7 Replies Latest reply: Mar 19, 2013 8:09 PM by Vik_R RSS

    Newbie Question: Best Option for First Baseline?

    Vik_R Community Member

      I understand that in book design, it's important for the bottom line on the left-hand page to be in the same vertical position as the bottom line on the right-hand page. I've read that the way to do this is with Text Frame Options->Baseline Options->First Baseline Offset.  I see the following options there:

       

      • Ascent
      • Cap Height
      • Leading
      • x Height
      • Fixed

       

      Are these options all equally preferable for book design?

       

      Thanks in advance to all for any thoughts or info.

        • 1. Re: Newbie Question: Best Option for First Baseline?
          Willi Adelberger MVP

          I think it is a design question.

          When I layout with facing pages I try to set the images so the upper edge is aligned with Cap Height of text on the baseline grid of the same spread. That means for me that I try to get (depending on the font) the upper border aligned with text and image as well. So I choose the baseline grid that the Cap Height  is aligning with the border. Because I work with mm and InDesign with Inch and DTP-Points I have to take care on internal rounding problems (e.g. sometimes InDesign tells me that a 5mm distance is to small and should be at least 5mm, that is caused by rounding errors to the metric system). So I add always small values to get rid of those messages.

          • 2. Re: Newbie Question: Best Option for First Baseline?
            [Ariel] Community Member

            Good question.

             

            In my opinion (and there's 2 long shelves of books that I've designed

            over the past few years sitting in the bookcase behind me), the best

            choice is "fixed."

             

            The main reason is this: any of the other choices can lead to subtle,

            but significant misalignments -- and this can cause the page to be 1

            line short, depending on the text that appears on the top line of the page.

             

            Why? Because everything except "fixed" is dependent on the font that

            happens to appear on the top line. So clearly, if you happen to have a

            larger font in the middle of the book text (not just subheads -- perhaps

            for some reason one word, or even one letter, is enlarged somewhere in

            the book; or, if you've chosen "leading", then the leading might be

            different for one character), and that letter happens to fall at the top

            of the text frame, all the text on that page will not be aligning to the

            baseline.

             

            So let's say you fix that for the one page. But then there's a late edit

            -- and that top line gets bumped to the second line on the page. Now

            everything on that page is badly adjusted again, and the page has to be

            fixed.

             

            You might say, How often, in a regular book, is there a larger word in

            the middle of a line? So here we come to the most insidious problem with

            the other settings: italics.

             

            Believe it or not, the x-height of an italic font is not necessarily

            identical to the x-height of the companion roman font. It can be

            slightly taller than the roman, even on well designed pro fonts. This is

            a design decision of the font maker.

             

            So, if you've aligned everything perfectly to the baseline grid, and set

            your text frame first baseline option to "x-height", and you've made

            sure that the depth of your text frame is a perfect multiple of your

            baseline grid, what can happen is this: The first word on the page is

            italics. So all the lines are imperceptibly shifted down a fraction

            below the baseline grid. Therefore, the LAST line on the page will be

            bumped off the page because there won't be quite enough room there, and

            the result is that your page is one line short! And good luck finding

            the cause of that (it took me ages first time because I never imagined

            that the italics x-height was taller than the roman)! (Of course, now

            I've told you the secret!)

             

            And once again, if you have a late edit to make, you'll have to check

            the entire book to see that no pages are inadvertently short.

             

            And if you decide to be clever, and make the text frame (or margins)

            just that little bit deeper to accommodate the necessary extra space for

            italics at the top of the page, it will mean that your footnotes (if

            there are any) won't be aligning perfectly to a regular line of text on

            the facing page (admittedly by an almost negligible amount).

             

            So what are the cons? Why not use "fixed"?

             

            The biggest reason against that I know of is that for some reason, using

            "fixed" disables the option of keeping any paragraph rules within the

            text frame. Keeping a rule (or line) within the text frame can be a

            useful way of making some text start lower down on the page (if you use

            an invisible white rule). With "fixed", for some reason, this option is

            unavailable.

             

            Another reason against is that with "fixed", if an inline graphic

            happens to fall at the top of the page, it will often end up floating

            above the text frame.

             

            But for books without graphics (and even with), I would recommend

            "fixed" as the best, most predictable option.

             

            Ariel

            • 3. Re: Newbie Question: Best Option for First Baseline?
              Peter Spier ACP/MVPs

              I haven't done as many books as Ariel, but I think it bears mentioning that running a line short, or having a misalinment at the bottom, in my experience, is usually unrelated to the first baseline position.

               

              Misalignment is caused by shifts in leading (as mentioned) which might be caused by adding a block quote or some other differently formatted paragraph or line, or by adding paragraph spacing that is not equal to a full line space.

               

              Whitespace at the bottom of a page is usally the result of keep options kicking in. INn those cases I usually "cheat" by making the frames on both pages in the spread one line longer or one line shorter to try to move the paragraph withthe problem keep option off it's current position. I find this to be less obvious to the reader than a blank line, but it's a matter of personal taste, I think.

              • 4. Re: Newbie Question: Best Option for First Baseline?
                [Jongware] MVP

                It depends on what comes at the top of each page.

                 

                If you are designing plain-text-only books, you wouldn't notice the difference between the options! For ease of calculating how much text lines you can fit on each page, I'd recommend Leading -- then the total text frame height is simply number of lines * leading.

                 

                However, if you have freely-positioned material such as tables or figures, that may appear at the top of a text frame, and where there may be text on the verso, you need to take different font sizes into account. If you use Leading and your caption text at the top is smaller (and thus should have a smaller leading), your table text would appear higher than the text on the reverse page. So in that case you could use Ascent or Cap Height -- but then you'd have the *baseline* visibly higher.

                 

                I prefer using an Object style for floating matter, so I can adjust the top position of floating materials. Depending on the font, font size, and sometimes other graphical elements (top lines etc.), I adjust the top distance so I get either the top of capitals *or* the baseline equal to "regular" text -- whatever looks best.

                • 5. Re: Newbie Question: Best Option for First Baseline?
                  Vik_R Community Member

                  Thanks to all for this great advice.

                   

                  From what I think I am gathering, the top line on the page can be taken into account to determine a suitable baseline option. Since the top line of my chapters have a large font, it may be appropriate to use the leading option.

                   

                  For example, here is a page using the fixed option:

                   

                  Screen Shot 2013-03-19 at 11.09.08 AM.png

                   

                  Here is the page using the leading option:

                   

                  Screen Shot 2013-03-19 at 11.09.49 AM.png

                  Most pages line up well automatically now, but a few need to be fixed. Using @Peter's advice, I can fix most of them by adding or subtracting a line from the facing text frames. But what is the correct way to handle it, when even that doesn't work? Here's a 30-second video with an example:

                   

                   

                  Thanks very much in advance for any info.

                  • 6. Re: Newbie Question: Best Option for First Baseline?
                    Ellis home Community Member

                    I realize this doesn't apply to all cases, but if you are in command of the text (meaning you are allow to split paragraphs), I would usually "cheat", splitting a paragraph in two where is makes sense. That way a line will be added at the bottom and I get my two pages even. In your video, I would split a paragraph in your left page or if not possible there then in previous pages.

                    • 7. Re: Newbie Question: Best Option for First Baseline?
                      Vik_R Community Member

                      Excellent. Thanks very much!