12 Replies Latest reply on Jan 17, 2013 8:31 PM by Noel Carboni

    Bizarre Photoshop stuff - screen blanks on adding guide, etc...

    DavePinMinn Level 1

      I rummaged around, but didn't see any discussions of what I'm seeing, which probably means it's something bizarre and unique to my system, but...

       

      Windows 7 64-bit Professional, I7-920 running at 3.7 GHz, 12GB of DDR3 memory, several SATA 1 or 2 TB spindles, ATI 5770.  LR4.3, Photoshop CS6.

       

      Generally, working on images from a Nikon D300 or Nikon D2X, both in .dng format, so nothing big or new to CS6.  Dell 24" primary monitor for just the image, cheap 22" monitor for all the palettes.

       

      I'm having a couple bizarre things happen, and hopefully y'all can give me an idea where to look...  These are ALL INTERMITTENT - don't happen on every image.

       

      1.  On some images, when I zoom past approximately 50% the screen changes to the white/gray checkerboard instead of the image.  I put in a topic a while ago about this one, but despite making a few changes, this is still happening.

       

      2.  On some images, when I add a guide, as soon as I move from the ruler to the image area, the area blanks and I can't see where to put the guide.  If I move back into the ruler, the image re-appears.  If I release the guide in the image, the image re-appears.  But as long as I'm dragging the guide, the image is blank.

       

      3.  On some images, when I go into puppet warp, as soon as I add a pin, the image zooms so I can't see the entire image.  Until I cancel the warp I can't zoom back out.  As soon as I cancel the warp, my image returns to normal....

       

      I absolutely know I didn't have any of these happening prior to upgrading to CS6.  ALSO, when it became available I installed the current driers for the ATI 5770 (10.12 or 12.10 or whatever it is).  Unfortunately, LR4 has some kind of problem with the current driver so I had to go back to 10.8 (I believe).  BUT, I have exactly the same problems with 10.12 that I have with 10.8, so if it's a video driver I'm not sure what SHOULD work.  Also, since I didn't have the problem with CS5, and the drivers don't change all that often, I had to be using 10.8 then too...

       

      I previously had CS6 getting as much of the 12GB of memory as possible, but after recommendations in the LR forum, I cut it back to just slightly over what was recommended.

       

      Even so, CS6 consistently uses at least 7GB when working on a image, and frequently the combination of LR and CS6 will use 10GB or more.

       

      I'm not sure where to start on this, what to turn on, what to turn off, what to resize/change/fold/spindle or mutilate, so thoughts?

        • 1. Re: Bizarre Photoshop stuff - screen blanks on adding guide, etc...
          Noel Carboni Level 8

          What you describe sounds like problems with the latest display drivers.

           

          The driver version numbers you're listing are not accurate.  2012's drivers all start with 12, those in 2013 will start with 13, etc.

           

          12.8 is the most recent version that works acceptably well with Photoshop.  If you installed 12.10 or one of the newer betas, you will have to have UNinstalled it first, then you would have had to reinstall 12.8.  It's important to make sure enough of 12.10 has been removed from your system to ensure 12.8 will work properly.

           

          If you work with their tech support folks, ATI / AMD themselves propose a method for fully uninstalling a version of their driver to ensure it's been fully removed that includes a run of something like Driver Sweeper to clean out remnants their own uninstaller misses.

           

          Myself, I've found that simply uninstalling 12.10 or 12.11 using its own uninstall facility seems to have been enough, but I wouldn't bet that that's true for every system.

           

           

          Beyond that, try the different advanced modes in the Photoshop Edit - Preferences - Performance - Advanced GPU dialog (e.g., try Normal or Basic), making sure to restart Photoshop after each change.

           

          Though it seems pertinent, it's really not consequential whether a system worked with Photoshop CS5.  The newer version makes more demands of the GPU because more functionality has been migrated to the GPU.

           

          In summary, I use 12.8 (with a Radeon HD 7850), and I have found it to be reasonably stable and functional.  I suspect that because of the path you took to get to where you are you may have a combination of two driver releases installed.

           

          -Noel

          • 2. Re: Bizarre Photoshop stuff - screen blanks on adding guide, etc...
            DavePinMinn Level 1

            Thanks Noel...

             

            I THOUGHT I had 12.10 completely uninstalled and 12.8 back on.  But I'll go see if I can find the process to make absolutely SURE I have all of 12.10 gone so I can get 12.8 back on...  I looked in the Catalyst Control Center, but and I'd SWEAR last week it said the version was 12.8, but I just checked again and it now says 12.10 again...  So, I'll go make sure it ALL goes away this time...

             

            I didn't think about it too much, but after going back to 12.8, LR stopped having fits and worked fairly well.  Last weekend LR suddenly started acting wonky again and slowing down, but I figured since I'd gone back to 12.8 it was something else.  Now I find out I'm back to 12.10...

             

            Once I get all the driver stupidity straightened out, do you have any recommendations for optimizing the PS preferences?  Is there a topic or file or document somewhere that'll help me optimize so if I DO get anymore bizarre behavior I'll know it's not my settings?

            • 3. Re: Bizarre Photoshop stuff - screen blanks on adding guide, etc...
              Noel Carboni Level 8

              Not sure you'll need to do much...  I have everything GPU-oriented turned on to the max; the Catalyst 12.8 driver seems to support it all.

               

              Seems to me there's an auto-update checkbox somewhere in the Catalyst control panel pages.  You might want to make sure that's unchecked.

               

              -Noel

              • 4. Re: Bizarre Photoshop stuff - screen blanks on adding guide, etc...
                Noel Carboni Level 8

                If you want to describe your computer system in general, I can potentially make some general recommendations (e.g., what to set RAM limits to, etc.).

                 

                -Noel

                • 5. Re: Bizarre Photoshop stuff - screen blanks on adding guide, etc...
                  DavePinMinn Level 1

                  OK, as near as I can tell I've now gotten rid of EVERYTHING from 12.10, and things are back to 12.8.  when I check in the Catalyst Control Center, it SAYS it's using version 12.8 of the software...  And I found the "check updates" and shut it off....

                   

                  The current system is an ASUS P6T motherboard with an i7 920 quad-core running at 3.8GHz.  I've got 12GB of DDR3 memory, and an ATI 5770 1GB video card.  O/S is Windows 7, 64-bit Professional.  I've got 5 internal SATA spindles, all 7200 RPM.

                   

                  C has my O/S and applications on it.

                  P is a 1TB spindle that contains my .dng files

                  Q is a 1TB spindle set as a scratch disk

                  T is a 1TB spindle set as a scratch disk

                  Camera Raw Cache is a 60GB partition on the Q spindle

                   

                  In Photoshop, I've got preferences set to

                  Automatically Save Recovery every 5 minutes

                  Available RAM:  10986 MB

                  Ideal Range:  6042-7909 MB

                  Currently I let Photoshop Use 8459 MB (77%)

                   

                  History states is 200

                  Cache Levels: 8

                  Cache Tile Size: 1024K

                  In Advanced Graphics Processor Settings

                  Drawing Mode: Advanced

                  Use Graphics Processor to Accelerate is checked

                  Anti-alias Guides and Paths is checked

                  Use OpenCL is NOT checked

                  30 Bit Display is NOT checked

                   

                  I'm not sure if there's any other preference that's relevant, but let me know if you need any other info...

                  • 6. Re: Bizarre Photoshop stuff - screen blanks on adding guide, etc...
                    Noel Carboni Level 8

                    Are the original "glitchy display" issues you reported gone?  I assume so but you didn't actually say.

                     

                    For what it's worth, even though I don't personally have monitors that can handle 30 bit data, I have checked the 30 bit display setting.  Somehow it seems to me something ended up working better when I did that.

                     

                    A History States value of 200 is arguably a bit high for a system with only 12GB of RAM.  It can contribute to swapping a lot of data to scratch when you've been running Photoshop for a long session.

                     

                    Speaking of scratch, I don't think there's any advantage to having two separate 1 TB scratch disks.  If that's all you're using them for now, you could potentially boost performance by combining the two into a single 2 TB RAID 0 volume, which will essentially add the drive speeds for large data transfers.  I would suggest against partitioning the disks at all, as it will virtually ensure seeking if things are accessed from both partitions simultaneously, and seeking is bad for performance.

                     

                    The rest of the settings I think you have set pretty well. 

                     

                    -Noel

                    • 7. Re: Bizarre Photoshop stuff - screen blanks on adding guide, etc...
                      Jeffrey Tranberry Adobe Employee

                      Have you tried setting the Advanced Setting for "Drawing Mode" to "Basic" and restarting Photoshop?

                      • 8. Re: Bizarre Photoshop stuff - screen blanks on adding guide, etc...
                        DavePinMinn Level 1

                        I gave LR and Photoshop a quick start and tried a couple of the things that intermittently failed.  They worked fine, but I'll have to give things a much more stringent workout before I can tell...  Unfortunately, I'm trying to prove a negative, so if it doesn't happen it could be 'cause it's fixed, or it could be that I just haven't done whatever I did before that caused the problem.  I'll know more in a few days.

                         

                        I'll turn on the 30-bit data just to see if it changes anything.

                         

                        As far as the scratch disks...  They're both used for other things.  Q has my ORIGINAL .NEF files on it, and there's probably 200 GB available.  T is a backup disk that gets used at 2 a.m. when I back up my images.  It has 200 - 300GB available.  So, both are used for other things and I wanted to be sure there was plenty of room for the scratch files. 

                         

                        I'll try turning down the number of history states, to maybe 150, although my system INSISTS the Photoshop is always 100% efficient...

                         

                        I'll stop back later in the week when I've got some better information on bizarreness...

                        • 9. Re: Bizarre Photoshop stuff - screen blanks on adding guide, etc...
                          DavePinMinn Level 1

                          I haven't tried setting it to basic...  What is the effect of changing from advanced to basid for the drawing mode?

                          • 10. Re: Bizarre Photoshop stuff - screen blanks on adding guide, etc...
                            Jeffrey Tranberry Adobe Employee

                            I beleive it just changes some API calls. It shouldn't affect image quality or performance.

                            • 11. Re: Bizarre Photoshop stuff - screen blanks on adding guide, etc...
                              DavePinMinn Level 1

                              I've now been using LR and PS for the last 3 days with the 12.8 ATI drivers instead of the 12.10 drivers...  And, I know you can't prove a negative, BUT SO FAR the bizarre behaviors I was seeing are gone.  I can zoom, create guides, and do normal stuff without any problems.  PS is still using every bit of memory I give it, but so far it's still saying it's100% efficient.

                               

                              The change back to the old driver ALSO helped some of the performance problems I was seeing in Lightroom...

                               

                              SO FAR, SO GOOD......

                              • 12. Re: Bizarre Photoshop stuff - screen blanks on adding guide, etc...
                                Noel Carboni Level 8

                                That's excellent news, right in keeping with what I've seen.

                                 

                                -Noel