News on Premiere Next at Adobe Max

I tried. Could not get in.

Try here:

http://tremolo.edgesuite.net/clients/1086_adobe/20130504_max/desktop/index.html?promoid=KF LAK

It is live now.

No more 'CS'... next version is 'CC' (Creative Cloud)!

Is Maxon Cinema 4D Lite bundled with Ae Cloud Subscription only?

Jason Levine only mentioned Cloud download.

New "CC" licensing allows concurrent use on two systems!

Are the available fonts for Creative Cloud Subscription only?

CC access is all Jeff Veen mentioned re: fonts.

Did I really just hear that all new features are Cloud Subscription only?

I guess the Pen is Mightier than the box.

It sucks

Yes, hence my it sucks comment

Cue the "Cloudvocates".

Joe- "Did I really just hear that all new features are Cloud Subscription only?"

Yes, you heard correctly.

I suppose this means there are no plans

to retrofit any features to CS6.

No more perpetual license at all?

I wonder...

Does the implementation of the Creative Cloud licensing

assist in combating unauthorized use of Adobe software?

If so, that would be an understandable yet unstated objective

of gradually moving ALL users toward a subscription model.

And, that might affect my current inclination toward the box.

I hope this speculative post that obliquely references

a taboo subject doesn't breach Forum Guidelines.

http://mashable.com/2013/05/06/adobe-subscription-pricing-only/ says (if correct) that CS6 will still be sold as a non-subscription product... but no indication how long that policy will last

I feel like I've been kicked in the ****.

Well said Joe. 

There will be many users sticking with what they have and eventually movies to other applications

We always get screwed in the UK for prices and for 1 year CC it is discounted to £22 then up to £45

"The products will get security patches and bug fixes, but no feature updates. Additionally, Adobe has committed to making sure that CS6 is compatible with the next major version of OS X and Windows."

That's something, at least.  I know folks would not like it if Adobe just dropped the ball entirely on fixing the spanned media bug in CS6.

People who use PPro to make money can (in the US, I don't know about other countries) charge the cost of PPro as an expense against taxes... either purchase or lease

For me, as a family video hobbyist, the economic model of a monthly subscription simply does not work... so CS6 is where I will stay

Anyone new to PPro, or other Adobe products, will now have to make a choice... CS6 with no new features, or CC by monthly subscription

Just personal opinion, but I can't imagine that Adobe will continue to sell CS6 for more than a year or two

John T Smith wrote:

 

For me, as a family video hobbyist, the economic model of a monthly subscription simply does not work... so CS6 is where I will stay

 

Anyone new to PPro, or other Adobe products, will now have to make a choice... CS6 with no new features, or CC by monthly subscription

I'm right there with you.  Unfortunately in its present form, I can't even use Premiere Pro CS6, so I'm 'stuck' at CS5.5.  Supposedly the CC version has the AVCHD issue cleared up, but I'm not paying adobe $240/year to be allowed to use it.

Sorry Adobe, this is A-1 pooch-screwage here.

jas

No doubt other editing platform manufacturers will be rubbing their hands with glee and offering a subsidised crossgrade in due course. 

I did just that from CS3 to Edius 6 and used Edius for a couple of years until Adobe got their bugs out of the dire CS4. 

I have a rock stable CS5.5 setup and there is where I will stay but still use Edius which is a great piece of software and it will play more realtime tracks than Premiere

Biggles Lamb wrote:

 

No doubt other editing platform manufacturers will be rubbing their hands with glee and offering a subsidised crossgrade in due course. 

 

I did just that from CS3 to Edius 6 and used Edius for a couple of years until Adobe got their bugs out of the dire CS4. 

 

I have a rock stable CS5.5 setup and there is where I will stay but still use Edius which is a great piece of software and it will play more realtime tracks than Premiere

Avid is already planning to do essentially the same thing. What they're seeing is that all their resources spent on chasing people down and manufacturing physical product are no longer a burden Adobe has to shoulder. When it's cloud-based distribution, you save a lot of time and a lot of money. From a development and distribution standpoint, it's a no-brainer.

At any rate, I think Adobe is fully aware that they are jumping off a ledge here, but they've already seen very good success with the current adoption of the Creative Cloud. For people still on CS3 or CS4, they recognize that these are not current customers. People who bought CS4 did so in 2008 or 2009, so it was nearly 5 years ago. That's a long time in tech and business.

For the hobbyist or home user who just likes to use the best tools (as opposed to say something like Photoshop/Premiere Elements), you can still subscribe on a monthly basis, so if you plan to take a few days and edit the family video library into a montage, it'll cost you $75. That's really not a lot of $$$ to have a month's worth of access to EVERYTHING. Of course, if you just want to edit some video in Premiere Pro, you can rent that for only $20 per month.

Adobe doesn't pay me to say "Creative Cloud is great!" but after using it for a year I definitely feel that way. Having paid only $360 this past year and gotten to use all of the tools in the Master Collection, it's been a very good deal! I've used the cloud storage with my client projects and internal jobs, I started learning InDesign (never had a chance before!) and also got to use Lightroom, which wasn't in any of the packages before (it's a really nice tool for photo management and basic editing).

If I had been paying full price, I'd have spent $600, and while that's not as good of a deal, it's about the same as the old pricing if you were to skip every other version of the CS upgrades. If you only upgraded every 3 versions or longer, that's not a good deal, but at the same time, as I first stated above, you're not exactly a frequent flyer.

Just my thoughts.

Oh....somebody mentioned an AVCHD issue....what issue is that? I'm on CS6, I edit a few dozen hours of AVCHD footage every week. Other than occasionally wishing it was AVC Intra footage, I never have any issues.  Someone wish to clarify?

All of the new info that was presented at MAX is now online at Adobe's Cloud site.  Specifically, pricing is availble here.  There's also an FAQ available, for what it's worth.

They have a nice "Complete" membership price for those of us that own CS-based desktop apps starting at CS3 and up: $360/year billed monthly.  Ostensibly that gives someone access to all of the applications if they want them.  And certainly, those one-time licenses would be hugely expensive otherwise, were you to buy them all.

But as was stated earlier: what if you don't want all of those applications?  Say you just want Premiere Pro and Photoshop, for example?  Do you spend $360/year for all of them?  Or $240/year per app?  Note that Adobe can (and will?) raise the price on your annual subscription, allowing you the option of canceling or continuing at the new amount.  If you don't want to continue, what happens?  Answer: you cease being able to use the software you've paid for.

Oh boy!  They've added access and integration with Behance!  ... Um.. so what?  I've never used it, never intend to, and don't really give a flying f*** in a rolling doughnut about Behance.  Nor do I really need help, comments, contributions, etc on the hobby clips that I make with Premiere Pro.  What I do isn't a community thing.  I suspect a lot of other hobbyists are the same boat.

There's some portion of Adobe's customer base where this Creative Cloud thing makes sense (and cents?)  But they're going to quickly alienate the larger portion of their customer base in which it doesn't make sense.

Wake up Adobe.  Bad juju.

jas

somebody mentioned an AVCHD issue....what issue is that?

Audio and Video glitches | AVCHD footage

Thread discussing this known issue:

http://forums.adobe.com/message/5232533#5232533

John T Smith wrote:

 

People who use PPro to make money can (in the US, I don't know about other countries) charge the cost of PPro as an expense against taxes... either purchase or lease

Yes they (and most of the rest of the world) can, but that doesn't make it free, it merely reduces the cost by around 20% or so.

I'm not feeling good about this at all.  I've spent a LOTof money with Adobe over the years buying the Master Collection and then upgrading version by version until here we sit with CS6 and the end of the line.  The ideal they can't react to fast moving markets with product releases is BS in my mind.  Go back to single products if you need to and to single product upgrades.

So, now, instead of a larger investment made 'once' at a time of your own choosing, you have to make it every month, month in, month out, including the months you don't use it or it gets turned off. 

Hmmm... now, maybe we need to find a way of telling our customers that they need to keep paying a monthly license to keep watching their videos or we're gonna turn'em off .

I completely understand the business model from Adobe's point of view.  They need income month in month out.  No peaks and troughs, a nice constant flow.  But for me, this is a step backwards.  I can't afford to have software turned off because the online licensing failed, maybe because my internet was down for a week (as happened last year). 

Oh well.

Christian

In the UK CC is £47/m, that is £564/y or at todays exchange rate $876 per year, which is far to expensive.

Fair point about only subscribing for a month but I for one would not want to do that. 

There is a reduction promo for the first year for CS3 and later users, then it is presumably full price

Also what about those of us who edit on a laptop with no internet available?

I feel like I've been kicked in the ****.

Me too.

I am going to quietly dissapear off this particular topic and take some time to consider my feelings toward Adobe and how I wish to manage the issue of being controlled by a business corporation through an  "internet connection" and all the insidious aspects of that. eg loss of control of my systems , security....

Adobe continually bugs me with constant unwanted Flash Upgrades.  Should have seen this coming!

The big problem for me may or may not be an emotional one here.... BUT.... I make my upgrade decisions based on whether I want/need the new features and cashflow as it exists NOW.  I can make that one time upgrade and not have to worry about things being turned off.

What Adobe are asking me to do is to commit to regular never ending "rental" of software that I'll never own, and they can take away from me and as time goes on keep hiking the price higher and higher. 

While ever I want to use it (even without upgrades that introduce bugs, e.g. the AVCHD bug in CS6) I have to keep on renting it.  There is no buyout plan. 

I bought my house because I didn't want to rent.  I bought my car because I don't want to rent/lease.  I bought my computers because I don't want to rent.  I bought my software becaue I don't want to rent.  If you give me the choice of 'rent' or 'go somewhere else' then guess what.......?

I guess the real question at this point is what are my other options. There's Avid, which is about twice the price, though I hear it's no less buggy than Adobe. Then there's FCP, which would almost tempt me to buy a Mac were FCP X not such a controversial release. Either way, if they're not holding a gun to my head for the rest of my life, they're still more appealing. I don't react well to extortion.

I've invested in AE plugins from Video Copilot and Red Giant (both are very ethical companies and have excellent customer service, by the way) which will be lost money when I leave Adobe, plus the cost of replicating those features on the new platform. I'm currently on CS 4 because I haven't gotten around to going 64 bit on my hardware. Was planning on doing that and upgrading to CS 6 this year but that's a non starter now. So, while like many others I feel completely screwed here, at least I didn't buy CS 6 so that money can go towards whatever my new home is.

So, besides Avid & FCP, what platforms are you guys looking at? Not just for Premiere but also AE & Photoshop?

We will continue to sell and support Adobe Creative Suite® 6 applications, and will provide bug fixes and security updates as necessary. We do not, however, have any current plans to release new versions of our CS applications.

So for existing CS6 users, hope of bug fixes is not dead yet.  It's only the new stuff that will be exclusive to the cloud. 

Whether or not Premiere Pro CS6 bug fixes actually appear, and how long Adobe will continue to support CS6, are questions that will be answered in time.  I hope that time comes soon and that the answers are positive.

Jeff

Extremely disappointed at this news!  I have CS6, but have stuck with CS5.5 for the majority of my projects simply because of the AVCHD and MXF bugs.  I was going to be one of the first ones to drop some $$ for CS7.

But now, I’m going to look at other vendors, probably Sony Vegas or Edius. 

Very poor decision IMO to eliminate the boxed versions.

I get where people are coming from with the "own" vs "rent" argument but apply the same argument to your internet and phone service (both of which probably cost as much as CC).  Unfortunately you can't own everything that is necessary for your business.  It does suck a little that Adobe is taking away the choice, but I really don't think the sky is falling.  Look at the bright side--unlike the phone company, you do have other options, as unsavory as many of them might be.

Given the rather extreme breach of trust the CC move constitutes, I wouldn't count on anything that resembles customer service. Quite the contrary. With the predatory practices they're now engaging in, it's simply not in their best interests to service CS 6. The sooner they can convince customers to ditch it, the faster they can hook them into a lifetime of monthly billing.

Since May 4th was just a couple of days ago, I hear two words ringing in my ears.

"Run, Luke."

Evil Edison wrote:

 

I get where people are coming from with the "own" vs "rent" argument but apply the same argument to your internet and phone service (both of which probably cost as much as CC).

Software as a Service is generally a bad solution for people who aren't in business.  In other words: hobbyists.  Yes, SaaS can work for businesses.  In fact, it can work very well.  But for those of us that aren't made of money (and aren't making money with this), it's financially unfeasible and irresponsible to throw money at Adobe every month for software.  Paying for the version we want and when we want is the better solution.

I'm a broken record, so I'll stop.  Adobe: fix this.  Or lose another customer.

jas

Not so sure it's fair to compare to internet and phone.  Those are services that are used daily... it's "pay as you go".  With software, you are buying a tool.  As your needs change, you can choose to buy a new tool, or continue to use the old one.

With this new plan, we are being held hostage.

lasvideo wrote:

 

Nope. Its strictly rent from the Cloud or nothing, from now on it seems.

Perhaps a few other options:

1.) Go with Open Source or competitive alternatives

2.) Use old Adobe Software also known now as abandon-ware (some software already was even current versions ;-)

3.) Leave Adobe products all together and join the circus. (an actual circus, not Adobe's)

4.) Be part of Creative Cloud / "Bank of Adobe".

;-)

Software as a Service is a bad solution for anyone. Microsoft has been trying to do this for decades. The reason they haven't is because it's a "screw the customer" deal, the customers know it, and MS didn't get rich by being stupid.

1.) Go with Open Source or competitive alternatives

I'd very much like to see a discussion on what the alternatives are to AE, Premiere and Photoshop, open source or paid.

Christopher Duncan wrote:

 

MS didn't get rich by being stupid.

Really? ;-)

I too was ready to pay for a new version, in hopes that it would fix the cache buffering issue which causes footage to lag on my system and many others, but it looks like I won't have that opportunity.  I have no problem with them changing their business model, that's the way it goes.  But it seems only fair that recent purchasers, say less than a year, should be given some type of financial incentive to move over to the cloud.

More importantly, I certainly hope that Adobe lives up to its word and shows its existing customers the respect they deserve by robustly addressing bug fixes in CS6.

Premiere's rapid adoption is very recent, and a lack of respect for the customer base will drive people to a new title just as fast as they came over to Premiere.  IfAdobe thinks its product is so wonderful and its lock on the market is so secure, they should remember Avid and Apple.

I'd very much like to see a discussion on what the alternatives are to AE, Premiere and Photoshop, open source or paid.

None.

Jason, you're right that this model may be less appealing for hobbyists, but in all fairness, Adobe doesn't really make software for hobbyists.  There's a ton of free stuff out there if you don't want to pay--Gimp, Blender, Lightworks to name a few.  Even if you are just a hobbyist, $50 a month is a pretty cheap hobby nowadays. 

Yeah, really. I didn't say bug free, leading edge design or any of that other stuff. Just not stupid. There's a reason they're referred to as M$.  ;-)