6 Replies Latest reply: Jul 11, 2013 1:27 PM by SteveG(AudioMasters) RSS

    Audition problems with ASI5211 analog pair & AES stereo in at same time ...

    tgmartin

      That is, the Audio Science ASI5211 card is advertised as essentially a 4 mono channel input card, 2 of which are analog and 2 are digital. However, I haven't been able to get Audition (CS5.5 or CS6) to recognize this capability. The ASIO/MME/WDM driver sets supplied by Audio Science (so far, versions 4.10.7 through 4.10.20) and its associated desktop driver control panel seem to show this ability as 2 separate stereo audio streams that can be set to pass either of the physical stereo input sources (Analog & AES). I select one stream as analog and the other as AES, but I can't seem to map these streams/inputs discretely inside Audition in the "Multitrack" view to 4 different channels.

       

      If I use the ASIO driver class in Audition, I'm only shown a single "Default Input" stream (# 1) and can select among either the left or right physical input to map to the left or right stereo Audition channel. This appears to be the limit of my choices in the "Multitrack" input select view as well.

       

      If I use the MME (WDM) driver class, I can select between the 2 streams (#1 and #2)  as "Default Input" but again, whichever "stream" is selected, that's the only choice I get in the "Multitrack" input select view ...

       

      I also have another instance of Audition that is running on a pair of ASI5644 cards (4 stereo record streams per card) and the ASIO driver class, that I don't seem to have this kind of problem with.

       

      The Audio Science drivers are a "monlithic" kinda deal in that the one package is intended for most (if not all) of their product.

       

      Any ideas?

       

      Dell Optiplex 780

      WIN7 64bit Enterprise

      Audio Science ASI5211

       

      I hope this is at least somewhat clear.

       

      Thanks in advance for your time and attention.

       

      -Tim

        • 1. Re: Audition problems with ASI5211 analog pair & AES stereo in at same time ...
          SteveG(AudioMasters) Community Member

          Bit odd. It's also slightly surprising that the ASIO setting shows only a single input, because that's the one that would normally show all available inputs and outputs, not the WDM. It's perfectly possible for a WDM driver to do it, but it just doesn't seem to happen very often, whereas ASIO, by virtue of its design, always shows them all, unless...

           

          The only thing I can think of is that this has to do with sync settings. If you are going to use an AES input, then unless the card does an on-board conversion, this has to be set as the sync source. What you can't do is use the on-board source for both inputs, and it would be quite reasonable for the driver to recognise this, and not make both pairs available unless the sync was set appropriately. What happens if the AES input becomes the sync source is that this also runs the A-D converter for the analog input, and all four digital streams out of the card are in sync, which they have to be.

          • 2. Re: Audition problems with ASI5211 analog pair & AES stereo in at same time ...
            tgmartin Community Member

            Steve,

             

            Thanks for the response. I was able to get an answer about this from Audio Science and it appears that, like a number of things, this capability of deriving 4 discrete "mono" channels (2 Analog + 2 AES) from the ASI5211 card *WAS* possible in Audition v3 using Windows drivers, but it was amputated from subsequent versions of Audition.

             

            What I was told was that the absence of this ability, using the current ASIO driver, is somehow due to the hardware architecture of the card. Not much more was revealed.

             

            Oh, well. Just one more High-Tech disappointment ... Thanks again for the response.

             

            -Tim

            • 3. Re: Audition problems with ASI5211 analog pair & AES stereo in at same time ...
              tgmartin Community Member

              Steve,

               

              I read elsewhere about ASIO4ALL and attempted that angle as well. Still, no joy. Although the ASI5211 shows up in the Windows7 "Sound" control panel with 2 stereo inputs and 4 stereo outputs, ASIO4ALL still only sees a single stereo input and output ...

               

              Ho hum.

               

              -Tim

              • 4. Re: Audition problems with ASI5211 analog pair & AES stereo in at same time ...
                SteveG(AudioMasters) Community Member

                tgmartin wrote:

                 

                Steve,

                 

                Thanks for the response. I was able to get an answer about this from Audio Science and it appears that, like a number of things, this capability of deriving 4 discrete "mono" channels (2 Analog + 2 AES) from the ASI5211 card *WAS* possible in Audition v3 using Windows drivers, but it was amputated from subsequent versions of Audition.

                 

                What I was told was that the absence of this ability, using the current ASIO driver, is somehow due to the hardware architecture of the card. Not much more was revealed.

                 

                Nothing at all was removed from Audition's ability to pick up and send correctly formatted ASIO streams - otherwise just about every other user would have screamed from the rooftops, and it would have easily been picked up in beta testing.

                 

                Reading between the lines, I'd say that they were being 'economical' with the truth here. What it amounts to is that they've screwed up their ASIO driver - period.

                • 5. Re: Audition problems with ASI5211 analog pair & AES stereo in at same time ...
                  tgmartin Community Member

                  Steve,

                   

                  Here's a quote from the mail I received. I don't know why, but the tech mistakenly thought I was using Audition v3 on XP:

                   

                  "You should still be able to access them all using WDM or the Audition 3.0 Windows Sound option specific to Audition however.  Enable all 4 of the devices in the control panel and you should end up with 4 input options to choose from."

                   

                  I'm actually using Audition CS6 on Win7. Notice, he didn't refer to ASIO drivers here. I'm not really hung up on HAVING to use any particular driver set or approach. I just wanted to be able to get the 2 stereo or 4 mono inputs that ARE shown in the Win7 OS "Sound" panel, and labeled as WDM, enabled in Audition's Multitrack recorder section ... I obviously don't understand the subtleties of all the acronym-rich arcana involved in this.

                   

                  Thanks again for all your help!

                   

                  -Tim

                  • 6. Re: Audition problems with ASI5211 analog pair & AES stereo in at same time ...
                    SteveG(AudioMasters) Community Member

                    Hmm... they clearly think that they've written a multi-channel driver using WDM, so they didn't bother with a proper ASIO one. The trouble with WDM drivers is that they use the kernel mixer, and this is where resampling and all sorts of other dodgy things happen. ASIO drivers punch a hole clean through the OS and send and recieve pretty much directly from the sound device - so there's lower latency and none of this resampling crap going on. MME drivers are essentially legacy ones. Audition supposedly copes with WASAPI drivers too - they came along with Vista but have a few problems of their own.

                     

                    Despite being proprietary, Steinberg's ASIO has less problems associated with it than the alternatives, and that's really what Audio Science, if they had any decency, should be supplying you with. Since every other sound device with an ASIO driver seems to work fine with Audition, it's very hard to say that it isn't their fault, really. Blaming Audition in the face of overwhelming evidence to the contrary really isn't very clever on their part.