36 Replies Latest reply: Mar 24, 2015 4:51 PM by Herbert2001 RSS

    The bone tool no longer in flash pro cc?

    edorse03 Community Member

      The bone tool no longer in flash pro cc?

        • 1. Re: The bone tool no longer in flash pro cc?
          SujaiS Employee Hosts

          Deco and Bone tools are dropped in Flash Pro CC

          • 2. Re: The bone tool no longer in flash pro cc?
            HelenWLee Community Member

            You can add DragonBones to Flash pro allthough it´s not the same and not all that useful for animators, for video and movies. For game animations and other small or scripted animations it´s a nice tool. http://dragonbones.github.io/getting_started_en.html

            • 3. Re: The bone tool no longer in flash pro cc?
              edorse03 Community Member

              dragonbones don't show up in Pro CC after downloaded and installed.

              • 4. Re: The bone tool no longer in flash pro cc?
                SujaiS Employee Hosts

                Dragonbones is an extension for Flash and can be installed from: http://dragonbones.github.io/getting_started_en.html

                • 5. Re: The bone tool no longer in flash pro cc?
                  edorse03 Community Member

                  i downloaded and installed the dragonbones and it doesn't show up in the windows/extension panel.

                  • 6. Re: The bone tool no longer in flash pro cc?
                    SujaiS Employee Hosts

                    Few things to check:

                    1) Did you restart flash after the extension was installed. The extension loads only after flash is relaunched.

                    2) If you still dont see the extension -

                     

                    If on Windows, do check the c:\users\<username>\AppData\Local\Adobe\Flash CC\ folder.

                    You should see only one locale folder here. if you see 2 folders then copy the contents of the folder that contains the Dragon bones swf to the other folder(which may be named like en_US). This can happen if the locale of Flash install and locale of extension install are different. Restart Flash.

                    • 7. Re: The bone tool no longer in flash pro cc?
                      edorse03 Community Member

                      i just searched my whole computer after trying your way there is no dragon bones swf file on my computer.

                      • 8. Re: The bone tool no longer in flash pro cc?
                        SujaiS Employee Hosts

                        You should have following files under <AppData>local\Adobe\Flash CC\<locale e.g en_US>\Configuration\WindowSWF folder

                         

                        SkeletonAnimationDesignpanel\Skeleton.jsfl

                        SkeletonAnimationDesignPanel.swf

                         

                        Else can you search for these files and copy it under the above mentioned lcoation.

                        • 9. Re: The bone tool no longer in flash pro cc?
                          SujaiS Employee Hosts

                          Also note:

                          Adobe Extension Manager is not installed along with Flash Pro CC installation.

                          When you open Flash and click on Help->Manage Extensions, if Extension Manager is not present the installation of this will be triggered via the creative cloud app automatically. Once this is installed you can install the required extensions.

                          • 10. Re: The bone tool no longer in flash pro cc?
                            edorse03 Community Member

                            Ok i got it now but it's not letting me use the tool on my drawings it says im missing a skeleton item how do i get that?

                            • 11. Re: The bone tool no longer in flash pro cc?
                              SujaiS Employee Hosts

                              The dragon bones site has pretty good documentation on how to use the extension. Can you please go through this once.

                              • 12. Re: The bone tool no longer in flash pro cc?
                                edorse03 Community Member

                                So what i got from their instructions is basically animate the dragon and export and merge it with your animation?

                                • 13. Re: The bone tool no longer in flash pro cc?
                                  asydd Community Member

                                  Why did Adobe drop Bones

                                  • 14. Re: The bone tool no longer in flash pro cc?
                                    JeJuneH Community Member

                                    Adobe plans to release a more streamlined animation workshop than flash. Flash has not been updated (it's codebase) much since it's release, and it's too resource-heavy on the client machine.

                                    Also, there has been major pressure from Apple (a long-time ally of Adobe) to drop flash, as they do not support it in their mobile i-devices (not including laptops).

                                     

                                    Long story short, Flash is likely to be deprecated.

                                    • 15. Re: The bone tool no longer in flash pro cc?
                                      HelenWLee Community Member

                                      I think this was one of the more ignorant comments so far.

                                      It would be nice if someone from Adobe could bother to comment on this.

                                      • 16. Re: The bone tool no longer in flash pro cc?
                                        Herbert2001 Community Member

                                        As to whether Flash will be dropped or not - I do not think so: merely its role has changed/ Adobe did drop the ball in regards to the animation market, however. I think the loss of the bones tool is in line with this change in direction.

                                         

                                        Perhaps the devs will bring back similar functionality in a future version of Flash, but I doubt it. The animation market is quite specialized, and products like Toonboom and Anime Studio have filled the gap.

                                         

                                        For those who miss the bone tool, I suggest to invest in a tool like Anime Studio (the non-pro version is very inexpensive), which has an excellent bone-based IK system with full contraints (and is far more controllable and powerful than the old bones system in Flash ever was). My workflow consists of animating characters in AS, then import into Flash if required.

                                        • 17. Re: The bone tool no longer in flash pro cc?
                                          Ajay Shukla (Adobe) Adobe Employee

                                          We are in the process of bringing back some of the features including motion editor, IK/Bone tool etc. with improved work flows along with a host of new features in the near future. With the transition to the creative cloud, we are planning to have multiple updates to the product throughout the year and you will see these features in an upcoming release.

                                          • 18. Re: The bone tool no longer in flash pro cc?
                                            asydd Community Member

                                            Brilliant. Looking forward to it.

                                            • 19. Re: The bone tool no longer in flash pro cc?
                                              HelenWLee Community Member

                                              Finally! Some communication! That is great news.

                                               

                                              It´s just a mystery how bad Adobe has become about communicating positive news about Flash and how much that hurts us who use it and love it still.

                                               

                                              Thanks Ajay!

                                              • 20. Re: The bone tool no longer in flash pro cc?
                                                Herbert2001 Community Member

                                                Well, count me surprised. Let's just hope then the tools will be improved with real editable motion curves.

                                                 

                                                On the other hand, I've heard this song before now from Adobe, and I will believe it when I see it.

                                                • 21. Re: The bone tool no longer in flash pro cc?
                                                  Falclon1 Community Member

                                                  Great. Looking forward to it too. Can you, please, specify the date of this upcoming release? A month, at least.

                                                  • 22. Re: The bone tool no longer in flash pro cc?
                                                    Blaskotron Community Member

                                                    Finally had a project with a figure to animate and the bone tool is gone, dammit.

                                                    • 23. Re: The bone tool no longer in flash pro cc?
                                                      Herbert2001 Community Member

                                                      @Blaskotron: try AnimeStudio Pro - it has excellent bone tools, and a full graph editor. Then export to Flash.

                                                       

                                                      Well, it's been more than four months, and still no bones/motion graph editor in sight?

                                                      • 24. Re: The bone tool no longer in flash pro cc?
                                                        chris georgenes CommunityMVP

                                                        Hang in there a little longer. It may seem like it's never going to come but it could be seen as Adobe trying to hard to get it right by developing/testing/gathering feedback from beta testers.

                                                        • 25. Re: The bone tool no longer in flash pro cc?
                                                          Herbert2001 Community Member

                                                          Why would we? In the meantime AnimeStudio Pro 9 and 10 came out in the last year with even more character rigging options, like squash and stretch bones, smart bones that can act like controller bones for animating parts of your character, better drawing tools, nice new bone constraints, true motion curves, independent angle constraint, smooth joints, auto-bones scaling, and much more.

                                                           

                                                          At this point it is hard to believe any new bones tool in Flash can out-do such a well-developed bones system. And that is not even mentioning all the other animation features in tools like AS and ToonBoom.

                                                           

                                                          http://anime.smithmicro.com/whats-new.html

                                                          • 26. Re: The bone tool no longer in flash pro cc?
                                                            Asymetrical Community Member

                                                            For what it's worth I have yet to see anything decently done using the bone tool in Flash or Anime Studio Pro. In fact I would argue I've never seen anytihng decent period made with Anime Studio Pro. The examples they have on thier site are not even close to broadcast quality. There is a TON of great stuff made with FlashGranted maybe it's just it's never been put in the right hands (which is what I suspect) Toonboom is a different story but I still don't think the bone tool is worth much.

                                                            • 27. Re: The bone tool no longer in flash pro cc?
                                                              Herbert2001 Community Member

                                                              I would argue you have not looked in the right places.

                                                               

                                                              http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iNzU-2CEOuE#t=24

                                                               

                                                              http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZjmMuMhRvFo

                                                               

                                                              This is the studios's trailer for the film. It's been done in Anime Studio. Approximately 10 minutes of the film is Anime studio stuff.

                                                              And that was done in version 5.

                                                               

                                                              But you are correct in stating that Flash has been used a lot for broadcast stuff - unfortunately Adobe allowed ToonBoom to dominate that market with their lackluster and even quite bad updates for the animation side of Flash.

                                                               

                                                              Here's another one (BBC):

                                                              http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bWih88lo8wI

                                                               

                                                              One more:

                                                              http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mEwDKG0iMt0

                                                              • 28. Re: The bone tool no longer in flash pro cc?
                                                                Asymetrical Community Member

                                                                And I would argue back that while that trailer one in Egypt or wherever may have been DRAWN in Anime Studio Pro, I highly doubt there was much using of the bone tool in there.  It's all hand drawn. Maybe the horses legs? Yeah I could see that. You could do that same style in Flash, Toonboom OR Anime Studio Pro but drawing isn't what we were talking about here. We're talking about the Bone tool. The other examples really don't wow me at all not just if the bone tool was uded but even the animation is floaty and not very well animated which is exactly what I've seen everyone do with the Bone Tool in any program. Whether that means the right artists or animators haven't made use of it yet I don't know but nothing you've shown me here changes my mind. It's a cheat in my opinion and so far I have yet to see any examples that make me say anything other than good riddance.

                                                                • 29. Re: The bone tool no longer in flash pro cc?
                                                                  Herbert2001 Community Member

                                                                  Well, that is your opinion - many other users were quite dismayed to discover that the bone tools were gone in Flash CC.

                                                                   

                                                                  Also, this type of bone animation is often used by indie developers of games and indie animators, who do not have the luxury to hand-animate everything.

                                                                   

                                                                  And be careful when you say "not very well animated which is exactly what I've seen everyone do with the Bone Tool in any program": just about all 3d character animation, in feature movies, broadcast, games, and otherwise, is done with bone-based tools (IK/FK). I suppose you meant 2d animation only?

                                                                   

                                                                  Anyway, I feel it is downright liberating to see small studios like this one:

                                                                   

                                                                  http://www.littlegreendog.com/movies/scareplane/scareplane.php

                                                                   

                                                                  where bone-based 2d animation helped to create these small productions, which otherwise would have been impossible to create in terms of time, man power, and money.

                                                                   

                                                                  I also have to add here that it is a bit of an elitist and ignorant attitude to state that a tool like the bone tool is a cheat. Artists throughout history have used all sorts of tools to make their creations possible: from Albrecht Durer with his perspective drawing apparatus and Van Gogh carrying his frame in a window to draw, to Johannes Vermeer with (probably) optics to catch the absolute colour tones in his works (see Tim's Vermeer documentary).

                                                                   

                                                                  Just my two cents.

                                                                  • 30. Re: The bone tool no longer in flash pro cc?
                                                                    Asymetrical Community Member

                                                                    Look I'm not trying to pick a fight here I'm, really not and PLEASE don't compare the bone tool to ANYTHING the great masters used. Please please please. Yes I am very well aware of bones used in 3d... I am also aware of it used in games and feature films and you're dreaming if you think anything you showed me could hold a candle to the 3d animation of Pixar and Dreamworks which is bone based too. Or any American or canadian based Flash show.

                                                                     

                                                                    Am I elitist if I'm using Disney and Warner Bros animation as the benchmark? No I don't think so. I think more likely you need to upgrade what you consider quality. Every single thing you showed me except for the Egypt one looked like marionette puppets which is hardly good animation.

                                                                     

                                                                    You can only call what I'm saying an opinion to a degree. Most of what you've shown me is marginal at best and would never make it on the air, at least in North America. Budget isn't a good enough excuse as far as I'm concerened. You can't say "Oh this is crap because we had a bad budget, but look how great it is for the 30 bucks we used to work on it!" That's a cop out. Animation is animation and you don't have less kinetic understanding because you're paid less. No, you hire less qualified people to DO the animation, that's what you do. I have worked on some pretty crappy animation in my day due to budget, so I understand what you're saying but least I will admit it's crap and not pretend it's awesome.

                                                                     

                                                                    So yes you can indeed call me an elitist... but I'm far from ignorant. I've got 25 years in the animation industry in Los Angeles, two Emmy Awards, 6 nominations and have worked at every major television animation studio in the business. I wouldn't call that igorant but then again you're entitled to call it that because after all that would be an opinion and you're entitled to one. Even the award winning Angry Birds animation is blah really when you look at it. I seldom play Flash based games so I couldn't comment much on them but what I've seen is bland at best. If that's an elitist comment because I have an eye for quality, then so be it. Elitist I shall be. If I use that elistist attitude to support my theory that animation is good if it MOVES well, not if you can FINISH it, then yes I'm ignorant.

                                                                     


                                                                    • 31. Re: The bone tool no longer in flash pro cc?
                                                                      Herbert2001 Community Member

                                                                      Well, for what's it worth, I agree with you for the most part. And I did misunderstood some of your wording, reading back - so my apologies for using the word "ignorant".

                                                                       

                                                                      And yes, let's not forget there is an astounding chunk of "Northern American" animation (mostly outsourced to cheap wages countries) that looks posiitively dreadful. I have friends working in the broadcast animation industry that complain about their limited resources, and they try to offset those by applying all sorts of tricks to speed up their workflow, including bone-based animation techniques (in combination with more traditional approaches).

                                                                       

                                                                      It's quite different for (2d) games - the bar is set lower in general - although games like the original Earth Worm Jim games and the newest Rayman title sport some beautiful (cartoon) animation.

                                                                       

                                                                      I was merely saying tools like Anime Studio Pro and the bone tools offer good animators a chance to animate things they would not have been able to before due to cost and time - and do it all by themselves in a short turn-around time.

                                                                       

                                                                      Here is good example of what I mean:

                                                                      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_RcGC_ZN4DA

                                                                       

                                                                      More of his work (including a stereo version with the fixed leg): http://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL9DE018C3FC9CADF7

                                                                       

                                                                      One animator - and the entire animation is done in AS with the art drawn in Manga Studio. Not too bad for the bone tool. I believe the animation demo is part of the AS10 library for anyone to inspect. There are issues with it, of course, but overall I think the effect is quite nice to look at.

                                                                       

                                                                      Btw, the bone tools in ASpro also allow for clever setups where the head of an character can be swivelled (up to a certain degree). And it can be combined with more traditional techniques, of course. And, of course, the bone tool is not some magical device that will improve your animation skills, obviously - it's just one tool that can be combined with many others to achieve animation.

                                                                      • 32. Re: The bone tool no longer in flash pro cc?
                                                                        Asymetrical Community Member

                                                                        Okay yah now THAT was cool! the Stickman video was pretty well done too. I stand corrected. Doubtful you could have done that with the Flash bone tool though but maybe I'm worng! No worries on the ignorant thing... I was having a bay day when i responded anyway so I might have overeacted. Anyway, thanks for showing me that clip... gotta share that!

                                                                        • 33. Re: The bone tool no longer in flash pro cc?
                                                                          Defunción Community Member

                                                                          September 2014. Where's the bone tool?

                                                                          • 34. Re: The bone tool no longer in flash pro cc?
                                                                            NFB_VM Community Member

                                                                            I guess this is for historic documentation at this point...the Flash Pro CC webinar on Jan 13, 2015 had no mention of bone tools, although the good news is that Adobe is still developing Flash Pro CC with export to a variety of platforms.

                                                                             

                                                                            As for bones, Spine by Esoteric software Spine: 2D animation software for games is currently doing some incredible work in this area. It has bones, Forward Kinematics, Inverse Kinematics, Meshes, and Free Form Deformations. Best of all, elements are targetable by AS3 - perfect for games where you need to swap body parts out on the fly or programmatically transition between animations.

                                                                             

                                                                            It's a shame that Adobe hasn't implemented something similar in Flash Pro CC - it's the next logical step in animation production workflow tools.

                                                                             

                                                                            Adobe, if you're listening, please implement bones into Flash Pro similar to the way Spine is implemented. The animation market is evolving past you.

                                                                            • 35. Re: The bone tool no longer in flash pro cc?
                                                                              harrip12435554 Community Member

                                                                              March 2015. Still waiting.

                                                                               

                                                                              Actually I take that back. Not waiting. Switching to new software. Sorry, Adobe.

                                                                              • 36. Re: The bone tool no longer in flash pro cc?
                                                                                Herbert2001 Community Member

                                                                                Ah, such a shame. Really. I used to love to animate in Flash years ago, but I also made the switch to alternatives that DO support great 2d and 3d IK/FK bone systems for animation.

                                                                                 

                                                                                Even if the developers would amend the current Flash with nice bone animation tools, I am afraid that boat long sailed away, and almost no-one in animation will care any more. 99% of my colleagues and acquaintances working in 2d animation have switched to different tools years ago. 

                                                                                 

                                                                                That, and I feel Flash has been re-targeted at a very different market (indy games).

                                                                                 

                                                                                Really too bad. Flash could have been king in the animation market.