24 Replies Latest reply: Apr 2, 2015 10:49 AM by DeniseTQ RSS

    720P 120FPS Sequence Preset

    Toby.Spanton123 Community Member

      Hey

      I'm running Premiere Pro CS6 v6, Installed latest updates, Windows 7 64bit, My source footage is H.264 in a .MP4 format. I'm using a Go Pro Hero 3 Black edition at 720P, 120FPS.

      Is it possible to create a sequence preset for the Go Pro Hero 3 at 720P 120FPS and/or for all the other Resolutions and FPS?

       

      Kind Regards

      Toby

        • 1. Re: 720P 120FPS Sequence Preset
          Ann Bens ACP/MVPs

          Premiere can handle resolutions up to 10,240×8,192, for framerate the maximum is 60 fps.

          Drop your footage in a 1280x720 60 fps sequence and I think it will be ok.

          • 2. Re: 720P 120FPS Sequence Preset
            Steven L. Gotz Community Member

            I suggest you ask the folks at Cineform support for recommendations on editing that footage. They may have a way to deal with it in Premiere Pro. My guess is that you shot at 120 in order to slow it down. Perhaps at some point in the conversion process to the Cineform codec, the Cineform software deals with it. I don't know. I don't have a GoPro camera.

             

            If anyone knows, Jake at Cineform will know. 

            • 3. Re: 720P 120FPS Sequence Preset
              Dave Merchant ACP/MVPs

              At the moment there's no realistic broadcast distribution mechanism for 120p footage, so the only reason for recording in 120p is to play it back in slow-motion or to extract still frames. You can play 120p clips at 'full speed' on a computer (e.g. with Quicktime) but you won't actually paint all 120 frames a second to your screen unless you're on a beast of a machine.

               

              The Hero3 writes its 120p footage at 119.880fps so when you drop it into Premiere Pro it will create a sequence with the highest NTSC frame rate it can handle, of 59.94fps*. That automatically gives you a 2:1 slow motion effect, if you want to play at normal speed you have to sacrifice half your frames (by setting the clip speed to 200%). The only problem with all this halving and doubling is that your audio track will be chewed - it's pretty unimaginable that anyone would want to keep the audio channel from a 120p clip, but if you do, it's best to pull it out as a separate file. Audition CS6 can import 120p video references and plays them at full speed so it's easy enough to slice apart.

               

              *Interestingly, After Effects also has an import limit of 60fps but will reinterpet to 99fps if you ask nicely. It won't go to 120.

               

               

              For those who care, here's a specs dump for a Hero3 720/120p file:

               

              Video

              ID : 1

              Format : AVC

              Format/Info : Advanced Video Codec

              Format profile : High@L4.2

              Format settings, CABAC : Yes

              Format settings, ReFrames : 1 frame

              Format settings, GOP : M=1, N=15

              Codec ID : avc1

              Codec ID/Info : Advanced Video Coding

              Width : 1 280 pixels

              Height : 720 pixels

              Display aspect ratio : 16:9

              Frame rate mode  : Constant

              Frame rate : 119.880 fps

              Original frame rate : 29.970 fps

              Color space  : YUV

              Chroma subsampling : 4:2:0

              Bit depth : 8 bits

              Scan type : Progressive

              Bits/(Pixel*Frame) : 0.281

              Title : Ambarella AVC

               

              Audio

              ID  : 2

              Format : AAC

              Format/Info  : Advanced Audio Codec

              Format profile : LC

              Codec ID : 40

              Bit rate mode : Constant

              Bit rate : 128 Kbps

              Channel(s) : 2 channels

              Channel positions : Front: L R

              Sampling rate : 48.0 KHz

              Compression mode : Lossy

              Title : Ambarella AAC

              • 4. Re: 720P 120FPS Sequence Preset
                SteveHoeg Adobe Employee

                Premiere Pro's renderer is framerate agnostic, don't let the lack of sequence presets stop you. Dragging a 120fps clip to the new sequence icon and internally it will be treated as 120fps.

                • 5. Re: 720P 120FPS Sequence Preset
                  shooternz Community Member

                  I am not convinced that the OP actually understands framerates and so maybe he is under the misbelief that he needs to match his camera framerate to a sequence framerate.

                   

                  It seems more likely that a 1st time poster with a new camera..is more likely to be wanting Slo Motion.

                   

                  A good link to how slo motion and framerates interact might be helpful to him. (Wish I had one for him)

                   

                  Then again...he might really , really want his footage in a 120 fps sequence. ( But that would be a first around these parts)

                  • 6. Re: 720P 120FPS Sequence Preset
                    Dave Merchant ACP/MVPs

                    No it doesn't - as I said it will create a 59.94 sequence and the clip will play back at half-speed.

                    • 7. Re: 720P 120FPS Sequence Preset
                      karl.byrne Community Member

                      Yep it will, 59.94.

                       

                      Not sure if it did the same with the 120fps of the hero 2. would assume it would.

                       

                      My question is that if i drag in the 120 fps right interpet the footage to 30fps, am i doing this on the 120fps or is premiere dropping 60 frames and doing it to the 59.94 fps?

                       

                      cheers

                      • 8. Re: 720P 120FPS Sequence Preset
                        drolzat Community Member

                        I know this is an old thread but if you want to see what's really happening when you drag high framerate footage into a lower framerate sequence, take a look at this video, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W_ry1YAwcIM. Personally, I think frame dropping isn't an acceptable answer to your question so I'm glad you came here to ask about it. Maybe someday Adobe will see the value in being able to render higher framerate footage at its native speed without dropping frames.

                        • 9. Re: 720P 120FPS Sequence Preset
                          Steven L. Gotz Community Member

                          How would that be possible? If I shoot 60 fps and put it on a 30 fps timeline, what should the program do? It sees 60 frames and tried to stuff them into one second. All it can do is drop frames. It can't display to frames in the time that one frame is normally shown. The players would not know how to deal with a variable frame rate video.

                          • 10. Re: 720P 120FPS Sequence Preset
                            drolzat Community Member

                            The solution, as the OP was trying to ask, is for Adobe to create or allow the creation of higher framerate sequences. If you can create a 120fps sequence, you will not drop any frames and your footage will play back as it was shot. You can then use any of the tools available in PP or AE to do as you please with it.

                            • 11. Re: 720P 120FPS Sequence Preset
                              Steven L. Gotz Community Member

                              That makes sense, I suppose. But what players can play back video at that frame rate? I imagine there must be some, but how many and how commonly are they deployed? As stated above, usually 120 fps or 60 fps is usually shot that way to take advantage of the improved slow motion when played at "normal" frame rates.

                               

                              I am not saying that Adobe should not make it possible for one camera, or even a few cameras, to be able to record twice or four times the frame rate of the rest of them, and still play it back at the native frame rate.

                               

                              I am saying that Adobe has finite resources and the actual need to edit it that way is limited by the fact that nobody could actually play it back that way. You could always put in a feature request. Eventually, if enough people do so, the engineering resources could possibly be applied to the problem.

                               

                              But again, if film is 24 frames per second, most video recorders use 24, 25 or 30 frames per second and even my camera can record 59.94 frames per second, the human eye isn't really going to be able to take advantage of something with a frame rate twice as high is it?

                               

                              https://www.adobe.com/cfusion/mmform/index.cfm?name=wishform

                              • 12. Re: 720P 120FPS Sequence Preset
                                zman5874 Community Member

                                I believe what you are wanting is a program like imovie for apple. this video is a very good example of what it does and it does it for 120 fps http://youtu.be/A-Xbtbs0yZc . I've been trying to find the same thing for PC also, but to no avail. everything I find wants the video converted to 30 fps or less first, but I want to be able to edit the 120 fps file before conversion like in the clip above.

                                • 13. Re: 720P 120FPS Sequence Preset
                                  Qengineering Community Member

                                  Um, that video is not playing 120fps in real time, it is "conformed" to a slow-motion rate.

                                  You can accomplish the same task in PrPro by right clicking on the clip in Project, Modify, Interpret Footage and change the frame rate to "Assume this..." and set it to your sequence frame rate.

                                   

                                  If you want to view 120fps at real-time and not skip any frames, you will need a software player, video card and display all capable of 120Hz refresh rates.

                                   

                                  Good luck with that, and let us know if it was worth it.

                                  • 14. Re: 720P 120FPS Sequence Preset
                                    J. Simon Community Member

                                    display capable of 120Hz refresh rates.

                                     

                                    There's the rub.  I've never seen a computer monitor that goes over 60Hz.  And even when a TV can go to 120Hz, it's a special mode that's doubling the normal 60Hz signal, it's not something that the TV is taking in at 120Hz.

                                     

                                    The point of 120 fps is slow motion.  It'd be very difficult to see the full 120 frame rate, so what's the point of worrying about it?  You shoot 120 to slow it down,  If you don't want to slow it down, don't shoot 120.

                                     

                                    Easy, done.

                                    • 15. Re: 720P 120FPS Sequence Preset
                                      zman5874 Community Member

                                      Jim, Q,

                                                   I'm relatively new to in depth video editing, and as such I wasn't fully understanding what I was watching in the video. the part that threw my was that he did pull a clip from the raw 120 fps footage with the Imovie software, but then he used cineform to process the 120 fps clip into a 30 fps clip which he then put back into Imovie to further edit. part of which was actually speeding up parts of the slow motion vid he had rendered with ciniform. I was jumping to the conclusion that I needed software which could slow down parts of a 120 fps clip. Add to that the fact that cineform actually does play the 120 fps vids before rendering them into 60 fps or lower clips and you can see where I was getting confused. totally my bad, but thanks for the quick and well informed response. I will definitely keep this forum as a resource, thanks again.

                                      • 16. Re: 720P 120FPS Sequence Preset
                                        mdrejhon Community Member

                                        >>"I've never seen a computer monitor that goes over 60Hz."

                                         

                                        120Hz monitors are popular among high-end video game players.  There are more than a dozen models avaialble:

                                        http://www.blurbusters.com/faq/120hz-monitors/


                                         

                                        >>"At the moment there's no realistic broadcast distribution mechanism for 120p footage"

                                         

                                        Good news!  The web is now a potential 120fps video distribution medium; and some computer users use 120Hz computer monitors now.  There is now a way to speed up 120fps slow-motion to 120fps real-time, and it was recently discovered that all the popular web browsers (Internet Explorer, Chrome, and the new FireFox 25+) using the <VIDEO> element are now capable of playing back at 120fps in real time on a 120Hz computer monitor:

                                         

                                        http://www.blurbusters.com/faq/real-time-120fps-video

                                         

                                        In general, any machine capable of playing back 1080p@60fps, is easily capable of playing back 720p@120fps.  Both are pretty similiar bitrates.

                                        • 17. Re: 720P 120FPS Sequence Preset
                                          johnorjias Community Member

                                          You can do all this inside Premier

                                           

                                          Not sure why people will always assume they know best instead of just answering the question. Of course if you film at 120 or 240 you will want a sequence to be in 120 or 240 so when you you reduce the speed of the clip to 10% that 240 fps is now 24fps and really smooth. if you put a 240pfs clip in a 30fps sequence it drops all your extra frames and if you slow it down to 10% you will only have around 3fps which looks like crap

                                           

                                          People should not ask why you want to do something a certain way and just answer the question

                                           

                                          Its easy

                                          right click on the clip in the in the project window and select create sequence from clip, then you will have a 240fps or what ever frame rate it was filmed at.  Then once you stretch the clip where ever you want it to be slow mo, you can copy to a master sequence if you have one at a lower framerate where your putting a lot of footage together that is at different speeds, or just export it at the 30fps with out losing any of the frames where you stretched it so you will have 24fps slow motion if you reduce its speed to 10%

                                          • 18. Re: 720P 120FPS Sequence Preset
                                            Steven L. Gotz Community Member

                                            johmorjias,

                                             

                                            You are missing a few important facts.

                                             

                                            If you put a 240fps clip into a 24fps sequence, it will only show every tenth frame. And be VERY choppy. What you need to do is "interpret" the footage to 24fps, then it will play 1/10th as fast, and use all of the frames. By the way, I don't think that Premiere Pro can create a 240fps sequence yet. Perhaps, but I don't think so. Feel free to prove me wrong.

                                             

                                            The reason that experienced users ask what the original poster really wants to do is because often they ask the question in an odd way because they just don't have the right words to use. So we ask, and then we help.

                                             

                                            Perhaps you should check out the information you provide before you type up a post in a forum in an attempt to answer questions.

                                            • 19. Re: 720P 120FPS Sequence Preset
                                              johnorjias Community Member

                                              if you interprat footage to 24fps then the whole clip is changed to 24fps. thats fine if you want to slow down the whole clip. But what if you do not.

                                               

                                              as far as my comment "Not sure why people will always assume they know best instead of just answering the question"

                                               

                                              It was becuase it seemed like the topic was getting off on a tagent of "Why would you want to do that", and "Most hardware will not support it" etc etc instead of just answering the question.

                                               

                                              yes the only reason even I can think of using 120 or 240 its to for slow-mo but that does not mean you may want to slow down the whole clip, you may just not want to have to stop recording everytime and through your camra in 30fps for all your shots you dont want to slow down, if your wearing a gopro and think you may want to slow down a shot as you go off a jump or something, your not going to want to take it off to change the settings while your out there catching a wave, or skiing down a hill. You will record it at 120 and slow down the parts you want and keep the others normal.

                                               

                                               

                                              But as the Adobe Staff parson stated....

                                              Premiere Pro's renderer is framerate agnostic, don't let the lack of sequence presets stop you. Dragging a 120fps clip to the new sequence icon and internally it will be treated as 120fps.

                                               

                                              Which is 100% correct by the way.

                                               

                                              this statemnet


                                              No it doesn't - as I said it will create a 59.94 sequence and the clip will play back at half-speed.


                                              Is not correct.. AT ALL


                                              If you create a sequence from a clip at 120 or 240fps it WILL create a sequence at that frame rate.


                                              you can the edit your footage as normal, you can the slow down the parts you want and everything is there. 


                                              My point is was it seems a lot of people got of on a tangent of saying. "What would you ever want to do that for" instead of just saying how to do it.


                                              and how to do it is "Create a sequence from the clip"


                                              As the Adobe Staff person stated.

                                               

                                              well he said

                                              Premiere Pro's renderer is framerate agnostic, don't let the lack of sequence presets stop you. Dragging a 120fps clip to the new sequence icon and internally it will be treated as 120fps.

                                               

                                              but thats the same as right clicking on the clip in the project and selecting "create squence from clip"

                                               

                                              Sorry If i came across critcal it was not my intention I was just making an observation.

                                               

                                               

                                              And regard to putting a 240 into a 24, i was referring to doing that only after you had finished slowing down any of the parts you wanted to.

                                              If you had a master squence at 24fps or 30 or whatever, that contained what would be the final version of all your clips put together, justt dragging a 240 fps to it would drop frames, but you had alreaded edited your footage on the 240fps sequence and you had already doubled, trippled or whatever any of the frames where you changed the duration of the clip so it will look fine when you move it to a 24fps seq after any time changes were done in the 240fps sequence.

                                               

                                              Screen Shot 2014-10-29 at 9.07.19 PM.png

                                              • 20. Re: 720P 120FPS Sequence Preset
                                                Steven L. Gotz Community Member

                                                I see that you have a 240fps sequence at less than HD. Can you do that at full HD (1920X1080)?

                                                 

                                                In any case, the way to handle slow motion with a 240fps clip is to make a copy in the project and slow it down. If you want to ramp down the speed, do that for a second or two to get to the same speed as the interpreted footage and then cut to the interpreted footage. Just slowing down footage drops frames. You MUST interpret to make it buttery smooth.

                                                • 21. Re: 720P 120FPS Sequence Preset
                                                  johnorjias Community Member

                                                  when you create the sequence from the clip you only get a sequence that is what the clip was, my camera does not do 1080 for 240fps so I can not. So most the time i only do 120FPS, (which is 720) I was just trying somthing wierd with this video, in anycase once done editing i will drag that to a 1080 squence, my results have been looking like butter but i will try the method you suggest, and see if it looks better, if it does I will do it that way. I will give it a try for sure. but it does look realy good the way I have been doing it now as well and seems to look smooth.  But again I am alwasy open to doing something to make it look better.

                                                  the GoPro 4 can do 120FPS at 1080 (but I dont have that yet)

                                                  • 22. Re: 720P 120FPS Sequence Preset
                                                    Damian Major Community Member

                                                    @johnorias, I'm interested in your findings. Did you see any difference in the smoothness of the slow motion after trying interpreting footage? In reading this, your method seems to make more sense, but I've always used interpret. Would love to be able to do this by just dropping into a timeline as you and the Adobe rep suggested. Thanks.

                                                    • 23. Re: 720P 120FPS Sequence Preset
                                                      johnorjias Community Member

                                                      In the few I have done since, I tried both methods and I honestly could not see any improvement using interpret. I could be wrong perhaps my eyes are not good enough but the outcome looked the same to me. So I continue to do it the way I have been doing it. By just creating the sequence from the clip and letting it create a 120fps sequence. I would strongly suggest giving it a try.  Unless I am doing something wrong when trying to use interpret they look the same to me, and my outcome looks really smooth just by creating the sequence using the clip and slowing down the parts I want slowed down.

                                                      • 24. Re: 720P 120FPS Sequence Preset
                                                        DeniseTQ Community Member

                                                        Has anyone had any success with exporting a 120fps sequence from Premiere? Under Export > Media in Premiere I see a max frame rate of 60fps, but I do need 120fps. Any solutions?