Something is really wrong here.
I have 8 GB of memory, 32 GB of free disk space and a catalog that takes up 73 GB with 29,000 pictures.
If a catalogue has taken all that space then clearly it is bloated for over use. I don't have the answer to your original question because I thought all Adobe products takes some time before launching I have recently installed DW, Photoshop and Fireworks all from CS6 bundle and they are all too slow to open on my machine.
Have you tried deleting/moving some photos from its original location to somewhere else and then launch the PSE organizer to re-catalogue your pictures? It is worth a try because it looks like you need to recreate the catalogue from scratch.
If you want to delete some pictures, I would advise deleting the same fro Organizer itself. Select the corresponding thumbnail, hit Del key and choose to tick the checkbox corresponding to "Also delete from hard disk".
I was doing exactly what you suggested and the 35 sec. pause after each delete was what I was questioning. . . why so long just to delete a file?
I tried to Repair my existing Catalog and it came back and told me that "No errors were found in the catalog". Still have same 35 sec. pause.
I tried to Optimize to existing Catalog and didn't have any change in my 35 sec. pause.
I tried to create a new catalog (over night). I wasn't waiting around to watch it import 29,000 phots. Some of the statistics in the System Information have changed (see below) but I still have the same 35 sec. delay when creating / deleting a file.
On my original catalog I had previously tried to reconnect several hundred files and when I couldn't, I would have to delete the unconnected file - and this pause for each delete was a major source of my frustration. Now that I have a new catalog, at least I don't have hundreds of files that are unconnected. It still leads me back to my effort to clean out unwanted files and having to wait 35 sec. for each delete.
Any more ideas???
Elements Organizer 10.0.0.0
Core Version: 10.0 (20110831.m.17215)
Language Version: 10.0 (20110831.m.17215)
Catalog Name: 2013_New_Catalog
Catalog Location: C:\ProgramData\Adobe\Elements Organizer\Catalogs\2013_New_Catalog\
Catalog Size: 88.6MB
Catalog Cache Size: 264.6MB
Operating System Name: Vista
Operating System Version: 6.0 Service Pack 2
System Architecture: Intel CPU Family:6 Model:15 Stepping:11 with MMX, SSE Integer, SSE FP
Built-in Memory: 3.2GB
Free Memory: 1.6GB
The remaining information in the system info has not changed.
Any more ideas???
Have a look at this paper:
There must be something really wrong with your hardware/software setup.
Suggestion : is there a difference if you switch off 'watched folders' and all auto-analyzer options and restart your computer ?
Also, is the time to delete ten selected files 10 x 35 seconds = around 6 minutes ?
If there is a problem in my setup I'm hoping you guys can help me find it 'cause I'm at my wit's end. I love the Editor and it's functionality but the Organizer is just about to drive me to something else software wise.
1. auto-analyzer has already been turned off. I never had a use for it.
2. watched folders doesn't seem to have any effect one way or the other.
3. I was trying to set up 6 new pictures to play with deleting them and uncovered another anomaly. In the past, any time I have always used the same picture, made a visible change to it, stored in another name, exited the Editor, confirmed the presense of the new picture in the Organizer, and deleted the file while timing the creation and deletion.
I decided to work with 6 new files rather than the 10 you suggested. I brought up the Editor, made a change, saved it under IMG_3727_1, made a change, save it under IMG_3727_2 , etc. for a total of 6 times, exited the Editor, and waited in the Organizer for the new files to appear. The cursor spun around for 2 min. before un freezing. This time only 1 of the new files appeared in the Organizer (I have no idea what is going on now!!). I wait around for a few more minutes and still only the 1 new files is being displayed. So I exit PSE, restart Windows, bring up PSE and low and behold version #5 &6 appear next to #1, but 2, 3 & 4 are still missing. I then select File > Get Photos and Videos > From Files and Folders, then I select #3 & #4. 1 min 10 sec. later IMG3727_3 & IMG3727_4 appear in their own window. I select "Show All" and 40 seconds later the main Organizer window appears showing version 1,2,3,4 &6. I repeat the same procedure and the timing is just about the same even though I am only fetching #5 this time.
When I select a single picture (IMG3727_1) from the Organizer and delete it, it takes about 35 sec. for the picture to disappear from the screen. When I select 5 pictures (2,3,4,5&6) to delete all at once, it still takes about 35 sec. for all 5 of the pictures to disppear.
I'm guessing that when I'm creating new files, there is probably a 35 sec. per picture effect on the Organizer. So that when I make 6 new files there is an effect of 6 * 35 seconds (210) on the Organizer and I only saw the effect of the last 120 seconds of the 210. However during the delete, that is a different story.
Now I'll go play with memory & an external disk.
Currently the Performance Menu shows that
Memory Usage: Available RAM 1626 MB Ideal Range: 894-1171 MB Let Photoshop Elements Use: 1138 MB (70%)
Any ideas where the 1626 MB number comes from?
Is there any reason I shouldn't increase the Let Photoshop Use up to 100%
Another Set of Symptoms:
1. I tried seperately a.) an external HD for scratch space, b.) 60% of available memory for PSE10, and c.) 80% of available memory for PSE10 (previous to this experiment, the memory had been set at 70%) and none of these changes helped decrease the time it took to create / delete a file.
2. Previous to this experiment, when I have been deleting a file from the catalog, I have also been deleting the file from the disk. I tried deleting a file only from the catalog and it still takes at least 35 sec.
Anybody else have any brilliant ideas, okay I'll settle for ordinary ideas as long as they make sense.
Normally the scratch disk is supposed to be a fast internal drive. Using an external drive could not help. But I think that in your case everything can take place in the normal RAM and the scratch disk does not come into play.
You confirmed what I expected in your experiment of deleting only from catalog, which brought no improvement.
I would rather suspect something wrong with your antivirus or firewall settings.
Did you reset your prefs ?
Yes, I reset my Preferences back to 70% and the scratch disk is my internal HD. They were changed only for the tests.
I have no antivirus turned on other than the Windows Firewall is On. One of the Windows Firewall exceptions is that I do not have the "Adobe Photoshop Elements Media Server" (there are 2 of them) turned on. They are both off. When I looked at those setting after first setting up PSE10, I couldn't image any reason why I would need to import media other than the data from memory cards which would be a manual operation through a USB connection.
I could turn off the Windows Firewall and disconnect my computer the internet but I am having a little difficulty seeing what the connection might be. The directory that contains my 29K pictures is a shared directory because I have another PC in house that needs to be able to obtain access to the pictures. However during all of these tests I've been running, I have kept that PC powered off and not even accessing any of the shared directories. Right now and for all of the testing I've done, this PC (the one with PSE10) is that only PC in my inhouse network that is powered on.
I have started out on a new idea. My intuition keeps telling me that this situation is one that PSE is creating for itself that is dependant on the size of the catalog. I created a new catalog that only had 5000 (or so) files then ran timing tests. I then imported some more files into the catalog and reran timing tests. I'm up to 21K files (out of the 29K+ files that I normally have). My timing readings stayed at pretty much the same value until I increased the catalog past the 21K level. At that point the time increased from 15 sec to 22 sec. The timing value of 35 sec. that I started out objecting to, I haven't identified at what catalog size does produce those numbers yet. Building my catalog has been quite time consuming so far and if I continue, it will get worse because I have the remainer of my pictures scattered thoughout many individual directories and I can only acquire one directory at a time.
OK try this:
1) On your system, create a new profile with limited privileges;
2) create or copy some photos to your MyPictures folder;
3) In PSE, create a new catalogue from PSE Organizer;
4) log off from this account momentarily so that all your settings are saved;
5) log back to this account and then try everything like deleting the files etc to see if it is faster this time.
Good luck and post back.
1. Previously my one and only user was the administrator, so I created a "regular" user.
2. All my photos are out in a Public directory under Public Pictures and my stuff takes up about 78GB and I don't have that much spare, so I didn't see any reason to make more copies of any of my photos.
3. After loging in as my newly created user, I created a new catalog.
4. I logged out, restarted the OS and logged back in.
5. I began importing all my pictures into the new catalog a few directories at a time.
I still have the problem with PSE staying busy trying to add a photo or delete one (generally over 30 sec. each time). I took timing readings as I was building up the catalog and you can see the delay increases as the catalog size increases.
Catalog ShowAll Start Create Delete
5,076 5 15 10 8
15,158 16 19 15 12
22,999 28 30 25 25
28,821 48 44 40 30
My table needs a little explaination:
Whenever I import a directory (or more) of photos they appear in their own window. At the top of the window there is a Show All Button so you can get back to the entire catalog. The numbers under Show All are the # of seconds before the Organizer was able to respond to the next command. Most of the time several hundred photos were being imported and that's what generated the 4 numbers in the table.
After I got everything built up, I added only 2 photos to the Catalog. The 32 sec. is long long it took after the Show All button was selected before the Organizer was able to respond.
The Start column is how long it took PSE to get loaded and ready to respond to commands. This activation was always immediately preceded by restarting the OS and logging into my regular user.
The create column is how long it took the Organizer to respond once the Editor created a new file.
The Delete column is how long it took the Organizer to respond once a photo was deleted by the Organizer.
Using my new user, I also created another new catalog and added all 28,966 photos into the catalog. Yeah, that took over 9 hours to process.
The bottom row of timing numbers that are in the table are pretty close to what I get with this catalog.
Any more ideas? The more I play with this, the more upset I get with PSE.
In reading about your problem I keep having a query about your RAM.
You say that you have 8GB RAM but I notice that PSE is only seeing 3.2GB.
I know that PSE is a 32bit application and can only use about 3.2GB but on my Windows 7 system with 8GB RAM, PSE reports that there is 8GB
Operating System Name: Windows 7
Operating System Version: 6.1 Service Pack 1
System Architecture: Intel CPU Family:6 Model:14 Stepping:5 with MMX, SSE Integer, SSE FP
Built-in Memory: 8GB
Free Memory: 3.8GB
I don't have Vista so the difference could be down to the way Vista works - perhaps someone else with Vista could comment on this.
My other thoughts are just to confirm that you are using Vista 64bit and that PSE isn't being run in some XP emulation or compatibility mode is it?
Have you tried using task manager to see if it gets processor bound during a 35 sec delete?
The Vista OS I am using seems to be a 32 bit version as told to me by the stuff in Control Panel. However it seems to see the 8 GB of memory.
I attempted to use task manager. I'm not sure exactly how to tell is I am processor bound. The way I look at it, one of the processors is pretty heavily loaded, but the other 3 don't seem to be overloaded. I'm going to attempt to post a screen snap of the delete. This one took right at 30 sec.
Your performance graph does show some activity but the graphs are not all at the top and therefore I don't think that you are processor bound at that time - it doesn't seem to be working very hard.
It is hard for me to see clearly but, just below the graphs, there is text giving the physical memory and the total appears to be 3309 which is less than the 8GB you think you have. What I am wondering about is perhaps half your memory has failed and is dragging the performance of the rest down.
I don't think he size of the catalog shouldn't make the significant increase in time that you are seeing but it might use more memory to access the indexes and so I'm thinking that faulty memory could slow everything down.
If you have the 32bit Vista OS, then I don't think that it can address more than 4GB - what are you looking at that says you have 8GB?
In the vista control panel, you should see either System or System Info (I can't be sure as I don't have Vista). Can you see if they tell you any more about your system.
Out of interest, if you delete an image from the catalog but not the disk, how does the timing compare with when you delete from both.
This does seem to be a tricky problem, has it always been like it or has it suddenly got worse?
Yes the Physical Memory(MB) is Total: 3309 cached: 1933 free: 9
I can't seem to make the screen snap any more readable. Any other info you need off of that snap?
I also played with Task Manager when creating new files / catalog entries and the timing windows were never anywhere near to being maxed out at the top.
Here's how I see the 8GB
Control Panel > System and Maintenance > Under Welcome Center select "Find which version of Windows you are using
then this following appears:
Then I select "show more details" and this appears:
I would agree that everything I have read, for the 32 bit version, only 4 GB is being used.
I don't notice any appreciable difference in timing if the delete is only from the catalog and not the disk. I usually delete the file just for housekeeping purposes and creat the same file also. I have been using exactly the same picture (which is a jpeg of about 800KB) just to make sure my testing is consistent. I might find time is the next few days to try creating a jpeg from Raw but I don't think that is going to make things any faster.
I have a great deal of difficulty believing that "bad" memory is causing this symptom. When I build up the catalog from nothing and I only have 5000 entries in the catalog the response is soooooo much better (8 sec versus 4 to 5 times worst with my full catalog (29K entries). The response time for almost everything (adding a single photo to the catalog is also about 4 times faster than it is now with my current catalog).
4 weeks ago I was complaining about slow response from PSE to the guy that sold (3 yrs ago) me my computer and at that time I only had 2GB of memory. He suggested increasing the memory, so I did. When I only had 2 GB I was using an older catalog but the time to delete was at the 30 sec. level. I was trying to delete duplicates and the delay was driving me nuts sitting here watching the cursor spin and waiting and waiting. I can't find any way to tell how many entries are in the catalog, only the disk size of the catalog, so I don't really know exactly what the catalog size was back then.
I think the problem has always been there. It's just that as I slowly add to the catalog, I don't really notice a significant change from the way it was yesterday and the day before. As I said earlier, as I started deleting duplicates and connecting broken links I've just gotten really fed up with sitting and watching the spinning cursor.
My comment about "bad" memory was because I have seen PCs where part of the memory goes faulty and cause lots of interupts thereby slowing the throughput of the computer.
However, I don't think that is your problem. Although you have a physical memory of 8GB, a 32bit operating system is not very efficient with large amounts of RAM (>4GB). I don't think that you gained very much by the memory upgrade.
I think you would benefit from using a 64bit OS (if your processor supports it) but that is not a simple upgrade. Rather than Vista 64, you might think of Windows 7 or 8 63bit.
The other thing that I have noticed is that you only seem to have a small amount of free disk space. Have you tried defraging your drive? The less space there is on a drive, the more untidy it gets and files take longer to create and delete.
Both of the above factors (RAM & Disk space) will affect your timings and I agree with you in that the more you add to the catalog the slower it will get. I think that it needs more space to work in otherwise it is just paging its memory in and out for much of the time.
Have you tried deleting more than one image at a time? That might save time in that the indexes may only be read once.
Yes, I have the same opinion about what I gained by adding the memory.
Yeah, I think a 64 bit OS might help but right now that's not an option.
The lack of disk space is one of the factors that started me down this road. I was trying to delete files in order to make more free space and then defrag once the deletion was complete. I tried a defrag before I started playing around with PSE but at that time I wasn't do actual timing. After the defrag it just still seemed slow when doing anything with PSE (starting up, adding photos, deleting catalog entries and deleting duplicates).
I wanted to get my photos cleaned up, make a full photo backup, then delete a lot of the Raw files I've been keeping around for convienence, then defrag. My PC is 4 going on 5 and I'm right between wanting to upgrade this one (my preference) or get a new one. As far as PSE, I'm starting to think it would be much more efficient time-wise to not bother with cleaning up the files and just get new larger HDs. That's my problem, you guys can't help me with that.
Deleting more than one image at a time is only applicable to images in the same directory and that's not my situation. When I built my latest catalog from nothing, one of the byproducts was it identified over 200 images that are either duplicate or one that PSE has an issue with. After looking into each one and determining what needs to be done, there is usually 1 or 2 actions that will leave me sitting at the monitor watching the PSE cursor go round and round for 30 sec or more (oh boy). Yes I'll admit, I am one for instant gratification.
I've pretty well stuck on my thought that PSE is going to continue to slow down in constant progression as the catalog increases in size. I really like the PSE editing functions that are available and really would like to learn more. It's the PSE Organizor that I'm getting fed up with. I think I'll investigate other tools for organizing and viewing of the images and only use the PSE Editor. If I need the PSE Organizor, I'll just plan on doing an overnight catalog build.
1 person found this helpful
If you don't using the organiser facilities like tags & albums but just want a browser, then you could just use windows explorer. You can set up te system so that a right click will give you the option to edit the image in the PSE editor.
I am guessing that you are working most of the time in Folder Location view. To delete multiple images, you could select each one (in Folder Location view) and assign a tag (perhaps called DelMe) to it. After you have tagged a few, then switch to Thumbnail View and select the tag (DelMe) and that should just show all the images to be deleted. You should be able to then delete those images irrespective of which folder they are in.
Another thing you could do is move some of your image folders to an external drive. [By using organizer of course]. This should then give you more space on your main disk.
I've used Explorer before and used the right click as a quick way into PSE Editor. I like the large images that the Live Photo Gallery presents. I've used that quite a lot on my laptop when travelling to add captions the day the picture was taken rather than wait until we return home.
Thanks for the DelMe solution. You are correct, I am always in Folder Location.
If you move folders to an external drive, is it necessary to have the external drive powered up every time you bring up PSE?
If you have moved folders to an external drive and that drive is powered off, the images will be classed as missing when you load organizer.
There is a preference setting which you should turn off - see Edit -> Preferences -> Files - uncheck the Automatically Search for and Reconnect Missing Files - this stops the organizer trying to connect the missing images.
The folder would not be visible in folder view and in thumbnail view there may be a ? over the thumbnail.
When the external drive comes on line next, you should be able to see everything again as normal.
If you do think about moving folders, I suggest to try a sample first.
If you are going to do mass moving around, do you have a full backup of your images and catalog? - always a good thing to have.
2000 views and a year and a half later, I finally am getting totally frustrated by this same issue on PSE10. Has anyone come up with anything new?
I assume you are talking about the time it takes to delete an image.
This can be vary depending on your system and on your catalog. On my system a deletion can take less than 2 seconds.
If you want us to help you diagnose the problem on your system, we need a lot more information.
Operating system - Vista 32bit? as the original poster had.
Assuming PSE 10 - correct?
How many items in your catalog?
Where is the catalog held (internal/external disk)?
Where are the images held?
Is there plenty of free disk space?
How much RAM do you have?
It actually takes 15 to 20 seconds to delete from catalog and hard disk.
Yes, PSE 10.
37.2 GB (40,019,031,096 bytes) 8,598 Files, 187 Folders
Internal Hard Disk 256 GB free
6.0 GB RAM
You didn't say that you were using a different operating system, so if you are running on Vista 32 bit then your are probably wasting 2GB of RAM. Did the system come with 6GB or did you add some later on?
If 8,599 is the number of items in your catalog, then that should not be a factor in the slow speed.
Have you used the task manager to monitor the performance during a deletion? It might be good if you could post a capture similar to that in message #13 above.
Have you checked you windows experience index - see What is the Windows Experience Index? - Windows Help
Have you run a defrag on your hard drive?
Have you optimized the catalog?
When you are deleting your image, are you using the organizer in Folder Location view or Thumbnail view? I find that the thumbnail view is quicker.
I am using Windows 7 Enterprise. This OS has a constant defrag built in. I have used Windows Experience and that tells me nothing of interest. The RAM configuration is original. I am usually deleting from a newly loaded folder from my camera.
What is catalog optimization?
To optimize the catalog
- Load the organizer
- From the File menu, select Manage Catalogs - that should open the Catalog Manager.
- Select you current catalog and click on the Repair button
- When that has finished, click on the Optimize button
- When that is done, click on the Cancel button to close the Catalog Manager
Nothing much seems to have changed through all of this. Thanks for trying.
Did you check which view you are using?
If you are using Folder Location view as in the above, try switching to Thumbnail view to see if that is any quicker.
In the organizer, the Folder Location view has to do a lot more work and, in the older versions, it wasn't very efficient. I think it was re-written in version 11 & 12.
The main design of the organizer seems to be focused on using the thumbnail view most of the time.
I work in folders only. Thumbnail view rarely serves my purposes and generally leads to confusion for me. But thanks for the suggestion.
Photoshop elements was mainly design to work in thumbnail view, using tags to locate images.
I rarely use the folder location view as it only provides one view of the images. I like using multiple tags on images so that I can view the images in many different ways.
If you don't use tags or raw files, perhaps you don't need to use the organizer at all. Some people use windows/file explorer to find their image and then right click on the image and select edit in Photoshop elements editor (this does need setting up)
If you want to continue using the organizer, perhaps you could download the trial version 12 and see if it works any better for you. If you do want to test it, I suggest that copy one of your folders and import that to do your tests. Any changes made using the version 12 will not be recognized by your version 10. The version 12 folder handling should be better.