29 Replies Latest reply: Jan 8, 2013 9:03 AM by LadyCharlyTX RSS

    Strange things happening to Sepia images in Lr 4.3

    LadyCharlyTX

      I'm at my wits end and hope someone can help me out! I've spent hours and hours with Adobe tech support only to have a hard time understanding the thick accents and none knowledgeable enough to figure out the issue. And my case was dropped due to schedules; I was busy with Thanksgiving which seemed to make no difference to one who doesn't celebrate it! But I digress...

       

      I really don't remember this happening in Lr 3.5, but it is in Lr 4.1-3 and only effects Sepia toned images I edit for the most part. Just finished about 200 images from an event where I will put them on a DVD to music for purchase. They all looked fine when I finished with them. I exported them as JPEGs, long side 1024, quality 74. The rest of the long story short, iMovie made them look awful, opted for iDVD. First time viewing them all was good, but after multiple viewings after rearranging/adding/deleting images from the project, they look like crap. For some very strange reason, many took on a pinkish/reddish coloration and often will introduce artifacts that simply weren't there in Lr. I viewed my edited images on 2 other Mac's and the issue remains, so not my computer.

       

      I have an 27" iMac, OS 10.6.8 (completed up-to-date), 3.3GHz duo core, 12GB RAM, 960GB of free space on a 1TB HDD. Under warranty the display and recalled hard drive have been replaced, so my Lr 4.3 is completely fresh; not from a backup. With the new HDD recent, I haven't calibrated my computer as of yet. My images are on a WD 3TB with 1.25TB of free space (a tad on the low side but shouldn't effect anything). My camera is a Sony A33 and I shoot strictly in RAW set for sRGB; using ProPhoto in Lr and for sometime now only in Manual.

       

      I would be so appreciative if anyone can explain why this is an issue. I need to finish off this DVD for the event and if I cannot figure this out, it's lost time and money! Admittedly I haven't been doing this for very long, so if it's something I'm doing wrong, I'd really like to know what it is...

       

      Here are my examples:

       

      Screen shot of image in Develop Module

       

      Screen shot 2013-01-01 at 10.38.05 AM.jpg

       

      Exported JPEG (coloration/banding is evident in upper right quadrant)

       

      20121215-3913.jpg

        • 1. Re: Strange things happening to Sepia images in Lr 4.3
          web-weaver Community Member

          I don't have an answer for you but here's what I'm thinking:

           

          You say that the probelm occurs with JPGS that were exported from Lr with quality 74 and a pixel dimension of 1024 pixels on the long side.

          And you say that the problem arose "after multiple viewings after rearranging/adding/deleting images from the project".

           

          Question: Did this "rearranging/adding/deleting images from the project" involve saving these JPGs mutiple times?

          I assume you know that the JPG file-format applies a "lossy" compression. "Lossy" means that image information is discarded and cannot be retrieved. Each time the JPG is re-saved more information is discarded, so that after several savings there is so little information left that the images "look like crap" .

          • 2. Re: Strange things happening to Sepia images in Lr 4.3
            Jao vdL MVP

            You should use higher quality on the jpeg export. 74 will often show banding. Secondly, iMovie and iDVD are absolutely terrible at slideshows. They really lower the quality terribly. iMovie generates a low resolution jpeg copy from your original, introducing scaling artefacts. It also does a terrible terrible job at gamma correcting the images, introducing horrible posterization. You can mitigate the first problem by exporting higher resolution from Lightroom, but that is not fool-proof. The second problem cannot be fixed. It is just really terrible and you would need to use something different like Final Cut or Adobe's Premiere. There really is no fix in iMovie. iDVD is also terrible but for another reason. standard DVDs can only contain a maximum resolution of 720x480 pixels (on NTSC discs). Needless to say, that is really terrible quality and will not work well for your purpose. Unfortunately, if you want a DVD that will play on set top box DVDs there is nothing you can do about that as it is a limitation of the medium.

             

            For your purpose, I would recommend you do one of the two following things.

             

            I. Create the slideshow in Lightroom in the slideshow module. Export to a 1080p (or 720p) H264 mov file (export Video Slideshow in the slideshow menu) while set to music. Simply burn the resulting file on a CD or DVD from the finder. This will play in any current computer. It will also play on many BluRay players with superb quality. The only limitations of this method are that you cannot pan and zoom and that you can only use a single track as background music.

             

            II. Export the images at fairly high resolution (say 2000-3000 pixels on the long side) with output sharpening. Import the exported images into iPhoto. Create a slideshow, set the aspect ratio to 16:9 (in the settings box) set to music to a track or a playlist, define the pans and zooms, and set the transitions (dissolve is usually the best) and hit export. In the dialog, uncheck "Automatically send slideshow to iTunes". Hit the Custom Export button. As format, select Movie to MPEG4. Hit the "options" button, select "MP4" in file format, in video format, select H264, set the image size to 1920x1080 HD. Set the Data rate to something more reasonable than the very low rate it defaults to such as 4000 kbit/s or so. The higher the better but you don't want to go higher than 10 Mbit/s. You can burn this to disc in the finder just like above. This is an onerous method but gives nice pans and zooms and you can set the slideshow to a playlist of songs.

            • 3. Re: Strange things happening to Sepia images in Lr 4.3
              LadyCharlyTX Community Member

              To be honest, this is the first time I've done this. But now that you mentioned it, if I had to save the project after making adjustments to how it looks, perhaps it does resave the images? I didn't even think it would have affect the images, but that makes a lot of sense. Which of course means degraded images with each save. Duh! Now I feel really stupid... Guess this newbie should've done extensive research on what I was doing. But with this a fairly time sensitive shoot (was asked while at the event to do this and never did it before), I just thought it wouldn't be this much work or difficulty. lol I was so pleased at getting better at capturing images correctly, had very little editing to do on this first event batch, when it all went awry, I was just sickened... Thanks web-weaver!

              • 4. Re: Strange things happening to Sepia images in Lr 4.3
                LadyCharlyTX Community Member

                Wow, I really appreciate all the information! Ok first thing I need to do is purchase Final Cut or Adobe's Premiere (I will check them out today!). I'm not sure I fully understand about the DVDs though. Are you saying the burn will be superb if I use FC or AP, but not iM or iDVD? Or are you saying I need a special disk when I burn. Sorry, but I'm clueless to doing this.

                 

                I never have used iPhoto, so Lr Slideshow it is. Only reason I didn't use that to begin with it was my understanding you can only use 1 song and this DVD will have about 10-12 used on it. So the event DVD will be more like a production, not just a bunch of images slapped onto it willy-nilly. I want my DVDs to look spectacular and have the music sound good too. So do I stick with Lr's Slideshow or get the better Photo DVD creator software? Thanks so much Jao vdL!

                • 5. Re: Strange things happening to Sepia images in Lr 4.3
                  Jao vdL MVP

                  > Are you saying the burn will be superb if I use FC or AP, but not iM or iDVD? Or are you saying I need a special disk when I burn. Sorry, but I'm clueless to doing this.

                   

                  There are two issues. First is that iMovie is terrible with still images because of a bug that has been in there for as long as iMovie exists and that they refuse to fix. It appears to do two gamma conversions in a row back and forth that result in posterized dark areas and that is a holdover from the days when Macs used gamma 1.8 on their displays. So don't use iMovie for stills. FC and AP don't have this problem, but they both do not solve the second problem. That is, if you burn a video DVD using ANY software suite, you run into a limitation of video DVDs. You cannot get more than single definition video on video DVDs which have a max of 480 lines of vertical resolution (for NTSC DVDs - the US standard). The DVD burning software converts your video (or your series of stills) to MPEG2 video at those 480 lines and puts that on the DVD. The nice thing about this is that you can play the disc using any DVD set top player connected to any TV. The bad thing is that for still images, the resolution is pitiful and your images will look terribly pixelated. This is true for whatever video editing and DVD authoring software you use. What you really need is HD video. Unfortunately, there are no cheap consumer oriented BluRay authoring software packages and especially not for the Mac, so you cannot generate (easily at least) a BluRay disc on your Mac. What you can do is burn a data CD or DVD with a simple high definition movie file on it. This will play on most computers and will even play on some BluRay set top box players. The latter will look superb on a good high def TV. As I explained above, you can generate such movie files directly from Lightroom or using the iPhoto hack. There are also several low-price software packages that do it but I don't have much experience with them. So there is generally no need for an expensive video editing suite.

                  • 6. Re: Strange things happening to Sepia images in Lr 4.3
                    LadyCharlyTX Community Member

                    Once again Jao, I really appreciate your help and time! So to verify I'm understanding all this correctly:

                     

                    1. Merge all songs into 1 track to use in Lr Slideshow (remembered I could do this this morning... duh!)

                    2. Arrange images as I like

                    3. Once I like what I have produced, export as an H.264 .mov file

                    4. Burn a data DVD

                    5. This DVD will play on all modern computers (PC and Mac) and many Bluray players. It will look superb!

                     

                    Last questions:

                     

                    1. What would I use to burn the DVD? Obviously I wouldn't use iDVD don't think anyways. So get something like Burn? I mean I certainly don't want to degrade what I've created.

                    2. If I created .JPEG or .TIFF files for my opening/ending credits and Special Thanks To in PS, I can import/insert them where I want within the images in Lr correct?

                    • 7. Re: Strange things happening to Sepia images in Lr 4.3
                      Jao vdL MVP

                      Your summary is all correct. One small addition that I would make I

                      describe in another thread about slideshows skipping on this forum

                      yesterday. I run the exported 1080p movie file through a program called

                      handbrake that you can find on the web by googling for it. I just use the

                      default settings on it and you will get a much smaller and potentially more

                      compatible file out of it with basically no loss of quality. I burn that

                      file on a USB stick or a CD or DVD. People really seem to like those discs

                      as they play in many BluRay players on their high def TVs. Many TVs and

                      bluray players now come with USB slots that you can just stick the USB

                      stick into and play the H264 movie files from with the caveat that the

                      default Lightroom export often seems to be of too high a bitrate making the

                      movie skip frames and stutter. The handbrake trick fixes that.

                       

                      1. The finder can burn DVDs. Simply insert a blank DVD, choose to let the

                      finder handle it, drag the file onto the disc icon or into the finder

                      window that will open and hit the burn button on the opened finder window.

                       

                      2. Absolutely. You can also use the built in opening and ending screens but

                      they are not that flexible. With the outside graphics, the trick is to

                      create a collection that you set to user order and insert the slides at the

                      beginning and end. Then create a slideshow from that.

                       

                      One of the disadvantages of Lightroom is that the slideshow quality is not

                      that great even with HD exports. It doesn't seem to sharpen the images at

                      the final resolution so they stay slightly soft. There are tricks around

                      this but they all involve a lot of work. Basically what you do is crop all

                      your images to a landscape 16:9 ratio. Export them to 1920x1080 pixel

                      images (i.e. 1080p standard) with output sharpening applied. Import those

                      into Lightroom and generate a slideshow from those. That is onerous indeed

                      and the reason why I also told you about iPhoto which outputs sharper video

                      without tricks. That said, nobody but crazy photographers notices this but

                      I do find this a real annoyance with Lightroom as I am a bit of a

                      perfectionist when it comes to my images.

                       

                      Sent from my iPad

                      • 8. Re: Strange things happening to Sepia images in Lr 4.3
                        LadyCharlyTX Community Member

                        I really cannot thank you enough Jao! I now think I have a handle on all this. lol Guess the final product will tell me for sure.

                         

                        One last thing though. You brought up something I didn't even think of. If I were to leave all my images at the size they are now and export at H.264, are you saying it would make them look incorrect by cutting them off? Meaning they will not keep the size, so I need to crop to 1080p? And if that is the case, any chance it will look good in full screen 4:3 (I believe it is) with my images as they are whether that be on a computer or HD TV?

                         

                        The reason I'm asking is many of my shots would be considered tight. There wasn't much room around to get the compositions large enough to look good at the 1080p size. So many of my images from this event would be a challenge to crop to 1080p and still maintain their look. Hope this makes sense.

                         

                        Yes I do understand most won't notice the small things that we photogs would, but that said, I'm a perfectionist too.

                        • 9. Re: Strange things happening to Sepia images in Lr 4.3
                          Jao vdL MVP

                          You only need to crop if you set the slideshow to have images scale to fill

                          the entire area. The default slideshow layout doesn't do this and you'll

                          get bars at the side or at the top if the aspect is not 16:9. The default

                          1080p export gives you video at 1920x1080 pixels, which is the standard

                          16:9 aspect ratio of hi def TVs and most computer displays nowadays. If you

                          have a 4:3 tv it is probably not high definition and normal DVD format of

                          480 lines of resolution is probably as good as it gets on that tv and

                          you'll probably get the best quality by simply feeding the Lightroom export

                          into iDVD. Computers of course generally do fine with whatever you feed

                          them as most displays are better than 720p. So if your audience is people

                          with high def TVs and bluray players or computers, burn the movie file

                          directly on a disc or a USB stick. If your audience is people with non high

                          def TVs and simple (non BluRay) DVD players, iDVD will work fine.

                           

                          Probably you just need to experiment.

                           

                          Sent from my iPad

                          • 10. Re: Strange things happening to Sepia images in Lr 4.3
                            LadyCharlyTX Community Member

                            Perfect! Again my many thanks for helping out this stupid newbie to all of this! You're a darlin'!

                            • 11. Re: Strange things happening to Sepia images in Lr 4.3
                              trshaner MVP

                              Jao vdL wrote:

                               

                               

                              One of the disadvantages of Lightroom is that the slideshow quality is not

                              that great even with HD exports. It doesn't seem to sharpen the images at

                              the final resolution so they stay slightly soft. There are tricks around

                              this but they all involve a lot of work. Basically what you do is crop all

                              your images to a landscape 16:9 ratio. Export them to 1920x1080 pixel

                              images (i.e. 1080p standard) with output sharpening applied. Import those

                              into Lightroom and generate a slideshow from those.

                               

                              This has been issue with the LR Slideshow module as far back as I can remember. On Mac systems the Bicubic algorithm (Good) is used to resize images, but then no sharpening is applied to the images. On Windows systems the Nearest Neighbor algorithm (Ugly) is used to resize images with no sharpening applied. Nearest Neighbor images look sharp, but suffer from "jaggies" in diagonal lines. More details here if you're feeling very bored and have nothing better to do:

                               

                              http://forums.adobe.com/message/3092489#3092489

                               

                              The only way around this is to follows Jao's suggestion or simply use another application to create your slideshow. Fortunately, LR's Export module does a very good job of resizing and sharpening images to your liking, which can then be reimported back into the LR Slideshow module or another application. If you choose Jao's suggestion make sure the image 'Height' is exactly the height inside the Slideshow template's frame.

                               

                              Example- The LR 'Widescreen' template fits to the image height, so you would use Export> Width & Height = 1920 x 1080 for making a 1080p video. Other templates that place a border above or below the image will require using a smaller height that matches the actual image size in the template. The Widescreen template with images cropped to the 16:9 aspect ratio provides the largest image size and best overall appearance onscreen.

                               

                              And the most important issue with the LR Slideshow module concerns using of the 'Stroke Border:'

                               

                              Make sure that 'Stroke Border' is unchecked since even a 1 px border will cause your Slideshow exports to appear soft. See the above link for more details. I have confirmed that LR4.3 still has this issue!

                              • 12. Re: Strange things happening to Sepia images in Lr 4.3
                                LadyCharlyTX Community Member

                                Well after some frustration, I played my images in LR Slideshow with music playing in background in a playlist, since I haven't joined them yet. Most of the images look great! But...why does there always need to be a but? I have 2 questions:

                                 

                                1. Why do a few still have that reddish/pinkish banding?

                                 

                                2. When I arranged all the images in Library they were exposed how they should be. So why do some of them show as overexposed (a few way overexposed) when played in Slideshow?

                                 

                                Note: I have not exported anything; no images or video. This is just what I see when playing in through Lr Slideshow from the Library.

                                • 13. Re: Strange things happening to Sepia images in Lr 4.3
                                  trshaner MVP

                                  This is starting to sound like you have issues with your display icc profile. SInce you haven't claibrated your monitor there has to be some ICC profile assisgned to it by your OS, which apparently is not compatible with LR. The quickest test for this is to assign a standard sRGB.icc profile to your display and see what the images look like both inside and outside of LR. I'm not a Mac user so perhaps somone watching here can tell you how.

                                   

                                  Your best option is to hardware calibrate your monitor, since the lumincance level and color calibration are probably way off the target 100-120cd/M2 and 6500K color temperature. This is why we here things like, "Why are my prints dark," How come my prints have a yellow tint (or whatever color shift)."

                                  • 14. Re: Strange things happening to Sepia images in Lr 4.3
                                    Jao vdL MVP

                                    It is extremely rare for the system-supplied display profile of a built in screen on a Mac to be bad. I basically have not seen that yet. You're still better of calibrating but the built in profile is usually not terrible. To check it, go into system preferences, hit the displays button and click on the color tab. If you're not calibrated, it will show Color LCD there, which is the Apple-supplied profile.

                                     

                                    The symptoms LadyCharlyTX describes sound different than a bad profile to me, but more like the previews not being up-to-date and some Develop settings not being applied yet. One thing to do before generating the slideshow is to generate 1:1 previews for all the images or to set the standard previews to the largest size and quality and regenerate the standard previews. See if that solves the issue.

                                    • 15. Re: Strange things happening to Sepia images in Lr 4.3
                                      LadyCharlyTX Community Member

                                      Thanks so much guys for replying! Sorry to be a bother, but really appreciate you helping out this newbie!

                                       

                                      1. I opened up the displays color profile, ColorSync Utility opened. I ran a verify which showed 6 bad files from Adobe. It says to make a backup of profiles before I run Repair, but I don't know where to find them to do that. Any ideas?

                                       

                                      2. As to 1:1 previews. I presume I'm to click through all my 180 images and click on the 1:1 above Navigator and allow them to render when I see the Loading... Then I should view the images to Fit Frame and take them to Slideshow. Is that correct? (Edit: So figured while I was waiting I'd do as I stated with my images to get ahead start. Strange thing; after the Loading... goes away, the images are extremely soft, something are pixelated, then after 1-3 sec. the image is clear. Gosh I'm so frustrated with this!)

                                       

                                      3. Prior to getting a new Display and hard drive due to a recall, I had purchased Spyder4Elite. Absolutely hated it due to making my screen look red. Haven't tried it since the new HDD, but reckon I should give it ago. But like you said Jao, the iMac color profile on the 27" desktop has beautiful colors that are pretty darn true.

                                       

                                      4. I've had this iMac in to the shop under warranty so many times. I keep telling them the graphics card isn't any good, but all tests show it's good. When I took my WD 3TB EXHDD in and plugged it into a MBP the images I exported straight out of Lr 4.2 or 4.3 that had the pinkish/reddish coloring/banding showed up on it to. But the guy did say he was at a loss as to the cause unless my iMac is possessed! lol That definitely was no help.

                                      • 16. Re: Strange things happening to Sepia images in Lr 4.3
                                        trshaner MVP

                                        To make 1:1 previews:

                                         

                                        In the Library module grid view select all the images that need previews, then go to toolbar Library> Previews> Render 1:1 Previews.

                                         

                                        What profile is currently assigned to your 27" display?

                                        • 17. Re: Strange things happening to Sepia images in Lr 4.3
                                          Jao vdL MVP

                                          1. They are being overly cautious. You can do repair on the profiles but as

                                          long as your display profile is not the one it flags you should be fine.

                                           

                                          2. No you can create 1:1 previews with one click. Select all your images

                                          and go to the Library menu -> Previews -> Render 1:1 Previews

                                           

                                          3. In general, for most displays, after calibration your screen will look

                                          somewhat warmer and more saturated. You usually want to calibrate to D65

                                          (6500 K) which is the default option in the Spyder software. Note that even

                                          though the built in profiles on Macs are not bad, they are still not

                                          anywhere near perfect and the result of the Spyder (if it is not a broken

                                          one) is the one you should trust.

                                           

                                          4. That is a little worrisome. I don't really understand what you are

                                          saying here. Are you saying that the same exported images with the same

                                          develop settings that look wrong on your machine look normal on the MBP you

                                          tried in the shop? That could be a bad display profile indeed or a problem

                                          with the videocard. If it tests normally than the card is probably OK and I

                                          would really urge you to calibrate your display using the Spyder.

                                          • 18. Re: Strange things happening to Sepia images in Lr 4.3
                                            LadyCharlyTX Community Member

                                            Thanks trshaner, that was so easy!

                                             

                                            I have 3 profiles listed on the iMac; 2 are called Display and other is iMac which is what I use. In the profile it says:

                                             

                                            Size: 6296

                                            Preferred CMM: Apple

                                            Specification Version: 2.1.0

                                            Class: Display

                                            Space: RGB

                                            PCS: XYZ

                                            Created: 1/3/13 8:07pm (not sure why that is since I've not touched it nor have I installed any updates)

                                            Platform: Apple

                                            Device Manufacturer: (it's blank)

                                            Device Model: (it's blank)

                                            Device Attributes: 00000000 00000000

                                            Rendering Intent: Perceptual

                                            PCS Illuminant: 0.96420, 1.00000, 0.82491

                                            Creator: Apple

                                            MDS Signature: (it's blank)

                                            • 19. Re: Strange things happening to Sepia images in Lr 4.3
                                              LadyCharlyTX Community Member

                                              Jao, when I look at my B&W images, I expect them to be B&W not have a reddish (a couple of times greenish) tint which is what the previous calibrations with Spyder rendered. Now admittedly, I use Spyder with default settings and this is the first time I've ever calibrated displays, but still shouldn't it be close to normal looking?

                                               

                                              A few weeks ago I talk to a DataColor rep at a camera expo. He said the only reason he could think of as to why I keep getting the red tint after calibration with S4E is if the video card was bad. lol Now see why I'm so frustrated and ready to chuck everything?

                                               

                                              No the exported JPEGs w/the issues had them when I viewed some on the MBP. They couldn't or perhaps I should say wouldn't, install Lr 4 as a trial for me to test my catalog images.

                                              • 20. Re: Strange things happening to Sepia images in Lr 4.3
                                                Jao vdL MVP

                                                A well-calibrated screen should appear completely neutral in greyscale

                                                images. Certainly no tint should be visible. If after calibration you get

                                                that, something is seriously wrong with either the calibrator or your

                                                display. A Spyder and certainly the Elite should be able to get your

                                                display completely neutral looking.

                                                 

                                                Do you have an Apple Store anywhere in your vicinity? They will generally

                                                allow you to run other software to test if you ask nicely (they wipe their

                                                machines completely every day so it's not a big deal to them) and I have

                                                seen Lightroom on their machines before. You can also take one of your

                                                trouble images (export to lossy dng!) and put it in a place where we can

                                                download it to test such as a dropbox public folder.

                                                • 21. Re: Strange things happening to Sepia images in Lr 4.3
                                                  LadyCharlyTX Community Member

                                                  Yanno I put out the bucks for the Elite thinking how could I go wrong? But even after they replaced the display I couldn't get it to calibrate at all where my B&W were neutral w/o a tint of some sort. Thus why I gave up. Tomorrow, I will try it again. If I get the same thing, I will contact DataColor about a replacement. Although after all the months of hoopla I've gone through, not sure they'll do that.

                                                   

                                                  Yes as I said, I've had this iMac in to the store "a lot"! I spent near 3K for this and since I started photography and working images, it's been one headache after another. Perhaps it's just me not knowing what the heck I'm doing, but I really am fairly computer savvy compared to many and I'm absolutely stumped. Albeit everyone keeps blaming it on the fact that I shoot with a Sony, which is BS in my humble opinion!

                                                   

                                                  Well I just looked over the 1:1 renders and not sure I see that coloration any more. Gosh seems the 1:1 previews cured the issue! But to be absolutely sure, I will run the 40 min. slideshow once again. If I still see the issue, what program/url would I use to drop a bad image into?

                                                   

                                                  Thanks ever so much for your time!!!

                                                  • 22. Re: Strange things happening to Sepia images in Lr 4.3
                                                    trshaner MVP

                                                    Good to hear! In the future you can do the same thing by selecting all of the images for your slideshow (or whatever) and having LR update the 1:1 previews. Don't worry, it will only update those images that have Develop module changes.

                                                    • 23. Re: Strange things happening to Sepia images in Lr 4.3
                                                      LadyCharlyTX Community Member

                                                      Darn it, I spoke too soon! Still have images with the issues on them.

                                                       

                                                      Strange happenings:

                                                       

                                                      1. In Library, all are exposed properly.

                                                       

                                                      2. In Slideshow the exposure is changed to where some have blown out bits.

                                                       

                                                      3. Those images with the issues don't seem to have them while in Develop Module or it is significantly reduced.

                                                       

                                                      4. Some images that didn't show issues in Library did in Slideshow.

                                                       

                                                      5. My head hurts! lol I'm calling it a day and will be back at it first thing in the morning..... I will calibrate with S4E to see if that works. Will send a lossy .dng once I know where.

                                                       

                                                       

                                                      BTW here's what the verification on bad files said in ColorSync Utility:

                                                       

                                                      Searching for profiles...

                                                      Checking 66 profiles...

                                                      /Library/Application Support/Adobe/Color/Profiles/AnimePalette.icc

                                                         Header message digest (MD5) is not correct.

                                                      /Library/Application Support/Adobe/Color/Profiles/ColorNegative.icc

                                                         Header message digest (MD5) is not correct.

                                                      /Library/Application Support/Adobe/Color/Profiles/RedBlueYelllow.icc

                                                         Tag 'pseq': Required tag is not present.

                                                      /Library/Application Support/Adobe/Color/Profiles/Smokey.icc

                                                         Tag 'pseq': Required tag is not present.

                                                      /Library/Application Support/Adobe/Color/Profiles/TealMagentaGold.icc

                                                         Tag 'pseq': Required tag is not present.

                                                      /Library/Application Support/Adobe/Color/Profiles/TotalInkPreview.icc

                                                         Tag 'pseq': Required tag is not present.

                                                      Verify done - found 6 bad profiles.

                                                       

                                                      And yet again, thanks so very much for all your help guys!

                                                      • 24. Re: Strange things happening to Sepia images in Lr 4.3
                                                        Jao vdL MVP

                                                        That all doesn't make sense. The images in Slideshow are rendered from the

                                                        exact same previews as are used in Library. They should be identical. Does

                                                        the same issue occur when you create a fresh empty catalog and put the

                                                        images in there?

                                                        • 25. Re: Strange things happening to Sepia images in Lr 4.3
                                                          LadyCharlyTX Community Member

                                                          I thought images should look the same whether in Library, Develop or Slideshow, but that is not the case for me.

                                                           

                                                          There's not many images in this catalog and to be honest, not sure a new catalog will bring in the VC that I'm working off of. Can you tell me if it will?

                                                          • 26. Re: Strange things happening to Sepia images in Lr 4.3
                                                            Jao vdL MVP

                                                            >I thought images should look the same whether in Library, Develop or Slideshow, but that is not the case for me.

                                                            Library and Slideshow should be identical. Develop is a special case where you can sometimes see very subtle differences in tint to Library, but this does not sound subtle to me at all.

                                                             

                                                            >There's not many images in this catalog and to be honest, not sure a new catalog will bring in the VC that I'm working off of. Can you tell me if it will?

                                                             

                                                            The trick is to select the images (or their VCs) you are working on and to export a new catalog from this (File -> Export as Catalog). Make sure to deselect "Export negative files" and "Include available previews)". Then load the new catalog (you can simply double click on it. The previews will be recreated in this new catalog.

                                                            • 27. Re: Strange things happening to Sepia images in Lr 4.3
                                                              LadyCharlyTX Community Member

                                                              Ok, I did as suggested and created a new catalog from the images of the event. Now they look correctly exposed in Slideshow! YAY! Only a few have the issues of coloration/banding, but to a lesser degree, which I will either try to fix or exclude them from the DVD. I presume my first catalog was somehow corrupted and that was causing me all the problems. Odd though as there were only about 3000 images in that catalog. My Lr 3.5 catalog has over 30K and never had any problems. I'm at a loss why Adobe tech never suggested doing that or why it even happened. Though with all the issues I've had with the Mac, perhaps that inadvertently caused it. Don't know.... it's electronics and anything can happen. lol

                                                               

                                                              Haven't had a chance to calibrate this morning, but will this afternoon and post back if it worked or not. Seems I have another problem arise though. Might just be a setting I missed, not sure. I color labeled all the images for the DVD and put them in a user order in the old catalog that came through in the new. I then created a Smart Collection for the color labeled images, yet they did not retain the order I had them in and there's no user order to choose from. Also if I use the Attribute filter they all show up but in random order. Perhaps my brain is just fried over all this hoopla, but shouldn't it main its order no matter what? I remember losing the order a few times in the old catalog and had to rearrange them. I put them in a stack the last time, but that doesn't seem to work either.

                                                               

                                                              Lastly would you suggest I do the repair in ColorSync Utility for the bad files? If so, how do I backup the profiles so I don't lose them?

                                                               

                                                              Thanks for helping solve some of the issues I was having! You're a life save!!

                                                              • 28. Re: Strange things happening to Sepia images in Lr 4.3
                                                                Jao vdL MVP

                                                                I suggested it because it sounded like something was wrong with the

                                                                previews and this was the quickest way to test that. The previews getting

                                                                out of sorts is uncommon but certainly not unprecedented.

                                                                 

                                                                For your second question I believe smart catalogs cannot have user order

                                                                because they are dynamic (making it possible for images to appear/disappear

                                                                at any time) so it is not unsurprising they did not retain the order you

                                                                put the images in. If you want a certain order you want to create a normal

                                                                collection of the images and drag them around in there,

                                                                 

                                                                You can repair the icc files you listed above but you don't have to bother.

                                                                They are profiles that Lightroom doesn't use for anything. They probably

                                                                came out of a photoshop install and even there are only used for certain

                                                                cheesy special effects, so them having (very minor compliance) problems is

                                                                not a problem at all.

                                                                • 29. Re: Strange things happening to Sepia images in Lr 4.3
                                                                  LadyCharlyTX Community Member

                                                                  Once again, I cannot thank you enough for your time and help fixing my issues!! You are indeed an asset to this forum, when you fixed in a very short time what Adobe Tech couldn't in many days and hours!!!

                                                                   

                                                                  So it was most likely the previews. Awhile back I had thought that, so I purged everything. That didn't help at all. I thought previews would be removed with a purge is that not correct? And I would gather it would be best to maintain the new catalog instead of the old?

                                                                   

                                                                  Yes I had just remembered Smart Collections don't recognize stacks, but you beat me to the punch and now don't have to edit.

                                                                   

                                                                  I don't do cheesy editing, so I'll leave them alone. lol

                                                                   

                                                                  Lastly...

                                                                   

                                                                  1. Would it be advisable to use the 1:1 previews on import? And what's the best way to maintain them to not get corrupted? As stated above, I have very little on the 1TB internal drive and that's how I always keep them on any computers. Working off EXHDDs for the most part, that way I always have an abundance of free space and little working the RAM.

                                                                   

                                                                  2. And do you know how to create the main folders I had in Lr 3.5 w/o importing over 30K images along with them in Lr 4.3? Meaning in 3.5 I have all the folders, like many of the edits so kept it and will use images from there. When I import an image say from Italy, subfolder Venice it will not make the folder structure, but instead has just the title of the subfolder w/other eroneous info I don't want to see. The bulk of my images I just throw into 1 folder w/o subfolders, create a new one when it hits about 5K or every few months. Only special events/trips are put into their own folders. Example:

                                                                   

                                                                  My Originals

                                                                  .....Ireland

                                                                  .........Dublin

                                                                  .........Killarney

                                                                  .....Italy

                                                                  .........Venice

                                                                  .........Cinque Terre

                                                                  .........Tuscany

                                                                  .....New Shoot 1

                                                                  .....New Shoot 2

                                                                   

                                                                  3. The previous brought up yet another question. I'm working on a keyword structure to import into Lr 4.3 When I started out with Lr 3, I was clueless about so very much! Keywords got out of hand and one the main reasons I didn't use the 3.5 catalog when I got 4 was to not have that happen again. Well of course when you bring over images from 3 w/keywords they appear haphazzardly in 4. Any way to stop the keywords from 3 from attaching themselves in 4's keyword list?