16 Replies Latest reply on Aug 1, 2013 3:06 PM by Flash 40

    Audio Effects delay kicking in after each clip

    vmsmusic1066

      Hello,

       

      I am using DeNoiser and NewBlue Noise Reducer to eliminate some hiss I have on my audio. Though the effects work to improve the sound, it takes about 2 seconds for the effects to kick in, and this happens with each clip. In other words, the hiss is present for about 2 seconds into each new clip before it fades away. I normally use Transition effects too, of course, but I even tested some clips without the Transitions and it still happened.

       

      Any ideas?

       

      Thanks

        • 1. Re: Audio Effects delay kicking in after each clip
          A.T. Romano Level 7

          vmsmusic1066

           

          What version of Premiere Elements are you using and on what computer operating system is it running?

           

          What are the properties of your source media, especially your audio and what project preset have you or the project set for this project?

           

          Have you tried to achieve the same audio improvement with the free audio editor Audacity. And, if so, have you run into similar issues?

           

          How much exploration and experimentation have you done with the Denoiser/NoiseFloor, Freeze, and Offset. Have you been keyframing the audio effect? Is this hiss noise coming from use of tape?

           

          ATR

          • 2. Re: Audio Effects delay kicking in after each clip
            the_wine_snob Level 9

            ATR,

             

            I have seen similar complaints with both versions of Premiere (Pro and Elements). It seems that the DeNoiser Effect needs a moment to sample the files, to which it has been applied, and hence the issue.

             

            For many users, applying a similar Effect in Adobe Audition, or Audacity is the better course of action.

             

            I have not done this test, but would anticipate that if one Trims off ~ 02 sec. of the Clip, the DeNoiser Effect will sample from that Trimmed portion, and be able to apply to the remainder.

             

            As I use Adobe Audition for most major Audio editing, I have not explored the ins and outs of Premiere's DeNoiser Effect, so am only passing on what I have encountered from reading of others' issues.

             

            Hunt

            • 3. Re: Audio Effects delay kicking in after each clip
              A.T. Romano Level 7

              vmsmusic1066

               

              It looks like my suggestion about Audacity might be the way to go for exploration and experimentation on the tape based hiss noise. However, I have seen several writeup that are negative on Audacity handling that type of noise. But, as I asked,

               

              Have you tried to achieve the same audio improvement with the free audio editor Audacity. And, if so, have you run into similar issues?

               

              I know that this is the Premiere Elements Forum, but there was a Premiere Pro thread on the DeNoiser that talked about applying the DeNoiser from the Audio Mix Tool.

              http://forums.adobe.com/thread/1009937

              So leaving no stone unturned, I headed for Premiere Elements Audio Mix to see if I have been overlooking such a feature there. No such luck.

               

              ATR

              • 4. Re: Audio Effects delay kicking in after each clip
                the_wine_snob Level 9

                One of the nice features of Audacity is that it handles many VST's, so one is not limited to the Effects included, and many, many others will work well. Same for Adobe Audition.

                 

                Hunt

                • 5. Re: Audio Effects delay kicking in after each clip
                  A.T. Romano Level 7

                  Hunt

                   

                  Just how flexible is the DeNoiser when it comes to anything other than specifically hiss from tape?

                   

                  ATR

                  • 6. Re: Audio Effects delay kicking in after each clip
                    vmsmusic1066 Level 1

                    I am using Premere 11 with Windows 8.

                     

                    I am not sure what you mean by 'properties of my source media', nor 'project preset' (as regards the latter, I would think whatever is default, since I have not changed whatever the program initially uses).

                     

                    I have not tried Audacity, no. The audio I am using is from my dlsr video w/external mic. Would going that route in any way impact the video quality (as in having to edit the Audio in Audacity, save as a new file, which in turn might degrade the initial video quality)? It's just my voice ... there's no major audio mixture's or delicate sounds; I would think the settings that come with the program should be enough.

                     

                    I have experimented with the effects to get the right level of noise reduction without sacrificing too much authentic audio quality.

                     

                    I don't know what keyframing is, so I would have to say no.

                     

                    The hiss is coming from an omnidirectional mic I use with my dslr camera; just some room noise.

                    • 7. Re: Audio Effects delay kicking in after each clip
                      vmsmusic1066 Level 1

                      I tried first applying the DeNoiser and Noise Reducer effects before I trimmed the clips. It didn't work. Thanks for the suggestion, though.

                       

                      Also, I have no such problems when previewing the material; only after publishing it.

                      • 8. Re: Audio Effects delay kicking in after each clip
                        A.T. Romano Level 7

                        vmsmusic1066

                         

                        I was just about to call it a day when I saw your post. I will comment about it further tomorrow, but for now.

                         

                        I wanted to get a handle on the properties of what you were importing into Premiere Elements, such as, video and audio compression, frame size, frame rate, file extension, audio channels (2 or 5.1 channel), etc.

                         

                        The project preset can have its impact on results so best we rule that factor in or out. What is the origin of this hiss noise? At first I thought that you might be recording to tape. What are they, just miscellaneous noises from the use of the external microphone?

                         

                        Audacity Noise Removal might be worthwhile after all. Worth a try.

                         

                        The only thing going into Audacity is the audio portion of the file. You can right click the file on the Premiere Elements Timeline and select Delete Video and then export the file (Publish+Share/Computer/Audio) for import into Audacity. From Audacity you can export it out as mp3 or wav for import back into Premiere Elements.

                         

                        More on that tomorrow.

                         

                        We will be watching for your progress.

                         

                        ATR

                        • 9. Re: Audio Effects delay kicking in after each clip
                          the_wine_snob Level 9

                          From what I can tell, that "tape hiss," or very similar frequencies, are the only purpose for Premiere's DeNoisier Effect.

                           

                          Hunt

                          • 10. Re: Audio Effects delay kicking in after each clip
                            vmsmusic1066 Level 1

                            Properties are as follows:

                             

                            Type: MPEG Movie

                            File Size: 322.7MB (they vary, though)

                            Image Size: 1920x1080

                            Frame Rate: 29.97

                            SOurce Audio Format: 48000 Hz - compressed -Stereo

                            Project Audio Format: 48000 Hz - 32 bit floating point - Stereo

                            Total Duration: 00:00:56:06

                            Average Data Rate: 5.7 MB/second

                            Pixel Aspect Ratio: 1.0

                             

                            I still do not know what 'project preset' is. Sorry.

                             

                            The noise is either partially or completely my computer (it runs a little warm, so the fans spin faster), which I need to have on while I record since I am also recording a guitar on the computer; or, and/or the noise is 'just room noise' from the omnidirectional mic. The DeNoiser does a good job of getting rid of it ... except for the first two seconds of a clip, unfortunately.

                             

                            I tried Audacity last night, but my testing had awful results; DeNoiser in Premeier does a much better job. Audacity Noise Removal was horrible (at least as far as the trial and error testing I did with it).

                             

                            Thanks for all the feedback.

                            • 11. Re: Audio Effects delay kicking in after each clip
                              A.T. Romano Level 7

                              vmsmusic1066

                               

                              When you open a project, Add Media/Project Assets, and drag your video file to the Expert view Timeline as the first drag there, the project analyzes your file and sets the project settings (for project.prel file) to match the properties of your source file. Sometimes it does it well; sometimes not. If not, then you set the project preset yourself manually using File Menu/New/Project. Provided you are working with interlaced video, the project preset should be:

                              NTSC

                              AVCHD

                              AVCHD Full 1080i30

                              You can see what the project has set by checking Edit Menu/Project Settings/General and the readout for Editing Mode, Timebase, and Frame Size. The project preset probably is a non issue in your case, but worth ruling in and out at the onset.

                               

                              We will watch for further developments with your exploration of Audacity.

                              http://manual.audacityteam.org/man/Noise_Removal

                               

                              Thanks for following up on the troubleshooting.

                               

                              ATR

                              • 12. Re: Audio Effects delay kicking in after each clip
                                vmsmusic1066 Level 1

                                The project presets are:

                                 

                                DSLR

                                29.97 fps

                                1920 x 1080

                                 

                                I'm not using interlaced video. The settings in the presets match what the canon t3i camera lists as the video settings; so I would think it is as it should be.

                                 

                                I will try again with Audacity, using the link you provided. It doesn't seem to offer any new insight, but I'll find out.

                                 

                                Thanks again.

                                • 13. Re: Audio Effects delay kicking in after each clip
                                  A.T. Romano Level 7

                                  vmsmusic1066

                                   

                                  If you have 1920 x 1080 @ 29.97 progressive frames per second, then the Premiere Elements project preset

                                  NTSC

                                  DSLR

                                  1080p

                                  DSLR 1080p30 @ 29.97

                                   

                                  Looking forward to your progress.

                                   

                                  Thanks.

                                   

                                  ATR

                                  • 14. Re: Audio Effects delay kicking in after each clip
                                    Flash 40 Level 1

                                    Hi vmsmusic 1066

                                     

                                    Have you thought about going back to basics and looking at the problem from a different angle, i.e. what's causing the "hiss" ?

                                    t may be easier to erradicate the noise before you record it by changing your mic set up / placing the mic in a different position in relation to your PC.

                                    Getting rid of the extra noise before you start your record session would be a better soloution. Have you tried "deadning" the room by using some heavy material/fabric/curtains. Just a slight change can make all the difference, try to get the mic as close as you can to the source you are recording. It can be difficult with an omni-directional mic but try some sort of baffling directly behind the mic. even a heavy book could make a difference! Failing that, you'll have to inest in a better mic!

                                    Just a thought but good luck

                                     

                                    Dave

                                    • 15. Re: Audio Effects delay kicking in after each clip
                                      vmsmusic1066 Level 1

                                      Hey Dave,

                                       

                                      Yes, this mic is the result of my quest to get better quality audio. It's a lavalier mic, so it's as close as I can get it. The room I am in is not ideal of recording, but it's all I've got right now.

                                       

                                      I've tried more expensive mics, but my little AudioTechnica guy was only $20 and worked so much better. One day I might be able to drop $500 for a nice shotgun mic, but this is it for now. Plus, the audio effects in premeire do a good job of eliminating the noise ... all but for those first two annoying seconds. Seems a shame to have to continue the search for a better, much more expensive mic when my little inexpensive one does a good enough job when combined with the audio effects.

                                       

                                      As regards Audacity ...

                                       

                                      I tried it again, with better results than I got last night, but nothing close to what Premiere does. I guess I will have to live it until I can afford a top notch mic. I just hoped there was something I could do to fix it. No worries; I can deal with it for now.

                                       

                                      Thanks for all the help.

                                      • 16. Re: Audio Effects delay kicking in after each clip
                                        Flash 40 Level 1

                                        Hi Audacity

                                         

                                        Pleased to hear that you have some better results but its amazing what you can achive from a $20 dollar mic

                                         

                                        Good luck

                                         

                                        Dave