13 Replies Latest reply: May 10, 2013 10:02 AM by neil wilkes RSS

    Newbie Blu Ray Audio Question

    IslayMalt

      Greetings, Not exactly "new" to Premiere, but left the game before Blu Ray came along.  I am using Premiere Pro 6 to author my first Blu Ray Disc.  I am importing material into Premiere that has DTS-HD 5.1 soundtrack.  After making the appropriate adjustemets to my Segment properties, the imported video lays down just fine.  As I run the video in the Segment Window, I can see all 5.1 channels doing their their thing on the levels meter.  Life is good.

       

      Whe I go to "Make" this Blu Ray disc (using Encore, which is also new since I left NLE), I assume it will burn the content (my movie) with the DTS-HD 5.1 track, BUT will it or can it generate a stereo track as well?  This is important as not every blu ray player can decode DTS-HD signals.  I need this Blu Ray to be able to play in almost any Blu Ray player HOWEVER I want the surround sound track there and used, if the player can decode it.  Make Sense?

       

      My imported clips are HandBrake products from a MKV files.  When I attempt to generate a Handbrake mp4 that contains both a stereo and DST-HD 5.1 track, Premiere only seems to see the stereo track.  Wierd.

       

      I apologize in advance if this is a stupid question, but I'm working a project now and don't really have time to plow through all the basics to get to an essoteric question such as this?

       

      FWIW:  Windows 7 64- Bit fully loaded with Pioneer Blu Ray burner.

       

      Please Help,

       

      Many Thanks,

       

      IslayMalt

        • 1. Re: Newbie Blu Ray Audio Question
          Jeff Bellune ACP

          Welcome to the forum.

           

          Please don't double-post.  I deleted your duplicate topic in the Pr forum.

           

          Jeff

          • 2. Re: Newbie Blu Ray Audio Question
            IslayMalt Community Member

            Sorry, I don't actually understand if it is a Premiere question or an Encore question.  I guess you think it is an Encore question?

            • 3. Re: Newbie Blu Ray Audio Question
              Jeff Bellune ACP

               

               

              It is indeed an En question.

               

              The DTS audio stream cannot be muxed into a file with a video stream.  It must remain separate, which is why your .mp4 didn't work.  If you create a separate stereo track and add it to its own audio track in your En timeline, you'll be able to set up the menus to let the audience choose which audio track they want to hear.

               

              Jeff

              • 4. Re: Newbie Blu Ray Audio Question
                Stan Jones MVP

                Encore passes through the 5.1.  You can't preview it. You must create a  separate file with the stereo. You will have an Encore timeline with the video and two audio tracks, one 5.1 and one stereo. You use navigation to select which the viewer uses.

                 

                Does that give you a start?

                 

                Where did that last Jeff post come from? It wasn't there a moment ago!

                • 5. Re: Newbie Blu Ray Audio Question
                  Jeff Bellune ACP

                  I post in stealth mode...

                  • 6. Re: Newbie Blu Ray Audio Question
                    IslayMalt Community Member

                    This is super helpful, thank you folks.  So how do I "generate" the stereo file from the 5.1 audio that has come in with my video clip? 

                     

                    Do I need to import the same clip into Premerie twice, once with a stereo track and once with the 5.1 and then manually "paste" the stereo strip into the timeline above the 5.1 tracks in the Premiere segment?  Or will Encore generate or derive a stereo down-mix from the 5.1 when it preps the file for burning to Blu Ray?

                     

                    or

                     

                    Do A/V amps and Blu Ray players that can't read DTS-MA 5.1 tracks automatically down-mix them to stereo and I shouldn't be worried about this at all? 

                     

                    Thanks in advance,

                    --IslayMalt

                    • 7. Re: Newbie Blu Ray Audio Question
                      Stan Jones MVP

                      Do A/V amps and Blu Ray players that can't read DTS-MA 5.1 tracks automatically down-mix them to stereo and I shouldn't be worried about this at all?

                      It is preferable to offer both options. But it is very common for Bluray players/systems to handle 5.1.

                       

                      Do I need to import the same clip into Premerie twice, once with a stereo track and once with the 5.1 and then manually "paste" the stereo strip into the timeline above the 5.1 tracks in the Premiere segment?  Or will Encore generate or derive a stereo down-mix from the 5.1 when it preps the file for burning to Blu Ray?

                      If you already have the 5.1 file, you export a stereo file from Premiere (or whatever program). In encore, you have a timeline with the video file, and on the first audio track you add either audio file. Then you add a second audio track and add the other audio file to it.

                       

                      See "Navigation for audio and subtitle tracks":

                       

                      http://help.adobe.com/en_US/encore/cs/using/WSbaf9cd7d26a2eabfe807401038582db29-7e8ca.html

                      • 8. Re: Newbie Blu Ray Audio Question
                        IslayMalt Community Member

                        Stan,

                         

                        You are really "the man".  Thanks so much, that answered my question!

                         

                        Have a terrific evening,

                         

                        --Islaymalt

                        • 9. Re: Newbie Blu Ray Audio Question
                          Stan Jones MVP

                          Good luck!

                          • 10. Re: Newbie Blu Ray Audio Question
                            idar lettrem Community Member

                            Jeff - is Minnetokas Surcode required in order to make a BD play 5.1 properly on a set top BD player ?  Or will PPro encoding to dolby digital ( adobe)  be sufficient for En ?  ( all CS6)

                            • 11. Re: Newbie Blu Ray Audio Question
                              Jeff Bellune ACP

                              You can't create a DD5.1 audio stream with Pr unless you use a third-party solution like the Surcode plug-in.  (I don't know of any other DD5.1 plug-ins for Pr offhand.)  You could also export a multi-channel WAV file from Pr to use in an external encoder.  The important thing is that the 5.1 audio stream is kept separate and imported into En as an asset.  It must show up in the project panel in En as "Don't Transcode", which will indicate that En will pass through the 5.1 audio.  If En re-transcodes it, then all you'll get is stereo DD.

                               

                              Jeff

                              • 12. Re: Newbie Blu Ray Audio Question
                                idar lettrem Community Member

                                OK. Then it's minnetoka next, BUT I have two more trials to go and I have some issues to  resolve first .  I'm in a situation where I want to backup a number of my music BD's. Aiseesoft does an exellent job on ripping these, and transcodes to ( takes care of)  ac3 audio format  (mp4 container). I've tried a number of approaches - mpeg2_ts, h264.ac3 etc. (http://forums.creativecow.net/thread/145/870940)

                                How should I define the audio track setup subsequently in PPro  - define a single master 5.1 , define 6 separate A-channels , or define 6 separate + one 5.1 ? From a number of tutorials I've seen this should  be quite an easy task, but I can't get  it to work properly. And I've come to realize that En does exactly what it is told to - but so far stereo, strero and nothing but stereo outputs. And thats not En's fault as the sound file shows up as "dont transcode" - but my bad somewhere else ...

                                any more help here?

                                • 13. Re: Newbie Blu Ray Audio Question
                                  neil wilkes MVP

                                  IslayMalt wrote:

                                   

                                  Greetings, Not exactly "new" to Premiere, but left the game before Blu Ray came along.  I am using Premiere Pro 6 to author my first Blu Ray Disc.  I am importing material into Premiere that has DTS-HD 5.1 soundtrack.  After making the appropriate adjustemets to my Segment properties, the imported video lays down just fine.  As I run the video in the Segment Window, I can see all 5.1 channels doing their their thing on the levels meter.  Life is good.

                                   

                                  Whe I go to "Make" this Blu Ray disc (using Encore, which is also new since I left NLE), I assume it will burn the content (my movie) with the DTS-HD 5.1 track, BUT will it or can it generate a stereo track as well?  This is important as not every blu ray player can decode DTS-HD signals.  I need this Blu Ray to be able to play in almost any Blu Ray player HOWEVER I want the surround sound track there and used, if the player can decode it.  Make Sense?

                                   

                                  My imported clips are HandBrake products from a MKV files.  When I attempt to generate a Handbrake mp4 that contains both a stereo and DST-HD 5.1 track, Premiere only seems to see the stereo track.  Wierd.

                                   

                                  I apologize in advance if this is a stupid question, but I'm working a project now and don't really have time to plow through all the basics to get to an essoteric question such as this?

                                   

                                  FWIW:  Windows 7 64- Bit fully loaded with Pioneer Blu Ray burner.

                                   

                                  Please Help,

                                   

                                  Many Thanks,

                                   

                                  IslayMalt

                                  Hi Caol Ila 

                                   

                                  Actually, DTS-HD MAS is a mandatory codec that is supported by all BluRay players. The problem is that the lossless component is not mandatory - only the core audio is - so although the DTS-HD MAS light will come on, you may be hearing the lossy core stream. The same rule applies to Dolby True HD as well, and again (I know Encore does not support this codec) it is quite possible early Profile 1 players will only putput the core AC3 stream and again not the lossless one. With Profile 1.1 & 2 players, the odds of it not supporting the full fat DTS-HD MAS stream are vanishingly small.

                                  You should also set the downmix to stereo coefficients in the DTS-HD MAS encoder.

                                  That said, it is a good idea to add a separate stereo stream, as a downmix is a compromise.

                                   

                                  Way to do this?

                                  Firstly work out what the domninant stream type is - 5.1 or stereo. If you have mainly stereo but with the occasional 5.1, set stream 1 to be the stereo one.

                                  Add the DTS-HD MAS stream as number 2 - you will not be able to proof this or preview it though as support is passthrough only.

                                   

                                  From your description, I would do one of 2 things:

                                  First Choice - separate DTS-HD MAS 5.1 & LPCM stereo streams.

                                  Second - Just DTS-HDS MAS with a downmix for stereo.

                                  Always, but always add a downmix to the 5.1 stream as you can be certain some silly sod will try to play it on a stereo system.