8 Replies Latest reply on Jul 7, 2013 3:59 PM by Herbert2001

    Using Filters in PS

    Cyrodan

      I have a problem using filters( e.g. oil painting or blur), they are greyed out.

       

      I'm using Win8 64 bit and a geforce 650M.

       

      The drivers are new (updated today to 320.49) and opengl and opencl are running.

       

      Here are my system infos, maybe they are helpfull

       

      Adobe Photoshop Version: 13.0.1 (13.0.1.2 20130522.r.24 2013/05/22:21:00:00) x64

      Betriebssystem: Windows NT

      Version: 6.2

      Systemarchitektur: Intel CPU-Familie:6, Modell:10, Stepping:9mit MMX, SSE (ganze Zahl), SSE FP, SSE2, SSE3, SSE4.1, SSE4.2, Hyper-Threading

      Physischer Prozessor: 4

      Logischer Prozessor: 8

      Prozessor-Taktfrequenz: 2395 MHz

      Eingebauter Speicher: 8139 MB

      Freier Speicher: 4454 MB

      Für Photoshop verfügbarer Arbeitsspeicher: 7164 MB

      Von Photoshop verwendeter Arbeitsspeicher: 70 %

      Bildkachelgröße: 128 KB

      Bildcache: 4

      Mit OpenGL zeichnen: Aktiviert.

      OpenGL-Zeichnungsmodus: Erweitert

      OpenGL – normalen Modus zulassen: Wahr.

      OpenGL – erweiterten Modus zulassen: Wahr.

      OpenGL – alte GPUs zulassen: Nicht erkannt.

      Grafikkarten-Hersteller: NVIDIA Corporation

      Grafikkarten-Renderer: GeForce GT 650M/PCIe/SSE2

      Anzeige: 1

      Anzeigebegrenzungen:= oben: 0, links: 0, unten: 1080, rechts: 1920

      Grafikkartennummer: 1

      Grafikkarte: NVIDIA GeForce GT 650M

      OpenCL Nicht verfügbar

      Treiberversion: 9.18.13.2049

      Treiberdatum: 20130621000000.000000-000

      Grafikkartentreiber: nvd3dumx.dll,nvwgf2umx.dll,nvwgf2umx.dll,nvd3dum,nvwgf2um,nvwgf2um

      Grafikmodus: 1920 x 1080 x 4294967296 Farben

      Grafikkartenbeschreibung: NVIDIA GeForce GT 650M

      Grafikkartenspeicher: 2048 MB

      Video-Rechteck Strukturgröße: 16384

      Seriennummer: 92298540419026274363

      Anwendungsordner: C:\Program Files\Adobe\Adobe Photoshop CS6 (64 Bit)\

      Pfad für temporäre Dateien: C:\Users\HM\AppData\Local\Temp\

      Der virtuelle Speicher von Photoshop hat asynchronen E/A aktiviert

      Arbeitsvolume(s):

      Start, 884,2 GB, 708,8 GB frei

      Ordner für erforderliche Zusatzmodule: C:\Program Files\Adobe\Adobe Photoshop CS6 (64 Bit)\Required\

      Primärer Zusatzmodul-Ordner: C:\Program Files\Adobe\Adobe Photoshop CS6 (64 Bit)\Plug-ins\

      Zusätzlicher Zusatzmodul-Ordner: nicht eingerichtet

       

      Installierte Komponenten

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         aif_ogl.dll   AIF   3.0   62.490293

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         icudt40.dll   International Components for Unicode 2011/11/15-16:30:22    Build gtlib_3.0.16615  

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         JP2KLib.dll   JP2KLib 2011/12/12-16:12:37   66.236923   66.236923

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         PSViews.dll   Adobe Photoshop CS6   CS6  

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         TfKernel.dll   Kernel   9.3.0.113  

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         TFUGEOM.dll   Adobe, UGeom©   9.3.0.113  

         updaternotifications.dll   Adobe Updater Notifications Library   6.0.0.24 (BuildVersion: 1.0; BuildDate: BUILDDATETIME)   6.0.0.24

         WRServices.dll   WRServices Friday January 27 2012 13:22:12   Build 0.17112   0.17112

         wu3d.dll   U3D Writer   9.3.0.113  

       

       

      Erforderliche Zusatzmodule:

       

         3D Studio 13.0.1 (13.0.1.2 20130522.r.24 2013/05/22:21:00:00)

         Adaptive Weitwinkelkorrektur 13.0

         ADM 3.11x01

         Aquarell 13.0

         Arithmetisches Mittel 13.0.1 (13.0.1.2 20130522.r.24 2013/05/22:21:00:00)

         Basrelief 13.0

         Bereich 13.0.1 (13.0.1.2 20130522.r.24 2013/05/22:21:00:00)

         Bildpaket-Filter 13.0.1 (13.0.1.2 20130522.r.24 2013/05/22:21:00:00)

         Blendenflecke 13.0

         BMP 13.0

         Buntglas-Mosaik 13.0

         Buntstiftschraffur 13.0

         Camera Raw 8.1

         Camera Raw Filter 8.1

         Chrom 13.0

         Cineon 13.0.1 (13.0.1.2 20130522.r.24 2013/05/22:21:00:00)

         Collada 13.0.1 (13.0.1.2 20130522.r.24 2013/05/22:21:00:00)

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         Conté-Stifte 13.0

         De-Interlace 13.0

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         Distorsion 13.0

         Dunkle Malstriche 13.0

         Durchschnitt berechnen 13.0.1 (13.0.1.2 20130522.r.24 2013/05/22:21:00:00)

         Eazel Acquire 13.0.1 (13.0.1.2 20130522.r.24 2013/05/22:21:00:00)

         Entropie 13.0.1 (13.0.1.2 20130522.r.24 2013/05/22:21:00:00)

         Erfassungsbereich 13.0.1 (13.0.1.2 20130522.r.24 2013/05/22:21:00:00)

         Extrudieren 13.0

         Farbpapier-Collage 13.0

         Farbraster 13.0

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         FastCore-Routinen 13.0.1 (13.0.1.2 20130522.r.24 2013/05/22:21:00:00)

         Feuchtes Papier 13.0

         Filtergalerie 13.0

         Flash 3D 13.0.1 (13.0.1.2 20130522.r.24 2013/05/22:21:00:00)

         Fluchtpunkt 13.0

         Fotokopie 13.0

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         Neigung 13.0.1 (13.0.1.2 20130522.r.24 2013/05/22:21:00:00)

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         PCX 13.0.1 (13.0.1.2 20130522.r.24 2013/05/22:21:00:00)

         Pfade -> Illustrator 13.0

         Photoshop 3D-Modul 13.0.1 (13.0.1.2 20130522.r.24 2013/05/22:21:00:00)

         Pixar 13.0.1 (13.0.1.2 20130522.r.24 2013/05/22:21:00:00)

         PNG 13.0

         Polarkoordinaten 13.0

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         Prägepapier 13.0

         Punktieren 13.0

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         Radiance 13.0.1 (13.0.1.2 20130522.r.24 2013/05/22:21:00:00)

         Rasterungseffekt 13.0

         Risse 13.0

         Schwamm 13.0

         Schwingungen 13.0

         Selektiver Weichzeichner 13.0

         Solarisation 13.0.1 (13.0.1.2 20130522.r.24 2013/05/22:21:00:00)

         Spritzer 13.0

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      Optionale Zusatzmodule und Zusatzmodule von Drittanbietern: KEINE

       

      Nicht geladene Plug-Ins: KEINE

      Blitz:

         Mini Bridge

         Kuler

      Installierte TWAIN-Geräte: OHNE

       

      I would be glad if somebody could help me!!!

      Thanks!!

        • 1. Re: Using Filters in PS
          Level 7

          Filters are typically grayed out because you are trying to apply them to an image mode or depth for which they don't work.

           

          Check your image mode and bit depth.

          Many of the filters only work in 8 bit/channel RGB.

          • 2. Re: Using Filters in PS
            Herbert2001 Level 4

            Which in this day and age is quite silly. Obviously some filters do not make sense in particular colour modes, but why oh why are filters like distort unavailable in 16bit mode?

             

            At the very least I would expect to be able to apply those filters to a smart object that contains an 8bit colour mode image, but no: does not work. Only when I apply the filter directly inside that smart object. But then I can't directly preview the result.

             

            In 32bit mode it gets even worse - let's not even mention the limitations.

             

            In Photoline I can pretty much happily apply all filters to any layer in any bit depth or colour mode - even a 1 bit monochrome layer can have layer effects and almost any adjustment layer applied to it. Add in the fact that any layer in a project can be set to any image mode and bit depth - and Photoshop's layer system and its archaic approach to image and colour modes start to show its age.

            • 3. Re: Using Filters in PS
              Level 5

              Herbert2001 wrote:

               

              Which in this day and age is quite silly…

               

              But that's reality, and it's futile to complain about it.  Perhaps it shouldn't be—but it is.

              • 4. Re: Using Filters in PS
                Herbert2001 Level 4

                One of several reasons why I switched to Photoline eight months ago (after being a loyal PH user since v3!). So my workflow is no longer affected by those silly limitations.

                 

                Anyway, you're correct in saying it is futile: Photoshop's code base will (probably) not be rewritten. Adobe does not have to as long as it is regarded as "The Standard".

                 

                Rant off!

                • 5. Re: Using Filters in PS
                  Level 7

                  >> why are filters like distort unavailable in 16bit mode?

                   

                  Because there haven't been many requests to enable them for 16 or 32 bit/channel.

                   

                  And 32 bit is more limited partly because of it's nature -- many filters and operations cannot work in HDR, because they depend on a [0-1] range of pixel values.

                   

                  This isn't about age, this is about doing things right, and about prioritizing the work (it's not like we have a shortage of feature requests) -- updating the math in filters takes time, as does testing the updated math. We have to have some justification for doing that work (why should it be done, what does it enable, how does it help someone's work). And if all we get are "make them all work" and "give me a pony" requests, then there is no justification for doing it.

                   

                  Photoshop does allow layers of arbitrary mode and depth - via Smart Objects.  We just make it explicit when you are getting a conversion and potentially losing quality.  Just remember that you can't actually blend layers of different mode and depth - they have to get converted to a common form at some point, and each conversion is potentially lossy.

                  • 6. Re: Using Filters in PS
                    Herbert2001 Level 4

                    One could argue that

                    Chris Cox wrote:

                     

                    >> why are filters like distort unavailable in 16bit mode?

                     

                    Because there haven't been many requests to enable them for 16 or 32 bit/channel.

                     

                    This isn't about age, this is about doing things right, and about prioritizing the work (it's not like we have a shortage of feature requests) -- updating the math in filters takes time, as does testing the updated math. We have to have some justification for doing that work (why should it be done, what does it enable, how does it help someone's work). And if all we get are "make them all work" and "give me a pony" requests, then there is no justification for doing it.

                     

                    One could argue that that is a problem in itself: a reactive behaviour rather than an active one in regards to your users and omplemented features stifles creativity and innovation. You will not get a lot of users requesting a change in how layer masks are implemented in Photoshop, because 99% of the users have no clue that there is a far superior approach possible. Same for instanced layers, and the possibility to have a range of -200% up to +200% for a layer's opacity.

                     

                    I can tell you that these small innovative features in Photoline slap Photoshop in the face in terms of usability and flexibility.

                     

                    And as for rewriting the filters: I sort-of understand - however, seeing that two Photoline developers seem to be doing a better job then Adobe. On the other hand, working in a large behemoth environment like Adobe probably causes a lot of bureacratic delay as well.

                    Chris Cox wrote:

                     

                    Photoshop does allow layers of arbitrary mode and depth - via Smart Objects.  We just make it explicit when you are getting a conversion and potentially losing quality.  Just remember that you can't actually blend layers of different mode and depth - they have to get converted to a common form at some point, and each conversion is potentially lossy.

                    Smart objects, although they do have some perks, feel a bit patchy, and an awkward way of working compared to Photoline's layer system. It feels as if you are working with individual files in a project, rather than layers. Photoline's layer system does not care about whether a layer happens to be a certain size, bit depth and/or image mode. One project can hold all of these, and any layer effect and adjustment layer can be applied to all.

                     

                    Very liberating.

                    • 7. Re: Using Filters in PS
                      Level 7

                      Do you want us spending time on the things you need, or the things that we think you need and you don't really need?

                       

                      We try to balance customer requests and innovation - but we need customer requests to help prioritize some of the work.  Without customer requests, product managers think that there is no need to make changes, because nobody needs, wants, or uses the features.  Without evidence that someone will use a new feature, why spend time on that feature versus other features that we know that users will put to good use?

                      • 8. Re: Using Filters in PS
                        Herbert2001 Level 4

                        It is not a black and white thing, and I agree with you that it is very difficult to balance the two: being truly innovative while also keeping track of what customers want is a delicate balance act. That being said, finding the latent needs in customers is key to a truly innovative and succesful product that will delight your customers.

                         

                        Apple has been great at finding this latent needs. Adobe is rather bad in this area nowadays.

                         

                        This I have found completely lacking for 95% in Photoshop's direction. It's almost as if Adobe's product managers are scared out of their wits to go beyond their comfort zones. Some of Adobe's products seem more affected than others: Illustrator and Photoshop seem to have stood still in time for the last 10 years. Sure, we have 3d tools and video tools now in Photoshop - but that is reactive behaviour to what is happening in the market, and especially the 3d tools were/are implemented in a lacklustre manner (working in 3d myself) - hence Mari and other 3d painting tools that do a far better job.

                         

                        It has also caused Photoshop to become fragmented in so many ways.

                         

                        Which ultimately means that products like Photoline, Substance Designer, Mari, and so on, have taken the lead in workflow and features, and Photoshop is lagging. Adobe may count itself lucky that a number of plugin developers have taken up the gauntlet and produced some outstanding forward-thinking products that save Photoshop's butt from being kicked around too much. In short, Adobe is relying on its market penetration way too much for comfort.

                         

                        Of course, this my subjective view on things. The CC thing is merely another nail in the coffin for many veteran users (like me). Don't you think it is a sign on the wall that I (user since v3), and other long loyal users, have left Photoshop behind at this point?

                         

                        And I do appreciate all the work you and other PH devs have done on Photoshop, Chris. I merely feel Adobe as a company has grown quite stale and rigid. Not your fault. Every time I hear Adobe's CEO speak, I cringe. I understand it's business and all, yet I really think Adobe has lost that important "je ne sais quo", and it might be the downfall of the company's importance in many fields.

                         

                        Anyway, sorry to the OP for hijacking this thread with my ranting.