16 Replies Latest reply on Feb 28, 2013 8:58 AM by Ed.Macke

    Pro Noob: CS6 Workflow - Coming From Premiere Elements

    Ed.Macke Level 3

      I have a question about workflow for Premiere Pro, specifically how to adapt my Premiere Elements workflow to Pro.

       

      Currently, I'm using Premiere Elements to edit years' worth of home movie DV-AVI footage. More than once, PRE has crashed and left my project in an unrecoverable state (meaning I lost all the time I spent) so on the advice of some very wise Elements forum members, I developed the following workflow years back:

       

      1. Open a new project

      2. Import the next 100 DV-AVI files to be worked on (I import my tapes using SceneAlyzer which splits each scene into a separate file, so each file = 1 scene)

      3. Cull the clips, plop them on the timeline, do the usual transitions / audio / music, etc.

      4. Save my project about every minute (seriously, Ctrl+S is my best friend)

      5. When I get to the point where I'd be uncomfortable if PRE blew up and I had to start my project from scratch, I export entire edited project to DV-AVI

      6. Go back to Step 1.

       

      When my exported DV-AVIs (from Step 5) total around an hour, I'll open a new "master" project, import all the "Step 5" exported DV-AVI files, plunk them down sequentially on the timeline, add menu markers, etc. and burn a DVD.

       

      Now transitioning to Premiere Pro, I'm wondering

       

      1. Has anybody ever had a Pro project get corrupted and become unuseable? It seems like one big project might be easier to work with, but I definitely have an aversion to "putting all my eggs in one basket".

       

      2. Can I (or should I) use Sequences to accomplish what I was using multiple projects for in PRE? Sequences are new and foreign concept, and seem pretty powerful - like maybe I could use them in place of my "mini projects" in PRE. But unfortunately they are pretty much glossed over in everything I've read, e.g. the Adobe "Classroom In A Book" gives them maybe 1 page.

       

      My #1 priority is not losing work. After that, whatever is easiest for dealing with the literally 1000's of files I have to go through...

       

      So what's everybody's real-world / best practice advice for converting my Element workflow to Pro?

        • 1. Re: Pro Noob: CS6 Workflow - Coming From Premiere Elements
          John T Smith Adobe Community Professional & MVP

          1-Yes, projects do become corrupted... never happened to me, but doing a "save as" to a new project "every now and then" may be a good idea

           

          2-I only use one kind of video in a project, so have never used different sequences... just one sequence and one timeline

           

          Since you are new to PPro, the tutorial list in message #3 http://forums.adobe.com/message/2276578 might be a place to start

          • 2. Re: Pro Noob: CS6 Workflow - Coming From Premiere Elements
            Ed.Macke Level 3

            John, thanks for the page of links. Definitely a good place to start. And thanks for the info on file corruption. I suspected that "never seen a corrupted project" was a little much to hope for, but I hoped maybe Adobe had made it bulletproof in the Pro product.

             

            In Elements, I had my preferences set to keep the prior 99 versions of a project, so hitting "Save" every couple of minutes was a fairly safe way to ensure either corruption or idiocy on my part would lose limited work. In theory, any way - after adopting my workflow, I never had a corrupted project.... knock wood.

            • 3. Re: Pro Noob: CS6 Workflow - Coming From Premiere Elements
              Ed.Macke Level 3

              Regarding sequences: I really cannot find anything that explains why you might want to use them. When does it make sense to use sequences versus clips? What are the pro's and con's?

               

              All the training material seems to treat "clips" and "sequences" as conceptually the same, except a sequence is a bunch of clips or something? There's some detail on *what* a sequence is, but not a lot of *why*.

               

              If it's something I should be using - and would make my life easier, it's something I'd like to become familiar with and incorporate into my workflow before it's too late. On the other hand, if it's something I really don't need, I'd like to know that so I can just skip over those parts and not fret.

              • 4. Re: Pro Noob: CS6 Workflow - Coming From Premiere Elements
                the_wine_snob Level 9

                John,

                 

                I use several "Save" actions, depending on what I have done.

                 

                Ctrl+S, or File Save, are used fairly often.

                When I have completed a large segment, and especially if I will be shutting down for the day, I do a Save_As. That leaves the original Project, with its AutoSaves, untouched, and my Save_As Project is left open in Premiere.

                I also employ Save_As_a_Copy, to "archive" a Project, but continue working on the one open in Premiere.

                 

                I use the same scheme, in both versions of Premiere, and have never lost a Project. Now, I might have to redo some work, should something happen after the last Save_As, if my AutoSaves do not help, but I have never lost more than about an hour's work. Also, I have found Premiere (both versions) to be quite stable. Over the years, I have had more crashes (maybe 3 - 4) with PrE, than PrPro, and usually when I was trying to work on a Project that was really too large for that program. I have never encountered a Project size issue in any version of PrPro.

                 

                For more info on Saving, this article might be useful to you, to determine which is right for that moment in time: http://forums.adobe.com/message/3397716#3397716

                 

                Good luck,

                 

                Hunt

                • 5. Re: Pro Noob: CS6 Workflow - Coming From Premiere Elements
                  John T Smith Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                  >hoped maybe Adobe had made it bulletproof in the Pro product

                   

                  There are FAR too many variables of hardware and software (including non-Adobe programs running in the background) for Adobe to test every combination

                   

                  One bit of advice that is given, fairly often, is to have two computers... one that is ONLY for editing, and another for everything else

                   

                  And, on the editing only computer, do not visit ANY web page other than Microsoft for Windows updates or Adobe for Adobe updates

                   

                  I have even read some messages where the editing computer is completely disconnected from the Internet once the required activations are complete... with updates downloaded on a different computer and brought over to the editing computer via USB memory stick

                   

                  I don't have space or $$ to do that... so maybe I have just been lucky in that I have not had any problems

                  • 6. Re: Pro Noob: CS6 Workflow - Coming From Premiere Elements
                    Jim_Simon Level 8

                    Regarding sequences: I really cannot find anything that explains why you might want to use them. When does it make sense to use sequences versus clips?

                     

                    A clip is a captured media file.  A sequence is what you add clips to, it's basically another word for timeline.

                     

                    PP can have multiple sequences, so each 'video' might go into it's own sequence.

                     

                    I've had about 1500 DV clips in a project with half a dozen sequences and no problems.  PP isn't perfect, but CS6 on Windows is very stable.

                    • 7. Re: Pro Noob: CS6 Workflow - Coming From Premiere Elements
                      Ed.Macke Level 3

                      Unfortunately, I too don't have the $$$ to have a dedicated video machine.

                       

                      My experience with Premiere Elements, like Hunt, has been that's it's pretty darn stable (I'm still on v7). It rarely crashes, and when it does crash *usually* the project opens just fine upon re-start. It's really been pretty rare that a project file got corrupted. However, if/when it does happen, you're kind of screwed unless you have a backup. But I guess that's true for a lot of things...

                       

                      So it sounds like the Pro might be a little more stable, but still not immune to a project getting corrupted. And that's what I wanted to know.

                      • 8. Re: Pro Noob: CS6 Workflow - Coming From Premiere Elements
                        Jim_Simon Level 8

                        I don't have the $$$ to have a dedicated video machine.

                         

                        That can make a big difference.

                        • 9. Re: Pro Noob: CS6 Workflow - Coming From Premiere Elements
                          Ed.Macke Level 3

                          But you can add clips directly to the timeline, without adding them to a sequence first, right?

                           

                          Also, it seems like a sequence can almost be a mini-project. It can have its own settings, it can have video/audio/effects, and be saved as a discreet, self-contained little unit.

                           

                          So, let's say, for example, I have a years' worth of family movie clips. How would I use sequences?

                           

                          Part of me pictures using them like I currently use individual projects in Elements (say, steps 1 - 4 in my original workflow). The Christmas-related clips would all go into one sequence, I'd edit them down, add music and effects, whatever, and that sequence would just do onto my timeline. Then the next sequence would be New Year's Eve.

                           

                          Another part of me doesn't really see any advantage to using sequences over just plopping clips down on the timeline sans sequences.

                           

                          So how do people use sequences? What's a real-life example of what's in a sequence, and how does using a sequence provide any advantage over just putting clips directly on the timeline like I do in Elements?

                          • 11. Re: Pro Noob: CS6 Workflow - Coming From Premiere Elements
                            Ed.Macke Level 3

                            OK, I took a look at some of those resources, and read some more of the PP help. I think I have a much better understanding of what sequences are!

                             

                            One "aha" moment came when the PP Help PDF pointed out that each sequence has its own separate, distinct timeline. I think part of my confusion was that in Premiere Elements, you just have a (single) timeline and all your clips go there. But in Pro, you can have multiple timelines. So in Elements, the timeline is by project (conceptually at least, not sure about technically), whereas in Pro the timeline is by sequence.

                             

                            What was really helpful was a screenshot where they had 2 sequences in a project. And each sequence was "opened", so in the timeline frame, there were 2 timeline panels - and each panel's tab was the name of the sequence. I didn't realize until then that Pro could have multiple timelines, so that really illustrated how a sequence maintains its own timeline.

                             

                            I even managed to grasp how in addtion to regular clips, a particular sequence's timeline could have other sequence on it, resulting in nested sequences. I'm not what would happen if you start trimming a nested sequence, but at least I get the concept.

                             

                            So with a new and improved understanding how what a sequence is, that still left me wondering how people use them.

                             

                            It seems one reason for sequences is when you different video types, say a project with DV-AVI and h.264 footage you'd create a sequence for each video type.

                             

                            Another reason seems to be if you want to re-use a sequence. But I'm having a hard time thinking of an example where you'd want to do that.

                             

                            Another reason seems to be simply to keep things organized and compartmentalized.

                             

                            John mentioned he uses only one sequence. That would seem to be similar to how Elements does things.

                             

                            Jim mentioned that he had a project with 1500 clips of one type of video, but used several sequences. So, I'm curious what each sequence was. How did you decide what a sequence should be?

                             

                            How do other people use sequences???

                             

                             

                             

                             

                             

                             

                            That really clarified things, because Elements has no such thing - it has one timeline, period. Seeing how each sequence had its own distinct timeline made it come toge

                            • 12. Re: Pro Noob: CS6 Workflow - Coming From Premiere Elements
                              the_wine_snob Level 9

                              Ed,

                               

                              As Jim states, a Sequence is basically a Timeline.

                               

                              Different people use them in different ways, depending on how they are editing.

                               

                              In most cases, I think of Sequences as "scenes," or "chapters," for the Project, and edit in them that way. For instance, I had a recent Project with 17 "chapters." For me, each "chapter" was edited separately, in their own Sequence.

                               

                              One aspect of Sequences that you will probably want to read up on is Nesting of Sequences into another. Very powerful tool, and it allows various operations to be performed on the Nested Sequence. Here is an AdobeTV tutorial: http://tv.adobe.com/watch/digital-video-cs6/nesting-sequences/

                               

                              Good luck,

                               

                              Hunt

                              1 person found this helpful
                              • 13. Re: Pro Noob: CS6 Workflow - Coming From Premiere Elements
                                Jim_Simon Level 8

                                I'm curious what each sequence was.

                                 

                                If I'm doing a wedding, I'll make a sequence for the opening, the ceremony, the formal session, the cocktails and the reception.  I create a 'master' sequence and nest all these others into for a complete whole.

                                 

                                For a corporate project, sometimes there are several sections covering different aspects of the subject matter, so each section will get it's own sequence.

                                 

                                If you're doing a narrative, a short film or even a longer film, you might break up each scene into it's own sequence.

                                 

                                For family videos maybe you want Thanksgiving in one sequence and Christmas in another.

                                 

                                There are probably unlimited reasons why you might use multiple sequences in a project.

                                1 person found this helpful
                                • 14. Re: Pro Noob: CS6 Workflow - Coming From Premiere Elements
                                  Ed.Macke Level 3

                                  Hunt / Jim:

                                   

                                  I originally started doing the multiple projects per DVD as a defense mechanism against Elements crashing, but I actually ended up really liking the workflow it created.

                                   

                                  It sounds like sequences might offer the same type thing for me.

                                   

                                  For example, in Elements I would have a project for Thanksgiving, a project for Christmas, a project for a music montage at the end, and then a master project that glued them all together.

                                   

                                  In Pro, it sounds like I would have a project for the entire DVD, a sequence for Christmas, a sequence for Thanksgiving, etc., and lastly a sequence that is made up of pretty much just those other sequences.

                                   

                                  If so, that sounds like a workflow that I'm very comfortable with. Conceptually it's the same thing I've been doing, only instead of having to have separate projects (and exporting each project to a DV-AVI for import to the "master" project), I can do the same thing with sequences all within a single project. Nice!

                                  • 15. Re: Pro Noob: CS6 Workflow - Coming From Premiere Elements
                                    the_wine_snob Level 9

                                    Ed,

                                     

                                    You are correct. Think of Sequences/Timelines in PrPro similar to individual Projects in PrE - just within one Project.

                                     

                                    When you get used to Sequences, you will love them!

                                     

                                    Good luck,

                                     

                                    Hunt

                                    • 16. Re: Pro Noob: CS6 Workflow - Coming From Premiere Elements
                                      Ed.Macke Level 3

                                      I think you're right, Hunt.

                                       

                                      At first I was trying to avoid sequences because - coming from Elements - they were odd and foreign. But I'm starting to see the possibilities and power they provide, and I'm thinking they might become my favorite new discovery.

                                       

                                      I have to admit, I'm  still a little nervous about having an entire DVD's worth of editing work in one project. But I hoping the stability of CS6, combined with the various Autosave / Save / Save As strategies, plus my daily backups, will help me sleep at night.