32 Replies Latest reply on Jan 18, 2013 2:22 PM by Stu S

    Odd hits during AVCHD playback

    Stu S

      I'm finally getting to take PP6 & my new machine on an extended shakedown over my vaca, and as I dig in, I'm noticing a problem with playback.  Playing back native files from an FS100, importing from the full card structure, and seeing all sorts of quick hits, particularly on vertical lines in shots with some camera motion.  

       

      My specs:

      win7

      3930k OC

      p9x79pro

      gtx670 4mb

      32 gb ram

      Editing on dual Dell monitors

      client monitor - asus PA246

      Editing from a RAID0, two 1 tb WD black caviars

      Cache on a WD 1tb black caviar

      OS & Programs on 1tb WD black caviar

       

      Running windows lean, followed all of Harm's various setup posts.  This primarily an editing rig, not a lot of other programs on here, I just completed the build last month, and so far it's been very stable.

       

      Seeing the hits both in my client monitor, and in the source and program monitors.  They usually fall in the same place.

       

      First thing I did was check the original media in windows media player, and it's fine.  Tried renedering the timeline, no luck.  Tried viewing at 1/4, still there.  Tried rolling back the nvidia driver, no luck.

       

      It sounds similar to what's going on here:

       

      http://forums.adobe.com/message/4958250#4958250

       

      and here

       

      http://forums.adobe.com/message/4932919#4932919

       

      Any help much appreciated.

        • 1. Re: Odd hits during AVCHD playback
          Harm Millaard Level 7

          Stu,

           

          What exactly do you mean by 'Seeing the hits'? Are you talking about choppy, jerkiness? Can you post a screenshot of the timeline? What nVidia driver, what effects are used, how many processes are running? Can you post a screenshot from Process Explorer?

          • 2. Re: Odd hits during AVCHD playback
            Stu S Level 1

            Hi Harm,

             

            Thanks much for replying.  The hits look like quick horizontal lines or artifacts that cut across vertical sections, like the image breaking up on detailed stuff you'd think it would be hard to process.  The more camera movement, the more little breakups in the image, but really it doesn't take much at all to make it happen.  At first, I thought they were in-camera, and something was wrong with my FS100, but the files are fine.  I'm back to running the most recent nvidia driver, 310.76 whql, and there are no effects on anything. 

             

            Here's process explorer, and a screen cap.  Red circles show areas where these hits occur.

             

            proc.exp.2.jpgppro.jpgproc.exp.1.jpg

            • 3. Re: Odd hits during AVCHD playback
              Jim_Simon Level 8

              I'm not seeing anything amiss in the red circles.

              • 4. Re: Odd hits during AVCHD playback
                Stu S Level 1

                The artifacts are only visible on playback, Stepping through the footage a frame at a time, there's no problem.  I only included the circles to indicate the types of areas within footage that have the hits or choppiness during played back.  This is really puzzling - it's some type of playback problem in PPro, because the .mts files play without any artifacts in WMP.  Very frustrating.

                • 5. Re: Odd hits during AVCHD playback
                  Bill Gehrke Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                  I really think that you have way to many processes going on at the same time and something interupting the video.  Try initially turning off your antivirus program and try tuning your system so you do not have so many processes running while you are editing.  Before running Premiere I have only 30-40 processes running

                  • 6. Re: Odd hits during AVCHD playback
                    Stu S Level 1

                    Bill, in addition to Kaspersky, can you suggest some processes to close down from the list?

                    • 7. Re: Odd hits during AVCHD playback
                      Bill Gehrke Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                      Here is my personal list, you may have to make sure that it does cause any conflicts with your setup.  Harm also has a Windows Tuning Guide

                      • 8. Re: Odd hits during AVCHD playback
                        Stu S Level 1

                        Thanks Bill.  I went through Harm's list early on, will re-visit it.  Problem is, without being too experienced, it's hard to know what will and won't destabilize the system.  These lists look like good starting points.

                        • 9. Re: Odd hits during AVCHD playback
                          Stu S Level 1

                          OK, several days and many attempts later, still no success.  Hopefully I can post an update and someone has some fresh insight, because I'm stumped.

                           

                          I followed Bill's & Harm's links & suggestions on optimizing windows.  No luck.  I completely wiped my drive, wrote zeros, and started over.  Installed only windows, drivers, and CS6.  Same problem.  Looking carefully at device drivers, I noticed I was missing one obscure driver (obscure to me as a first timer, anyway) the PCI Simple Communications controller.  Intsalled it and it solved the problem!  I then re-installed my other appps, and optimized windows a la Bill & Harm's links (using black viper's safe settings), keeping it very minimal ( I can post a list if anyone thinks it might be helpful - they are all common apps, no games or other editing software), and when I re-launched premiere, the hits were back.  OK, I think, something must have broken premiere, or corrupted the driver that fixed the problem.  So I reinstalled my drivers.  No luck.  I then uninstalled cs6, used the adobe cleaner tool, then reinstalled cs6.  No luck, problem still there.

                           

                          All I can think of is to start over again, get it running, and then check to see that the problem does not reappear after adding each new app as I rebuild my system.  Hopefully, someone here will have an idea on how to avoid me having to waste another weekend wiping my drive and reinstalling windows.  Help!

                          • 10. Re: Odd hits during AVCHD playback
                            Bill Gehrke Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                            Stu S wrote:

                             

                            I then re-installed my other appps,

                             

                            What are these other Apps?

                            • 11. Re: Odd hits during AVCHD playback
                              Stu S Level 1

                              Microsoft Office 2003 (word, excel, ppt)

                              Logitech Setpoint (keyboard & mouse software)

                              Quicktime

                              Cyber2Go (shipped with Asus DVD)

                              CC Cleaner

                              Firefox

                              Winrar

                              Datacolor Spyder

                              HP All in One Printer software

                              Kaspersky (which I tried uninstalling, did not help)

                               

                              That's it.

                              • 12. Re: Odd hits during AVCHD playback
                                Jim_Simon Level 8
                                Microsoft Office 2003 (word, excel, ppt)

                                Quicktime

                                Cyber2Go (shipped with Asus DVD)

                                CC Cleaner

                                Kaspersky (which I tried uninstalling, did not help)

                                 

                                When you wipe and reinstall (yet again), don't install any of those.

                                • 13. Re: Odd hits during AVCHD playback
                                  Harm Millaard Level 7

                                  One correction Jim,

                                   

                                  CCleaner is almost mandatory to install, you don't want to miss out on it.

                                  • 14. Re: Odd hits during AVCHD playback
                                    Stu S Level 1

                                    Jim, I've wiped, reinstalled, and updated windows, and it's booting up very quickly, half as quick as previous installs, I'm going to reinstall CS6 tonight.  Can I ask what you suspect about each of those titles?  They each provide a core functionality I'll need on this box, so if there's something wrong with them, alternative sugggestions appreciated.  With QT in particular, is there any other way to work with Prores?  I've got many legacy prores files to work with.

                                     

                                    Thanks

                                    • 15. Re: Odd hits during AVCHD playback
                                      Bill Gehrke Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                      Harm, does CCleaner run all the time, or is it only on demand?

                                      • 16. Re: Odd hits during AVCHD playback
                                        Bill Gehrke Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                        Stu,

                                        You might want to install each of your apps one at a time and see when the problem reappears.

                                        • 17. Re: Odd hits during AVCHD playback
                                          Harm Millaard Level 7

                                          Only on demand.

                                          • 18. Re: Odd hits during AVCHD playback
                                            UlfLaursen Level 2

                                            I use CCleaner a lot after recommendation on this forum, and it is great.

                                             

                                            Ulf

                                            • 19. Re: Odd hits during AVCHD playback
                                              ECBowen Most Valuable Participant

                                              Was the driver you installed by chance the Intel Management Engine driver?

                                               

                                              Eric

                                              ADK

                                              • 20. Re: Odd hits during AVCHD playback
                                                Stu S Level 1

                                                Yes, it was.  During my initial setup, I overlooked it on the Asus dowload page.

                                                • 21. Re: Odd hits during AVCHD playback
                                                  ECBowen Most Valuable Participant

                                                  Well the Intel Management engine driver charts the devices and resources and is there to communicate with the bios. Are you sure you have your bios settings correct, especially the ram settings?

                                                   

                                                  Eric

                                                  ADK

                                                  • 22. Re: Odd hits during AVCHD playback
                                                    Stu S Level 1

                                                    I think I do.  I haven't gone in and adjusted anything in bios, other than to switch from AHCI to RAID mode.  Memory settings are over my head, so I haven't touched them.  I had been overclocking using Autotune, but prior to reloading windows, I went into bios and chose Load Optimal Default settings, to start with clean bios settings.  Overclock doesn't seem to impact the problem one way or another.  At some point, I also pushed the MEM OK button on the motherboard, and it did not report any errors.  I may do that again tonight just to make sure the memory is OK. 

                                                    • 23. Re: Odd hits during AVCHD playback
                                                      ECBowen Most Valuable Participant

                                                      What ram did you install? Do you have the model number?


                                                      Eric

                                                      ADK

                                                      • 24. Re: Odd hits during AVCHD playback
                                                        Zoop studio Level 1

                                                        Isn't it what they call ''screen tearing'' or ''tearing''?

                                                        • 25. Re: Odd hits during AVCHD playback
                                                          Stu S Level 1

                                                          Yes, Luc that's exactly what it is, that's how I should have described it initially.

                                                           

                                                          Eric, when I'm home tonight I'll post the part #, as I no longer see it available on the crucial site.  It's crucial ddr-3 PC1600 1.35, 4 8gb sticks.

                                                          • 26. Re: Odd hits during AVCHD playback
                                                            Zoop studio Level 1

                                                            Lucky you! (maybe)

                                                            http://forums.adobe.com/message/4086001#4086001

                                                             

                                                            I fiddeled a lot and then.. it's almost gone (see link above)

                                                            I think its a problem with some monitors and the refreshrate 50/59/60 Hz

                                                            • 27. Re: Odd hits during AVCHD playback
                                                              Stu S Level 1

                                                              The crucial part # is CT102464BD160B.M16FED, and it is DDR# 1600 1.35v.

                                                              • 28. Re: Odd hits during AVCHD playback
                                                                Stu S Level 1

                                                                Thanks Luc.  I'm going to wait to hear Eric's thoughts on the RAM, I'm starting to get suspicious of it.  A reinstall of CS6 last night ruled out program conficts - with nothing other than windows installed, I still had the tearing. 

                                                                • 29. Re: Odd hits during AVCHD playback
                                                                  ECBowen Most Valuable Participant

                                                                  Well those Crucial should be fine with the base Profile if you didn't change any settings. Go into the bios and then the advanced mode. Select the AI Tweaker tab. Change the VCCSA voltage to manual mode. The change the VCCSA voltage to 1.2v. Select dram timing control and put in here the numbers listed for the first 7 fields here.

                                                                   

                                                                  Eric

                                                                  ADK

                                                                  • 30. Re: Odd hits during AVCHD playback
                                                                    Stu S Level 1

                                                                    Thanks Eric, I'm going to try this tonight when I get home.  One thing I want to be clear on is this part: "Select dram timing control and put in here the numbers listed for the first 7 fields here."  Maybe this will make sense when I look at it, but right now I'm not sure what numbers you mean.  Also, will changing these settings impact anything when I use autotune to overclock?

                                                                    • 31. Re: Odd hits during AVCHD playback
                                                                      Stu S Level 1

                                                                      The good news is that updating to the bios that came out on Friday fixed the tearing, though changing windows appearance from best appearance to best performance temporarily brought it back.

                                                                       

                                                                      The bad news is that I now have a new problem.  Playback is intermittently slow and choppy, as if footage suddenly slows to 80%.  It doesn't happen in every clip, and does not happen every time I play a clip in which it happens (AVCHD)  but it does happen regularly, and when it occurs usually at the same points in the shot.  No effects are on the clips.  Software vs. hardware acceleration does not impact it.  Running multiple displays (2 dvi for cs6, 1 Asus for timeline playout), it happens in all three, source on monitor one, prog on monitor two, and timeline on three.  I have set my nvidia software to compatibility mode, running the hack (gtx670 4mb).  I've experimented with vsynch and triple buffering in the nvidia control panel, but no luck.  And it's definitely not a software conflict or demand for system resources, as it happens on a drive with only tuned windows and cs6 in the same way it happens with one containing the other software titles previously listed.  Tried playing back the media from different drives, no luck.  Rendering does not help, and prog. and source are both at 1/2 resolution. I've run memtest and my ram has passed that test.  One thing I think has reduced its occurrence is an autotune overclock, which gets me to 4.1.  As with my previous problem, clips play fine in WMP.

                                                                       

                                                                      I'm wondering if this new issue was introduced by the new bios, or if there are settings in the bios that need to be adjusted.   Hopefully someone will have some ideas.  Thanks.

                                                                      • 32. Re: Odd hits during AVCHD playback
                                                                        Stu S Level 1

                                                                        Just to close this off, after having Eric at ADK remote in and fine tune my system and check that everything is set properly, what this comes down to is cache buffering in Premiere.  Moving around the timeline rapidly brings it to the forefront, though sometimes it simply happens.  I know Eric will be able to clarify better than I can as to why this occurs, but I do hope that the next point upgrade of Premiere addresses this, as it is really annoying.  I've submitted a bug report at the link below, and if others are seeing it and can do the same, hopefully Adobe will fix this.

                                                                         

                                                                        https://www.adobe.com/cfusion/mmform/index.cfm?name=wishform