29 Replies Latest reply on Dec 20, 2012 8:38 AM by the_wine_snob

    How to "crop" a clip

    fetusticianpj Level 1

      Hi,

      I need help with the following. I edit medical clips and need to remove the patient's identification data on the edges of the clips. I recently upgraded from Premiere 6 to CS6. In the older version the "CROP" tool covered the cropped area with black and was not useful. The tool to use was "Image PAN" that allowed to keep just a portion of the image and discard the areas outside the "Image pan". I would then export the remainder of the clip to its new size. For instance I would start from a 900 by 720 pixel clip and export the area of interest, such as 480 by 360 pixels. In the image i would like to keep just the area in the red box.

      Any ways to do this in CS6 ? Any step-by-step technique ?

      thanks for any suggestions

      help.jpg

        • 1. Re: How to "crop" a clip
          Harm Millaard Level 7

          Select 'Crop' under Effects, drop it on your clip and from the Effects Control panel, adjust the left, right, top and bottom settings. Simple.

          • 2. Re: How to "crop" a clip
            Fuzzy Barsik Level 4

            1. Create custom sequence with 480 x 360 frame size.

            2. Drop your footage into that sequence and align to taste by manipulating Position property within Motion effect.

            3. Export.

            4. Enjoy.

            • 3. Re: How to "crop" a clip
              fetusticianpj Level 1

              Up to that point I had found, but what get is this not what I wanthelp.jpghelp2.jpg

              • 4. Re: How to "crop" a clip
                SAFEHARBOR11 Most Valuable Participant

                Hi PJ,

                 

                I like your handle, that's a new one

                 

                If you use the Crop effect, this just removes the edges and leaves black. Now the area of interest is small on the screen, not what you want.

                 

                You could use the Motion settings and Scale the image until the part you want fills the screen. But, this will pixelize the image as it blows up, and then you are exporting to a smaller size anyway, big quality loss with this workflow.

                 

                I think the best solution is this - create a Custom Sequence to edit in, in this case using the 480x360 size that you intend as the delivery size anyway. Put your clip in the timeline, and right-click and make sure that "Scale to Frame" is NOT checked. Then the image will appear magnified and you will only be seeing the 480x360 portion of the center of the 900x720 clip. You are seeing actual 1:1 pixels at that point, so excellent quality without scaling. If you need to see more of the image, Scale down and you are not losing quality, since you have 900x720 pixels to work with on your smaller canvas. If you need to zoom a little closer, loss will be minimal.

                 

                Then export to whatever format at the same 480x360 sizing and that should provide very good quality

                 

                Thanks

                 

                Jeff Pulera

                Safe Harbor Computers

                • 5. Re: How to "crop" a clip
                  SAFEHARBOR11 Most Valuable Participant

                  Hi Fuzzy,

                   

                  If I weren't so long-winded, you would not have beat me posting! Very nicely put 

                   

                  Jeff

                  • 6. Re: How to "crop" a clip
                    fetusticianpj Level 1

                    Let me try this, but those solutions will require to design the sequence ahead of time. Since the region of interest changes for each clip, this is not vrey practical. It would be easier to grab the corners of the mask and export pixel for pixel the inside only of the mask. Any of you used the old method before ?

                    • 7. Re: How to "crop" a clip
                      Felix CL Level 3

                      just try, what Fuzzy said:

                       

                       

                      Fuzzy Barsik wrote:

                       

                      1. Create custom sequence with 480 x 360 frame size.

                      2. Drop your footage into that sequence and align to taste by manipulating Position property within Motion effect.

                      3. Export.

                      4. Enjoy.

                       

                       

                      this means, that with the clip selected, in the effect controls window, you can scale and align every clip according to it's region of interest...

                      • 8. Re: How to "crop" a clip
                        SAFEHARBOR11 Most Valuable Participant

                        So you're saying that the exported size is going to be dictated by how you crop the image, on a case by case basis? I think it would be better to pick a standard sizing, such as the 480x360 you mentioned, and it is then super quick and easy to apply the Motion scaling to each clip as needed.

                         

                        Maybe I'm not understanding how your old method worked, but it would seem that there would be quality loss as the old method may just have been scaling up the selected region to fit sequence size, but then downscaling again for output.

                         

                        Jeff

                        • 9. Re: How to "crop" a clip
                          Ann Bens Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                          I recently had to edit some sonograms. I work at a vet. practise.

                          I just dropped a black box on the owners/dogs/cats name and let the sonogram stay as it is.

                          Vital information in the sonogram does not always stay in the middle.

                          • 10. Re: How to "crop" a clip
                            fetusticianpj Level 1

                            Indeed all clips are different in size and aspect ratio.

                            In the old system (which i am really considering going back too ! :S) you load teh native clip apply a VIDEO TRANSFORMATION, define the edge you want to keep, get the remaining area size in pixel, and export to a final clip with those measurements. So no loss of resolution at all, just discarding "outside" pixels

                            • 11. Re: How to "crop" a clip
                              fetusticianpj Level 1

                              Thanks Ann, but these clips are for medical lecture and they need to look good, sharp, and focused on the critical information. So i prefer to continue the technique i have been using for the past 15-20 years... just looking for improvement in the tools (actually my old Premiere 4 & 6 are not too compatible with Win7..

                              • 12. Re: How to "crop" a clip
                                Harm Millaard Level 7

                                If you want to keep the maximum sharpness and resolution, don't resize and just accept the black borders you created by cropping. If you don't want the black borders, increase the size by using motion/scale but accept the loss in sharpness. It is either or, not and...

                                • 13. Re: How to "crop" a clip
                                  fetusticianpj Level 1

                                  OK Everyone, thanks for your input. I will reinstall the old version of Premiere 6.1. The image pan had a further advantage that I could track the fetal movement so that when the fetus moves between the begining and end of the clip, I could keep the region of interest centered on the fetus.

                                  Further, I need to export to Flash (to go to Director) and Premiere does not so I still have to go through Sorensen.

                                  So back to old proven technology.

                                  • 14. Re: How to "crop" a clip
                                    SAFEHARBOR11 Most Valuable Participant

                                    You can easily add a few keyframes to Adobe Motion and track the fetus. Is the old way definitely that superior, or is it resistance to change

                                     

                                    Jeff

                                    • 15. Re: How to "crop" a clip
                                      the_wine_snob Level 9

                                      Also, I was certain that CS 6 includes FLV/Flash as an Export option.

                                       

                                      Hunt

                                      • 16. Re: How to "crop" a clip
                                        Felix CL Level 3

                                        fetusticianpj,

                                        let me try to walk you through:


                                        1. the advantage of chosing a sequence resolution that's smaller is that you keep your quality and sharpness..

                                        • if you size an image up over 100% you will always lose sharpness/quality. this can't be brought back by downsizing the upscaled content  on export.
                                        • choose a resolution of about that percentage of the video file that you want to bew full-screen.

                                        2. in the Effect Controls Window you have controls for scaling and moving the clip and these you can keyframe : animate to keep your region of interest centered.

                                        3. go to: File>Export>Media then choose flv or f4v, those are flash.

                                         

                                        But if you wan't to rather work with 6.1,

                                        horses for courses, whatever you wish to work with.

                                        But you miss a lot of the awesomeness of fast working with CS6.

                                         

                                        Message was edited by: Felix CL "it takes me as long as 2 fresh responses from safeharbour and bill to try and form my suggestions in an understandable and proper english..."

                                        • 17. Re: How to "crop" a clip
                                          Fuzzy Barsik Level 4
                                          Is the old way definitely that superior, or is it resistance to change

                                          Guess, the latter... At least, I don't completely understand any argument, including inability to export to Flash...

                                          • 18. Re: How to "crop" a clip
                                            fetusticianpj Level 1

                                            No not superior just frustration with software interface ! Actually I may have no choice as P6 does not run in 64bit W7.

                                            • 19. Re: How to "crop" a clip
                                              SAFEHARBOR11 Most Valuable Participant

                                              Fuzzy Barsik wrote:

                                               

                                              Guess, the latter... At least, I don't completely understand any argument, including inability to export to Flash...

                                              I believe he was referring to when he uses Premiere 6.0 and NOT the new CS6

                                               

                                              Jeff

                                              • 20. Re: How to "crop" a clip
                                                the_wine_snob Level 9

                                                Ah, I suffered from the same confusion, as Fuzzy might have.

                                                 

                                                Now, that makes more sense.

                                                 

                                                Thanks,

                                                 

                                                Hunt

                                                • 21. Re: How to "crop" a clip
                                                  fetusticianpj Level 1

                                                  Sorry for the confusion, I may have to backtrack a little

                                                   

                                                  Those clips go in medical lectures (NO patient's name !) created with Director (more robust then Powerpoint). The current version of Director (11.5) has some incompatibility with some medical programs, so I am still using MX (9).

                                                   

                                                  This version takes SWF flash files not FLV, F4V or others. So I need to output to SWF. By the way i use SWF as those can be embedded in the cast in Director, and not simply "linked" (like Quicktime), as "links" cause confusions to users when they break the "link".

                                                  I did not find a way to do this in Premiere CS6. As best as I found I could not export a custom aspect ratio and pixel size (eg 457by408) in a format that could be converted to SWF.  I use Sorensen to compress to SWF.

                                                   

                                                  Yes I know to keep as exact a  pixel-per-pixel lineage all the way from the medical equipment to Director.

                                                   

                                                  Ultimately I ended up exporting to (yuck) a compressed AVI (this preserve ONE dimentsion and add black pixel to the other), then cropping and converting to SWF. It works but it is not elegant.

                                                   

                                                  So i am open to suggestions on how to open a clip, crop to any size (unknown before opening the clip), and export to SWF with a pixel-pixel preservation.

                                                   

                                                  Thanks...

                                                   

                                                  (am I a little needy ?)

                                                  • 22. Re: How to "crop" a clip
                                                    Fuzzy Barsik Level 4

                                                    Well, that depends on which tools you have at hand.

                                                    E.g. in After Effects you can easily change a composition frame size at any time you want, and you can also export to SWF directly from After Effects...


                                                    • 23. Re: How to "crop" a clip
                                                      Steven L. Gotz Level 5

                                                      OK, I have to put my two cents worth in here. Either I am completely confused or my old friends on this thread are missing the entire point.

                                                       

                                                      PJ, I will call you PJ until told your real name because your screen name is just too, well, medical. Nothing personal, but I have trouble with the title Plebotomist as well.

                                                       

                                                      In any case, I have no idea why anyone would tell you to edit to a certain size when all you have to do is crop the output just before you export it. Now, I must say that I very highly recommend that you export to a frame size where both dimensions are evenly divisible by 8. You don't really want the details, is my guess, so just trust me on that one. 480X360 is a good choice.

                                                       

                                                      Ah, but how do I crop on export you say?

                                                       

                                                      Simple.

                                                       

                                                      I don't have any video with 900X720 frames, so I just copied your image from up above and scaled it up in Photoshop to 900X720.  Make sense so far? Good.

                                                       

                                                      I imported the scaled up image into Premiere Pro and dropped it on the New button to create a new sequence based on the image.  Still with me?

                                                       

                                                      Now that I have the image (or clip) on the correct size sequence for my source material, just assume I did whatever you do to put titles on it, or color correct it or whatever and now it is time to export.

                                                       

                                                      In the Export Settings window that comes up, I move over to click on the Source tab instead of looking at the Output tab. I select the crop tool. Then I use the drop down arrow next to Crop Proportions and choose the 4:3 ratio because you indicated that would be good for you, right? There are many other choices. Try to be careful and size the box to 480X360 so you get a better output. But if that is not the right size, you might want to scale the video up or down a little as required. Or not, if you are happy with the output quality.

                                                       

                                                      Capture.PNGCapture.PNG

                                                      Now click on the Output tab and select "Change Output Size To Match Source". Notice that the frame size over on the right changes to 480X360.

                                                       

                                                      Capture.PNG

                                                       

                                                      Sorry about your red lines but as you can see, my output is a perfect 4:3 while your red box is not.

                                                       

                                                      Now all you have to do is import the FLV file into Flash, put it on a stage and export as SWF. Or export to something Sorenson likes and let Sorenson convert to SWF.

                                                       

                                                      Simple. Just like I said. Right?

                                                       

                                                      Now, is that what you really wanted or am I the one who is confused?

                                                       

                                                      -- Steven

                                                      • 24. Re: How to "crop" a clip
                                                        Fuzzy Barsik Level 4
                                                        I have no idea why anyone would tell you to edit to a certain size when all you have to do is crop the output just before you export it

                                                        My personal point is in much less control over what is in the frame while editing.

                                                        • 25. Re: How to "crop" a clip
                                                          Steven L. Gotz Level 5

                                                          Fuzzy,

                                                           

                                                          I certainly meant no offense, but in this particular case, I think you were all making it a lot harder than the unusual content required.

                                                           

                                                          A quick story to illustrate my point.

                                                           

                                                          A five year old boy comes home from his new school in San Francisco one day and asks his mother "Where did I come from?". The intelligent,  concientious, caring mother sits the child down to give him the long talk about procreation.  After a while, she realizes that his focus is wandering.  Just then, his blue collar, hard working and often rough around the edges father comes walking in the door. The little boy runs to hug his father, who picks him up and tosses him in the air with all the love in the world focused on his boy. His heir. His son!

                                                           

                                                          The little boys asks "Daddy, where did I come from?". The father says in a heavily accented voice "Brooklyn, why?". The child responds, "because Jimmy, that kid with the funny accent, says he is from New Orleans and that I am the one who talks funny".

                                                           

                                                          In any case, sometimes the simple solution is the one that some people are looking for. For many years, my specialty at work was to figure out why the customer was asking the question. Many times answering the question that is asked is actually counterproductive, as illustrated by the story about the little boy. Sometimes you really need to know why the question is being asked. I think I did that this time. Maybe not. We'll see if PJ comes back and let's us know.

                                                           

                                                          -- Steven

                                                          • 26. Re: How to "crop" a clip
                                                            Fuzzy Barsik Level 4

                                                            Steven, I've never taken your comment as offensive, I simply explained my point of view: manipulating crop within export settings dialog box is much less convenient compared to monitoring what is in the frame while editing the timeline.

                                                            • 27. Re: How to "crop" a clip
                                                              fetusticianpj Level 1

                                                              He he I agree completely with Steven: 1) try the simple things first, 2) understand the reasons why (good in Medicine and in computers too!)

                                                              Yes PJ is perfect that is what I am called around. I had to make it longer at some point for some Adobe registration requirement if i remember correctly...

                                                               

                                                              Steven, remember that one of the unusual situation I have is that ALL the clips happen to be different size.

                                                              If you want to see how those clip end up looking here is a sample (360 MB I am afraid)

                                                               

                                                              http://www.box.net/shared/y9o45vh0kq

                                                               

                                                              Let me try all the suggestions above, you guys provide answer faster than I can try them

                                                              • 28. Re: How to "crop" a clip
                                                                Steven L. Gotz Level 5

                                                                PJ,

                                                                 

                                                                That just means that you can't really worry about the actual size of the image. If it isn't evenly divisible by 8 then so be it.

                                                                 

                                                                You will not be able to combine different images into the same export if they all need to be different sizes.  You will have to export each different size video individually.

                                                                 

                                                                However, I just thought of a possible way for you to do what you want without having any size issues at all.

                                                                 

                                                                Just crop each image in the timeline but instead of exporting with various size black borders, export as a 32 bit video using an Alpha channel. Meaning that the black borders would be transparent in the right application. If Director takes the alpha channel into account, then you should be good to go.

                                                                 

                                                                Or, for that matter, perhaps you should be doing all your work in Flash instead of Premiere Pro to begin with. Set up your stage, animate everything, and export as SWF. Simple.

                                                                • 29. Re: How to "crop" a clip
                                                                  the_wine_snob Level 9

                                                                  Steven,

                                                                   

                                                                  I think that you have made a good call, with the 32-bit Alpha Channel output.

                                                                   

                                                                  Nice one, that I would not have thought of.

                                                                   

                                                                  Appreciated,

                                                                   

                                                                  Hunt