I tried executing Premiere as administrator, but that didn't solve anything.
It's a continuing story...
Please confirm the nvidia card is in the pci e x16 slot.
Confirm the bios is updated as well.
You should pickup the latest Intel chipset driver too.
On the Intel site, there is a search feature you can download and run, which finds the best drivers for your particular machine.
Would you have access to another graphic card?
Dear, dear people: The endless quest has come to an end.
It seems now that some of you have been pointing in the right direction, although the very details of the cause of this problem are still a little mysterious to me.
Today I received a parcel from the company that built my system. The contents: a brand new Quadro 4000 card. I swapped it with my old Quadro 4000 and everything works like a charm now.
I am still puzzled how it can be possible that, at any given moment, I could start up Premiere CS FIVE and experience no CUDA problems at all, while working with Premiere CS SIX appeared impossible - seemingly due to a proven hardware problem now. But then, the CUDA was still powerful enough for older versions of Premiere? I am still amazed that a graph card can be partially broken... and the defect only becomes visible with newer software... weird.
Anyway, I wish to thank all of you here for helping me with the best of your knowledge and ideas. I am sorry to have wasted so much of your time with something that was as simple as replacing the hardware.... shame on me.
I'd like to take this opportunity to wish you all an incredibly merry Christmas and a very inspiring, creative New Year ! So long!
Thank you for taking the time to reply Tom.
Have a great holiday season.
How are you getting a video signal 'out' to a monitor with your set up? What third party hardware are you using?
Quite simple: Using a nVidia GTX 680/4GB I connect the two monitors over DVI and the TV over HDMI. No additional hardware.
Notice this was taken during the setup stage with two keyboards on the 'Monster', which have now been replaced by a single wireless Logitech K800 illuminated keyboard. The monitor on the left is connected to my 'Beast' over DVI. It is still operational. Have to watch my electricity bill though, with 42 HDD's and 4 BD burners running in both systems.
Thank you so much Harm. I did however notice that that particular graphics card is NOT on the mercurty playback engine approved list? Do you utilize that?
I thank you agian in advance for you response.
Most of the Premiere Pro Benchmarks are from users that do not have cards from
the "approved" list. As long as you do not mind making a small text edit of one
file all the recent nVidia GTX 600 series cards perform fine. Many of the
older cards also can be made to work if they have at least 1 GB of video RAM.
Generally the more CUDA cores the card has the better the performance.
I currently have the nVidia GTX 680/4GB video card installed in my pc. I'm using twin Dell monitors with a SONY professional grade video monitor via HDMI. I am currently having trouble getting all the monitors to play nice together. Idealy, I want the SONY to be my video monitor, while I run Premiere Pro CS6 on the others, how is this done without 3rd party software?
Jive is troublesome tonight. It does not allow me to answer, I'll try again tomorrow.
Good to hear you got your system working again.
You mentioned that your Quadro 4000 cards got swapped out. What was the difference between them? Different Manufacturers etc?
I'm just about to order a Quadro 4000 to go with my Matrox MXO LE MAX system and wouldn't mind knowing which "family" of Quadro4000 card you went with eventually.