8 Replies Latest reply on May 19, 2013 11:16 AM by Biggles Lamb

    The Creative Crap solution?    :  )

    medeamajic Level 2

      I like the Adobe Products. I had CS 4.0 but passed on CS 5.0. I now have CS 5.5. I don't need to uprgrade every year as you can tell. Having said that Adobe feels as though we must all pay the upgrade price every year. What I find odd about the "Creative Crap" solution is that for most of the CS Suites you pay more money but get less value on your investment. We pay more money to rent the software then to actual own it.


      Shame on you folks at Adobe!


      I know you don't actualy own the software but I think many folks can see my point. Adobe claims thay can offer faster updates using The Cloud only solution. I say fine. I am hip, I am cool but don't be rude! Don't pretend like you you are trying to do what is best for me Adobe. I hate being lied to. You folks at Adobe want to make as much money as possible and I can prove it. Having said that, why not offer the Creative Crap solution for $600.00 but have it last for 4 years of continous upgrades? I would be OK with that. Having said that shouldn't the Creative Crap solution make it less expensive for existing CS users? I want Adobe to make money but I am not going to pay more and get less for my investment.


      The CEO at Adobe needs mental help if he thinks I am going to pay more money to rent my software than I paid to own it.


      I passed on CS 6.0 and I will pass on the CC unless something changes very soon. I know Adobe has been called out already about the CC pricing being to high. I am not saying the CC pricing is outrageous. What I am saying is anyone who becomes a Cloud Member is paying more and getting less. Think about it folks. 


      Adobe has the chance to make me a CC member but it will not happen as is.

        • 2. Re: The Creative Crap solution?    :  )
          Steven L. Gotz Level 5

          I understand that a lot of people are upset, but your pricing suggestions are out of whack as far as I can tell.


          Right now, Amazon has the Adobe Master Collection CS6 for $2,210.79. If we were paying the full $50 per month, that would be over 44 months of rental fees. Let's round it up to 45 months or even more due to the present value of money. And don't forget the upgrades along the way that would normally be paid for releases that would extend it out to 60 months or more, at least. And yes, I understand it is renting not buying.


          Why would they sell you something for $600 that you pay $2,210.79 for now? The subscription service has even more programs than the Master Collection and additional services. It is therefore more valuable, not less.


          Why would Adobe want to make it less expensive by that much? They would be crazy to offer such a solution. They save a few dollars on packaging, but not nearly that many.


          You claim that Adobe does not care about you. Well, you are partially right but mostly wrong. They care about making money. The CEO works for the stockholders. Making money is the reason the company exists. Having said that, the easiest way to make money is to get and keep customers. They get new customers by lowering the entrance fee to a huge package of programs to only $50 per month. Or less for some people.  Then, and here is what you need to understand, they keep the customers by offering better software than their competitors at a price that they feel is optimum.


          Some people will drop out. But if even 25% drop out and Adobe increases new users by 40%, the stockholders win. That is the way things work. (I expect that those percentages will be quadruple the actual expected rate.)


          By the way, not as many people will leave as are complaining. I am certain of it. Adobe software is to valuable to too many workflows.


          There are many things to complain about regarding the new system, there is no real point in over exaggerating the pricing issue.

          • 3. Re: The Creative Crap solution?    :  )
            SpareWheel Level 2

            I do agree with the general point you make, but would not go so far as to describe the product perjoratively as "Creative C**p". Emotional descriptions such as these do tend to denegrate the point you are trying to make - we get it.


            I have CS5.5. I have no intentions to move to CS6 as browsing these forums I do think CS6 looks like two steps forward and one step back for the workflow I have and probably will have for the next two years. My stance is to stay where I am and to see how Creative Cloud unfolds for the mid-term future.


            Understandly a business like Adobe is seeking to maximise its revenues and reduce its costs. It has sharholders to consider. Similarly, I too operate a business and have the same models albeit on different levels of scale. We have to find what works for us. If it doesn't, we move to a different model. The Adobe Creative Cloud is a significant move in our market and we should at least take a much more objective viewpoint - for the time being. Yes, the jury is gathering the facts, but as yet, has not retired to consider its verdict.


            The Adobe product is looking to attract the widest possible users (to gain market share and maximise revenues). It is also looking to reduce its IP violations, which are revenue leakages but also discredit its operating infrastructure due to corrupt and licensing issue errors - bad mouthing something is the sure fire way to spread dissent.


            I use CS5.5: I was trained as a VT editor in the late 1970s in UK broadcast TV - two inch quad Ampex VR2000 using a simple timecode editing system (not far removed from "Manchester Code"). As a music editor I used a razor blade, centre timecode and three Studer A62 tape machines.


            Things have moved on since that time, although at every stage our levels of familiarity and comfort often became disrupted as a result of the "next generation" of product and the need to change our perceptions, approach and practices.


            Adobe has added Iridas Speedgrade. For many entering the industry, shortcuts and quick fixes are a great attraction and a valuable USP for Adobe. Stabilizer in CS5 was a great time saver for me. Speedgrade in CS6 no doubt will offer the same to others who are inexperienced with grading and colour balance techniques - all part of Adobe attempting to capture the widest market.


            Best advice I can give you is to sit back and hang (your) fire. Yes, change is a pain in the proverbial... but you will probably find others moving to similar startegies, if manufactures and suppliers see a general acceptance to this trend. You cannot buck the market - many have tried, few have survived.


            In the meantime, CS5.5 does what I need it to do (and I know how to colour balance without auto and mix audio without Audition).



            • 4. Re: The Creative Crap solution?    :  )
              medeamajic Level 2

              Steve I knew I could count on you to miss the point.


              I stated the CC should be less expensive for exitisting CS customers. Your analogy is for a new users that use the Master Collection and who would upgrade every year. Not everyone upgrades every year as I stated earlier. You pulled a boner there Steve but I called you out on it (you knew I would).  Not all CS members own the Master Collection or need it. In fact I bet few do. Do you see my point Steve or do you just want to act silly? Having said that Adobe has made a lot of money of me already. I used to own the software but now I will be forced to rent it for more money. I pay more but get less. Get it Steve? Exaggerating prices? I stated CC is not outrageous Steve. Can you read? I am stating it is worse than what we had before. Even the folks at Studio Daily and The Pro Video Coalition agree with me. CC should be less expensive with a better bang for the buck. Not more expensive with less value. Many folks will pay more to rent it that own it. How would that make anyone happy except Adobe?


              Your post about Adobe making money is useless dude. I know Adobe will make a **** load of money from The Cloud. They will loose a few members but make up for it with the monthly rental paradigm. I want Adobe to make money but I am not going to pay more for my needs and get less.


              I think $600.00 for 4 years for existing CS users is fair. New user could get two years of CC for $600.00. Adobe would still make a lot of money. There will be no more boxes, booklets, physical media  or a shipping department. The price should come down not go up.

              • 5. Re: The Creative Crap solution?    :  )
                medeamajic Level 2

                I hear ya. CS 5.5 works OK for me right now. Where will I be in another 18 months? Only time will tell. Having said that I like the Adobe Products but I am not going to pay more and get less. I think Adobe has become aware of this. CC concerns are being posted all over the internet as I type this.

                • 6. Re: The Creative Crap solution?    :  )
                  Steven L. Gotz Level 5

                  You assume that the value is less and you refuse to accept that the value might be more. Regardless of who owns what. At $600 for four years it would be one hell of a lot less money for Adobe than the previous upgrade prices.


                  You are asking for unreasonably huge discount. You won't get it.


                  I am done. I am no longer going to reply to any message about the pricing or the subscription issues.


                  You win. Complain away. Have fun beating your head against the wall. I will get what I want and you won't. But you win.

                  • 7. Re: The Creative Crap solution?    :  )
                    medeamajic Level 2

                    I win?

                    Why act silly Steve? Larry Jordan asked the CEO of Adobe if some people will be paying more and getting less. The CEO stated "yes, but we feel it is the most cost effect solution". Adobe wins Steve not me. Larry asked why not offer a buy out option after 2 years. Other people have the same concerns Steve. Just to add a little insult to injury Adobe has already started to lower the price Steve (the link is located below). It happens quite often when professional media sites criticize Avid, Adobe or even Apple.


                    I am sure the Cloud Pricing Parading will change over the next few weeks.

                    • 8. Re: The Creative Crap solution?    :  )
                      Biggles Lamb Level 3

                      There are a lot of us who share your frustrations, like you I am using CS5.5 Production Premium


                      The main post about the cost of the clould and Premiere is in the video lounge


                      S L G has been extolling the virtues of the CC model for what seems like weeks and he is entitled to his opinion but the cost models he has continued to use are far from advantageous for existing customers like us


                      Spare a though to other existing users outside the US as we are all ripped off with costs and that is true for upgrades and CC subs.


                      There is a lower cost for the first year then we assume that the cost will rise, all the financial models have assumed that they will move to the current full price and nobody has presumed that all costs will rise after the first year


                      Again like you I miss a version as there is no need to upgrade it as there is little improvement in Premiere or it becomes problematic like CS6, so an in between cost equivalent is probably more likely to gain supporters as is the software continuing to operate at the version you have when you cease subscribing