5 Replies Latest reply on Sep 9, 2013 7:26 AM by A.T. Romano

    Quality of Black Background After Rendering

    snyd0884 Level 1

      Hello,

       

      I'm looking for some suggestions on how to produce/retain the best black background in an edited fireworks video.  I have AVCHD footage from two cameras - one a Canon HG20, and the other a Canon t4i - both with perfect deep black background behind the fireworks.  However, when I render out of PE to AVCHD, no matter how high of a bitrate I select, the background is very grainy/blocky and is various shades of very dark gray - I wouldn't even call it black.  Does anyone have any suggestions on settings to try?  Should I try another codec (instead of the MainConcept H.264)?

       

      Thanks!

        • 1. Re: Quality of Black Background After Rendering
          A.T. Romano Level 7

          snyd0884

           

          What version of Premiere Elements are you using and on what computer operating system is it running?

           

          What are the properties of your source media (1080i, 1080p as well as other properties - video and audio compression, frame size, frame rate, file extension, etc)

           

          What are you or the program setting as the project preset for this project based on the properties of these source media?

           

          What is you specific export Share/Computer/AVCHD or Publish+Share/Computer/AVCHD, what preset, and what are the settings under the Advanced Button/Video and Audio Tabs.

           

          Is your video card driver up to date according to the web site of the manufacturer of the video card?

           

          Please excuse me for asking, but I do not want to take anything for granted..."Is your monitor color calibrated?" and do you see the same problems if you take the file to another computer for playback?

           

          Let us start here and then move in the direction that your reply leads us.

           

          Thanks.

           

          ATR

          • 2. Re: Quality of Black Background After Rendering
            snyd0884 Level 1

            Hi ATR,

             

            I'll answer your questions in order (I haven't included any of the audio settings as that is turning out just fine - if you think that they are really somehow affecting the video rendering quality I'll go back and include them...):

             

            PE Version, OS: Premiere Elements 10, Windows 7 Home Premium 64-bit

            Source Media: t4i - 1080p, 29.97fps, 4:2:0 H.264 in .MOV, HG20 - 1080i, 59.94fps, 4:2:0 H.264 in .M2TS

            Project Settings: NTSC-AVCHD-Full HD 1080i 30 - I haven't changed any of the project settings after selecting the preset

            Export: Share/Computer/AVCHD - Then my settings are based upon "MP4 - H264 1920x1080p 30" but I've set it to 2-pass and tried with "Render at Maximum Depth" both selected and de-selected

             

            Video drivers are up to date - I'm just using the embedded graphics on my i7.  I'm not using the computer to judge the video quality though (my monitors aren't that great).  I REALLY see the difference on my Panasonic Viera TC-P60ST50.  I don't think calibration would be that important as an A-B comparison of the source and rendered video on the same display clearly show the issue - the source is deep, dark, and consistent with no graininess or artifacts, while the rendered video shows the issue.  When viewing in daylight, it is visible but doesn't stand out too much - in a dark room it is really bad...

             

            Thanks for your help!

            • 3. Re: Quality of Black Background After Rendering
              A.T. Romano Level 7

              snyd0884

               

              Thanks for the additional information about your issue.

               

              From what you wrote I am understanding that you have two different formats (1080p @29.97 progressive frames per second)  and 1080i @ 59.94 interlaced frames per second) in this one Premiere Elements 10 Windows 7 64 bit project and the problem is

              a. grainy/blocky

              b. various shades of gray for background

              The project preset is set at NTSC AVCHD Full HD1080i30

              Please confirm that format of your HG20 format. I believe that your

              HG20 - 1080i, 59.94fps, 4:2:0 H.264 in .M2TS

               

              Represents 59.97 fields per second which would make that video 1920 x 1080 @ 30 interlaced frames per second. At this point I am not sure of the significance of your 4:2:0 in your format descriptions. It appears to be a choice of color space. Is that correct and what alternative choice do you have in the settings? Have you experimented with that?

               

              Do you find these issues represented in the end product display on your 60 inch TV for both sources (1080i and 1080p)?

               

               

              TV/Player Side of Things

              You wrote

              I'm not using the computer to judge the video quality though (my monitors aren't that great).  I REALLY see the difference on my Panasonic Viera TC-P60ST50.

              That appears to be a 60 inch TV. Have you looked at adjustments on the TV as it attempts to display your video? What type of a player is involved? How are you viewing your Premiere Elements 10 AVCHD.mp4 export on the TV...via a memory card or USB flash drive or other? Yes, I realize that you are comparing playback of two files...one that has never seen Premiere Elements and one that has been exported from Premiere Elements.

               

              On the Premiere Elements 10 Windows 7 64 bit Side of Things...

               

              Can we do two separate tests, starting with this one...

               

              1. Project Preset = NTSC/DSLR/1080p/DSLR 1080p30 @ 29.97

              2. Source Media = the 1080p @ 29.97 frames per second from the t4i

              3. Export = Share/Computer/AVCHD with Presets = MP4 - H.264 1920 x 1080p30

              (no adjustments under the Advanced Button/Video Tab and Audio Tab)

               

              What does playback of that export look like via a computer player and also via the 60 inch TV/and its player?

               

              Depending on how that goes, you might consider and if the issues are represented in both sources when displayed in export playback...

               

              1. Project Preset = NTSC/AVCHD/Full HD1080i30

              2. Source Media = 1080i @ 30 frames per second from the HG10

              3. Export = first, MP4 - H.264 1920 x 1080p30 and then M2T - 1920 x 1080i30.

              (no adjustments under the Advanced Button/Video Tab and Audio Tab)

               

              What does playback of that export look like via a computer player and also via the 60 inch TV/and its player?

               

              What other formats does your TV player support? From the description so far, I have been assuming that you have your Premiere Elements export on memory card or USB flash drive. What other formats does that process support besides what you appear to have, that is, an AVCHD.mp4 file?

               

              Just my initial thoughts on this for now. More later.

               

              ATR

              • 4. Re: Quality of Black Background After Rendering
                snyd0884 Level 1

                Hi ATR,

                 

                Thanks for your help - I was able to solve this issue and it is so much simpler than formats and encoding settings...

                 

                When I brought the source media in to the PE project I allowed it to "fix" quality issues.  It decided that a Shadow/Highlight" effect was the right thing to apply.  I (apparently quite wrongly) assumed that fixing quality issues would have something to do with the quality of the file rather than the analyzed quality of the video.  Lesson learned - I'll never have PE try to "fix" a source file for me again.

                 

                Once I discovered that this effect was applied I removed it and rendered out a great video that looks as expected and displays well.

                 

                Thanks again.

                • 5. Re: Quality of Black Background After Rendering
                  A.T. Romano Level 7

                  snyd0884

                   

                  Thanks for the good news that your problem is resolved. That was significant information.

                   

                  I work with all the MediaAnalysis options turned off in the Elements Organizer preferences to avoid that automatic "help".

                  See Elements Organizer workspace Edit Menu/Preferences/MediaAnalysis.

                   

                  Sometimes when those fix it messages pop up, clicking do not show again and No should stop them from popping up.

                   

                  Continuing success.

                   

                  ATR