13 Replies Latest reply on Aug 3, 2017 7:44 AM by Anthony Kwong kwcnasa

    Order of effects

    Howard Hoffman Level 1

      When effects are applied, the order is sometimes important.  This can be controlled in effect controls panel.

       

      However, there seems to be no way to control built-in effect such as Motion.  For example, I'd want to change scaling after certain effects are applied.  There seems to be no way to do that.

       

      Any suggestions (other than creating a sequence)?

       

      Thanks

        • 1. Re: Order of effects
          Steven L. Gotz Level 5

          Premiere Pro renders Fixed effects after any Standard effects that are applied to the clip. Standard effects are rendered in the order in which they appear, from the top down.

           

          So, in your case, scaling actually does take place after the other effects. If you wanted it the other way, then there would be a problem. Not a huge problem because instead of using Motion you could use Transform, which is just another Standard Effect which renders in order of its placement.

          • 2. Re: Order of effects
            Howard Hoffman Level 1

            This a bit puzzling.  I am using a software stablizer, which has an option to auto-fill the border with some color.  Source is 720p and sequence is 1080i.  Motion has scale set at 150%.

             

            This result in black border.  If motion is applied last, I'd expect the video has proper filled border.  Or maybe the motion does not take the result from the other effects.

            • 3. Re: Order of effects
              Steven L. Gotz Level 5

              i am not at all sure I understand.

               

              You are saying that the source, which is 720p and has a black border around it to fill up the 1080p frame, or some other color border, is scaled up with Motion and it doesn't get bigger?

               

              Edit: Perhaps third party effects render last? Try Transform instead.

              • 4. Re: Order of effects
                Howard Hoffman Level 1

                Source 720p

                Sequence 1080i

                 

                Without image stablizer, set motion scale at 150%.  It fills the screen properly.

                 

                Turn on image stablizer.  Normally, on 1080i source, the stablizer crops the image to "stablize" and fill the border with some surrounding color.  With motion scale at 150% on 720 source, the border is now just black color.  The auto-fill is not there any more.

                 

                To work around: create a 720p sequence, scale at 100%, apply stablizer.  Then add this 720p sequence to 1080i sequence, set scale at 150%. The border has proper surrounding color.

                • 5. Re: Order of effects
                  Cadillacula Level 1

                  Necroposting in an effort to keep it all in one place...

                   

                  >> Standard effects are rendered in the order in which they appear, from the top down.

                   

                  I need this elaborated on as it always confounds me for some reason.

                   

                  So let's say in the Effects Control Panel you have:

                   

                  TINT
                  RGB CURVES

                   

                  Would this have the RGB CURVES affecting a TINTED source file?

                   

                  Or is this a TINT applying after the source file has been RGB CURVED?

                   

                  Because intuitively I always thought it was bottom to top, just as when you add layers on top of the source clip. IOW If you have a source clip on the timeline and you slap an Adjustment Layer on top of it and then a Color Layer on top of that, the Adjustment Layer is (visually even) touching that source clip first, then the color layer on top of the adjustment layer is touching the adjustment layer and then the source clip below it and they effect the source clip in this way. I really envisioned the effect layers as doing the same thing figuratively in the Effects Control Panel.

                   

                  Maybe we are saying the same thing in different ways, or not, just looking for a definitive answer to this.

                  • 6. Re: Order of effects
                    MHoecker Level 1

                    In the effects panel it works top down.  So in your example it would tint the video, then take into account the curves.

                    • 7. Re: Order of effects
                      Cadillacula Level 1

                      Really? So the exact opposite of how stacking layers on top of a clip work?

                       

                      And I don't just mean the order in which the are rendered, but the order in which they affect the clip I am working on live. (in case those aren't mutually exclusive processes, I was't sure).

                      • 8. Re: Order of effects
                        MHoecker Level 1

                        Yep, they are the same rendered, and displayed in playback.  And I suppose the thinking is, "First effect in the list is applied first, the 2nd listed applied 2nd," and so on.  But it is confusing coming from photoshop or other layer based editing applications at first.

                        • 9. Re: Order of effects
                          Howard Hoffman Level 1

                          My complaint is that we can order the layer as I see fit.  But we can't order these effects.

                          • 10. Re: Order of effects
                            Anthony Kwong kwcnasa Level 1

                            Hi,

                             

                            I notice a thing, it looks like a bug to me. And it is related to your topic.

                            If you place the "Warp stabilizer" and "Gaussian Blur" layers in different orders, it will effect the outcome as you see the imgs below.

                             

                            Download the imgs, and switch them quickly. You will notice the hold video layer had shifted slightly toward bottom-right hand corner, but the "Motion" layer is remain untouched.

                             

                            I am using Pr CC 2017.1,

                            (edit) and two footage were in original sony AVCHD H264, inside multi-cam sequence.

                             

                            I wonder if you guys are able to recreate what i have experienced. Please let me know.

                            Adobe Pr The video effects orders does matter-Blur and Stabilizer-2.pngAdobe Pr The video effects orders does matter-Blur and Stabilizer-1.png

                            Have a nice day.

                            • 11. Re: Order of effects
                              MHoecker Level 1

                              I think this may be the correct behavior, because the warp stabilizer (as I understand, and from my experience) respects the effects that come before it.  This is useful for masking out an object that you don't want to be taken into account during the stabilizer calculations.  So, when you apply gaussian blur to the layer, your effecting the image on which the warp stabilizer calculations is made.

                               

                              By blurring the layer, the warp stabilizer sees less detail, potentially not being able to track as accurately, and so may return different results, potentially applying more or less stabilization.

                              1 person found this helpful
                              • 12. Re: Order of effects
                                R Neil Haugen Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                As Stephen said in the first reply, past the "fixed effects in the ECP, everything else is applied top first to bottom last.

                                 

                                Both for playback and exporting.

                                 

                                Neil

                                • 13. Re: Order of effects
                                  Anthony Kwong kwcnasa Level 1

                                  Thanks for your time MHoecker,

                                  I should have taken the blurriness, accuracy and motion tracking into account.