18 Replies Latest reply: Jun 20, 2013 3:46 PM by A.T. Romano RSS

    Can no longer select or move audio clips on Narration track - what happened??

    FiveBuy160 Community Member

      I began my first Adobe Premiere Elements 11 project this morning, a short video (5 mins) I intend to upload to YouTube.  It's a comedy sketch involving inanimate objects that "talk", so it requires a lot of dialogue to be added to, in this case, the Narration track.

       

      I am not new to Premiere Elements.  In fact, I've done quite a bit of fairly complex editing on previous versions of the software (I upgraded to 11.0 from 8.0).  I've never had this problem before.

       

      After editing this project for well over 2 hours with no problem, I can suddently no longer move or even select any audio clip on my Narration track.  They are just frozen and stuck there.  Everything else works normally.  I can select and move all other clips on all other tracks.  Further, all audio clips will play, even the ones on the Narration track.  However, I can no longer move, select, or even add any clip to the Narration track.

       

      I opened a new project to see if the problem persisted, but it didn't - I could add, select, move audio clips on the Narration track just fine.

       

      I'm stuck and bewildered.  The project I've already invested 2-3 hours into seems permanently broken.  The audio clips on my Narration track will play, but I can't select, move, or otherwise do anything to them.

       

      My fear is not just that I'll have to start this project over again, but I'll never know when it will break again, and I'll lose all my work again.

       

      Help!

       

      Seriously, does anyone know what's happened?

        • 1. Re: Can no longer select or move audio clips on Narration track - what happened??
          the_wine_snob CommunityMVP

          I had a very old "test" Project, that behaved, as you describe, however it had been used for over a year, and opened, and edited, every few days, to test for problems, that others were having. One of the Audio Tracks (not one of the two Fixed Audio Tracks: Narration, or Soundtrack). I have no idea what happened to effectively "lock" that Audio Track.

           

          How much editing was done to the Clips on the Narration Track? If not all that much, this might be a workaround. Drag your Clips from the Project Media Panel to a free Audio Track, say Audio 1, or Audio 2. Edit those, to match what you did on the Narration Track. When done, go to the Audio Mixer, and check Mute for the Narration Track.

           

          Good luck, and while not ideal, that workaround might be useful to get your Project complete. Wish that I had some idea what happend to my Audio Track, and to your Narration Track, but I never figured that out.

           

          Hunt

          • 2. Re: Can no longer select or move audio clips on Narration track - what happened??
            FiveBuy160 Community Member

            This is the original poster.  I just finished a 90-minute Chat session with Adobe, and here is what I found out:

             

            1.  "This is a known bug and has already been reported."  These are Adobe's words, discovered after a senior tech advisor was finally consulted.

             

            Basically, if you do too much "work" on the Narration track, it will "lock" and you will be unable to do anything with it again.  In my case, I had been chopping up long dialogue clips into shorter clips, and rearranging them.  Then, suddenly, I could no longer move or select any of these audio clips on the Narration track.

             

            2.  Suggested workaround:  "Avoid doing too much work on the Narration track - use an empty Audio track instead."

             

            3.  When I asked if this bug was going to be fixed, I was told to check on "Updates" under the "Help" menu and download any updates as they become available.

             

            I must admit, I've used Premiere Elements for years, and this particular bug in this version is quite disappointing.  I now feel like I have to walk a minefield of potential freezes and lost work whenever I use the program.

             

            In any case, this is where it stands.

            • 3. Re: Can no longer select or move audio clips on Narration track - what happened??
              the_wine_snob CommunityMVP

              We have observed some anomalies with both of the Fixed Audio Tracks: Narration and Soundtrack. In some instances (also appear to Project-specific), they will no longer Export/Share the Audio Clips on them. Perhaps part of the same Bug?

               

              In general, many responders here recommend against using either of those Tracks, and as per the reply that you got from Adobe, use a "regular" Audio Track instead. In most of those situations, the user WAS able to Select the Clips on the Narration, or Soundtrack Audio Track, and just drag the Clips to, say Audio 2. That always "fixed" those problems.

               

              In my case, the Audio Track that became totally unresponsive was a regular Audio Track, but as mentioned, I had done a ton of editing of that Project, testing many things, so it was very old (at least a year), and had seen a lot of editing over that time. That was the only similar problems, that I have ever personally encountered. The result was the same, as for you with the Narration Track, but with some differences.

               

              Thank you for reporting, and perhaps another reason to not rely on the two Fixed Audio Tracks.

               

              Good luck,

               

              Hunt

              • 4. Re: Can no longer select or move audio clips on Narration track - what happened??
                FiveBuy160 Community Member

                Thank you for both your replies, Bill.

                 

                I was unaware of the recommendations against using the "Fixed" audio tracks - "Narration" and "Soundtrack.  I will now treat the "Soundtrack" as I will the "Narration"...

                 

                ...with extreme caution.  In fact, I'll probably stop using them at all.  Instead, I'll try to always build audio on separate (created) tracks.

                 

                This is a shame, though.  The fixed tracks were convenient.

                 

                And more importantly, it's disappointing - and somewhat disturbing - that two features permanently affixed to the "expert" timeline are, essentially, no longer trustworthy - and hence no longer usable.

                 

                I have long sung the praises of Adobe's Premiere Elements - an extremely powerful program at an affordable price.


                But this has soured me somewhat.  It seems like a pretty big bug to have/leave in a piece of consumer software.

                 

                Thanks again for your insight, Bill.  I appreciate it.

                • 5. Re: Can no longer select or move audio clips on Narration track - what happened??
                  the_wine_snob CommunityMVP

                  I was unaware of the recommendations against using the "Fixed" audio tracks - "Narration" and "Soundtrack.  I will now treat the "Soundtrack" as I will the "Narration"...

                  This came about, as we began seeing issues with those two Fixed Tracks, and especially the inability to Export/Share Audio Clips on them - though the issues DID seem to be Project-specific, as the same user, on the same computer would have no such issues, with several subsequent Projects. Still, because of the number of reports, some of us got a bit "gun-shy."

                   

                  This is a shame, though.  The fixed tracks were convenient.

                  I agree completely, and additional shame comes from new users, who see the names of those Tracks, and then logically use them, as they were intended. Again, issues seem to be Project-specific, so it's hard to track down the cause, and on Adobe's end, probably tough to reproduce with any regularity. Intermittent behavior, with many possible variables, is just tough to troubleshoot.

                   

                  Good luck,

                   

                  Hunt

                  • 6. Re: Can no longer select or move audio clips on Narration track - what happened??
                    sleinbach Community Member

                    I am having the same issue. After 10 hours of work on a project it looks like it is hosed. I am very dissapointed. It looks like the names of the tracks have dissapeared and I can not rename them. Is there any way to fix this and restore the project?

                    • 7. Re: Can no longer select or move audio clips on Narration track - what happened??
                      A.T. Romano Community Member

                      steinbach

                       

                      Could you explain what you mean when you write that the names of the tracks have disappeared and I can not rename them?

                       

                      How does your issue of disappearing track names relate to the narration track that appear to be locked for the other user? And, what are these tracks whose name have gone missing? Audio, Narration, Soundtrack...all tracks including video?

                       

                      I had an interesting or dud of an idea for remedy of the original, but I am not clear where your issue fits in.

                       

                      ATR

                      • 8. Re: Can no longer select or move audio clips on Narration track - what happened??
                        sleinbach Community Member

                        A.T. Romano,

                         

                        Easier to show you than expalin. Here is what it looks like after the tracks are locked:

                         

                        PrE.jpg

                         

                        Here is the normal view with track names and keyframe buttons. Notice that even though only the bottom two tracks above are locked, all tracks are missing the track name and keyframe buttons.

                         

                        PrE-normal.jpg

                         

                        I am not sure if the missing names and buttons are related to the locked tracks, however it seems like both of these happened at the same time. I hope you can come up with a solution so my work is not lost.

                         

                        Thanks for helping!

                         

                        Sam

                        • 9. Re: Can no longer select or move audio clips on Narration track - what happened??
                          A.T. Romano Community Member

                          sleinbach

                           

                          Thanks for the details. As I suggested this idea that I had after reading this thread may be just nonesense, but I thought it would be interesting to try.

                           

                          This is recommended done with a copy of the project that you have now.

                           

                          For now, let us assume that the missing track names are part of the locked Narration Track syndrome. I am not sure if your narration clip was generated in Premiere Elements narration feature or created elsewhere and brought into the program. That would be interesting information to have. But, nonetheless, moving forward with this idea.

                           

                          Given you cannot move, delete, change, etc what is on this Narration Track. Whatever is on that Narration Track traces back to an original on the hard drive and probably is shown in Media Cache's (Adobe Folder) as  conformed audio cfa and pek set.

                           

                          a. Find the narration hard drive hard location and move it to a new location (special folder on hard drive). When you go back to the copy of the problem project, you should be greeted with one of those "Where is....?" messages. Cancel out of that. Do not do anything within that message dialog.

                           

                          b. Right click the thumbnail for your narration in Project Media and select Replace Footage. Then browse to and select the original that you had moved to the computer desktop and the special folder there.. Click OK. That should restore the file (including whatever effects were made to the file) to the project.

                           

                          c. Has any of that had any effect on unlocking the Narration Track?

                           

                          Other maneuvers to try

                           

                          a. Trying to locate and delete any cfa or pek files associated with the problem audio.

                           

                          b. Switching to an Aero Theme for Windows if you do not have one set so far.

                           

                          Thanks for giving all of that a look at.

                           

                          ATR

                          • 10. Re: Can no longer select or move audio clips on Narration track - what happened??
                            FiveBuy160 Community Member

                            Hi:

                             

                            I'm the original poster, and since I guess I'm still subscribed to this topic, I was alerted to your continuation of this thread.


                            Since I never posted a resolution to my original problem, I'll do so now, in the hope that it might help you or others with a similar problem - specifically, clips freezing on the Narration track.

                             

                            For me, after almost 2 hours on Chat Support with Adobe, the solution was as follows:

                             

                            1.  Switch from "Expert" to "Quick" view;

                            2.  Delete the right-most clip from the Narration track;

                            3.  Return to "Expert" view and the other clips should now be usable.

                             

                            For me, it turned out - for reasons still unknown - that the right-most clip on the Narration track was causing the problem.  You may have to experiment in "Quick" view to delete a different (or several) clips to get things working again (i.e., Trial and Error).

                             

                            As to the bottom line:  I was able to save my project.  For future projects, I've avoided doing any sort of complicated cutting/rearranging of sound clips on the "fixed" tracks of "Narration" and "Soundtrack", and have therefore not had the problem re-occur.

                             

                            Hopes this helps.

                            • 11. Re: Can no longer select or move audio clips on Narration track - what happened??
                              A.T. Romano Community Member

                              FiveBoy160

                               

                              Thanks for the update and the great news that you were able to save the project that got hit with this issue.

                               

                              I do not have a model problem narration system to try out what worked for you. Any details on how I can force this issue in my Premiere Elements so that I could experiment with the suggestions for fixing such a project.

                               

                              I have seen "lots of work on the narration track" associated with the problem, but could you give greater definition to lots of work with regard to what effects and other were applied to components on the narration track that locked. Just too many narration clips and/or other?

                               

                              Great follow up.

                               

                              Thanks.

                               

                              ATR

                               

                              Add On...After thought question, regarding Adobe's suggestion to go to the Quick review and delete that end narration clip. Can I assume that the same end narration clip would not delete in the Expert view like the rest of the Timeline narration content?

                              • 12. Re: Can no longer select or move audio clips on Narration track - what happened??
                                FiveBuy160 Community Member

                                I hadn't really intended to add more to this topic, but since you asked so nicely, I feel I don't really have a choice! 

                                 

                                Unfortunately, I don't remember a great deal of additional detail, as the problem, as evidenced by the date of my original post, occured over 2 months ago.  The one thing I can add is that you are correct about "lots of work on the narration track" being the apparent culprit, i.e., "just too many narration clips".

                                 

                                I was cutting a comedy short with a great deal of V.O. (voice over).  I used the Narration track as my "workbench", i.e., I had long clips of narration that I had to chop up and distribute to various locations on my timeline.  I would cut them on the narration track, trim them, and leave them in pieces to the right of the timeline, ready to move into position when I needed them.  So I had a lot of short little clips sitting spaced out all over the Narration track, some in their final resting place associated with video on the timeline, but a great many just sitting off to the right, waiting to be put in place.  No other "effects" were applied.

                                 

                                The "lock up" occured suddenly and without notice, and took the form of my being unable to select, move, or delete ANY clip on the Narration track in "Expert" view.  Everything was just glued in place.

                                 

                                That's when I sought out and discovered this board.

                                 

                                And that's all I have on this topic.


                                Good luck!

                                 

                                P.S.  I guess I can add one more thing:  I have since learned it IS possible to use other "Audio" tracks like the "workbench" I described above - just NOT the "fixed" tracks of "Narration" and "Soundtrack".  Since applying this strategy, I have not had any "lockup" reoccurence.

                                • 13. Re: Can no longer select or move audio clips on Narration track - what happened??
                                  A.T. Romano Community Member

                                  FiveBuy160

                                   

                                  Great reply. Thanks for taking the time to answer so fully. Much appreciated.

                                   

                                  ATR

                                  • 14. Re: Can no longer select or move audio clips on Narration track - what happened??
                                    LNPato

                                    I have the same problem, but I really don't have much on the narration track...my whole project is only 2 minutes long!

                                    I tried switching to Quick View, and I can select clips, but still can't do anything with them (cut/delete/move). I tried selecting them all in quick view & then swtiching to expert...they are still selected, but, again, can't do anything with them.

                                     

                                    Any other suggestions? Other than write a complaint to Adobe...

                                    • 15. Re: Can no longer select or move audio clips on Narration track - what happened??
                                      A.T. Romano Community Member

                                      Int

                                       

                                      Since this is a 2 minute project with the narration issue, what happens if you start a new project?

                                       

                                      Do you still end up in the same predicament?

                                       

                                      ATR

                                      • 16. Re: Can no longer select or move audio clips on Narration track - what happened??
                                        LNPato Community Member

                                        I've never had this issue before. I'm just happy it didn't happen in the more extensive video I've been working on that's almost 10 mintues long!

                                        I recorded my narration first, then cut it up & deleted parts that didn't work, then laid the video down over the narration clips. Like I said, it's only a 2 minute video...so I only had about 3 minutes of narration at the most that I was working with & cutting.

                                         

                                        For now, I just selected all the video & audio I could (other than the narration track) and shifted it right on the timeline. Then I re-cut & dragged my narrated recordings from my project assets to my Audio 3 track & selected what I wanted with the workbar. I am now going to produce it using the "Share Workbar Only" option.

                                         

                                        premiere narration track.jpg

                                        • 17. Re: Can no longer select or move audio clips on Narration track - what happened??
                                          LNPato Community Member

                                          Is there any way to select where your narration clips go? Could they possibly go into your project assets without being placed in the timeline? Or could you select which audio track for them to record to by default? Just a thought...

                                          • 18. Re: Can no longer select or move audio clips on Narration track - what happened??
                                            A.T. Romano Community Member

                                            Int

                                             

                                            Regarding

                                            Is there any way to select where your narration clips go

                                            Could they possibly go into your project assets without being placed in the timeline?

                                            ,,,could you select which audio track for them to record to by default?

                                             

                                            Only way I can think of is in terms of their hard drive save location. Edit Menu/Preferences/Scratch Disks/Captured Audio. What you set for the Captured Audio location will determine where the Premiere Elements produced Narration will be saved on the computer hard drive.

                                             

                                            When I click Done to a Narration in the program, I always get the wav file placed in media (version 11, Project Assets) as well as a copy on the Timeline at the location of the Timeline Indicator. (With regard to the Narration being placed automatically on the Timeline (Narration Track), I also got the "bright" idea to try unchecking "Capture to Timeline" in the DV and HDV Capture Windows. Dud of an idea.)

                                             

                                            If I think of any other possibilities, I will post them.

                                             

                                            ATR