16 Replies Latest reply on Oct 20, 2013 7:30 PM by naumen

    Best Monitors for Video editing?

    Ben_McPhee Level 1

      Hey guys. I'm looking at an NEC monitor for editing my stills, and am wondering if this will be suitable for video editing?

       

      Models I'm considering are:

      http://www.necdisplay.com/p/desktop-monitors/pa241w-bk

      http://www.necdisplay.com/p/desktop-monitors/pa242w-bk

      http://www.necdisplay.com/p/desktop-monitors/pa271w-bk

       

      These monitors are great for stills, as they cam emulate paper types well, but do I need a more "vibrant" monitor for video? Just worried that my video will look a bit off on these monitors, as it's such a different medium?

       

      If they aren't suitable, what brand/models are considered good? (Professional level).

       

      Cheers,

                   Ben

        • 1. Re: Best Monitors for Video editing?
          cfg_2451 Level 2

          Video is not stills. Video takes place in the REC.709 (google it) workingspace these days. Your NEC monitors can't show you that space. Very few computer monitors can.

           

          What you need for video is a production monitor, or even just a simple HDTV. This will show you what your video will look like when seen on HDTV, or from DVD or BD through an HDTV. The joy of a production monitor though is the tools most of them come with. I'm talking about waveform monitors, vector scopes, and other tools such as RGB parade. If you're planing to do any color correction or color grading work, you'll need these tools.

           

          If you insist on using a computer monitor for video, you can still get resonable results if you're willing to put in the time. You can do this through itteration. Get your black and white points, contrast, and colors where you want them on your computer monitor, then burn a DVD, take it to a player / HDTV, and play it. Note the problems, come back to the computer, make the appropriate changes, burn another DVD.... rinse and repeat until done. Takes forever, is very frustrating, but will teach you the value of a production monitor.

          1 person found this helpful
          • 2. Re: Best Monitors for Video editing?
            Dave Merchant MVP & Adobe Community Professional

            cfg_2451 wrote:

             

            The joy of a production monitor though is the tools most of them come with. I'm talking about waveform monitors, vector scopes, and other tools such as RGB parade. If you're planing to do any color correction or color grading work, you'll need these tools.

             

            All of which are in Premiere Pro. No need to pay for hardware versions.

             

            A calibrated 'reference monitor' is important for commercial and boroadcast production work but let's be realistic - 99.999% of the TV screens in the world are a long way from 'true' so what the footage looks like on your off-the-shelf TV is immaterial - just walk into any electronics store and look at the wall of different colors. What matters is if the exported footage is within spec for the intended client - are the black and white points "legal" and is the skintone in the right direction. You can see all that from within Premiere's UI.

             

            Yes it can be easier to grade by eye on a reference monitor compared to a computer screen, but most people aren't that sure of their visual abilities and prefer to trust the scopes.

            1 person found this helpful
            • 3. Re: Best Monitors for Video editing?
              Fuzzy Barsik Level 4

              To add on what Dave said, all those PA Series monitors allow easily load ICC profiles:

               

              Hence, switching to Rec.709 so as to work in such non-'colour aware' application as PrPro is not an issue. Moreover, here is the Videomaker Award press-release found on PA271W-BK webpage in 'Downloads' tab.

              1 person found this helpful
              • 4. Re: Best Monitors for Video editing?
                Jim_Simon Level 9

                [Moved to Hardware forum.]

                • 5. Re: Best Monitors for Video editing?
                  Ben_McPhee Level 1

                  So are you saying that even though the NEC doesn't support Rec709 out of the box, I can load that profile and it will display correctly?

                  • 6. Re: Best Monitors for Video editing?
                    Ben_McPhee Level 1

                    So basically, if I trust the scopes (and know what I'm doing), I could get good results on basically any monitor? It just may not look right until I view it on a HDTV, or Production monitor?

                    • 7. Re: Best Monitors for Video editing?
                      Ben_McPhee Level 1

                      Hey guys, thanks for the feedback. Just a few quick follow up questions.

                       

                      The other brand I was considering was Eizo, which I ruled out only on price ($2500 or so, compared to $1100 or less for the NEC). Now I’m wondering if I should take a 2nd look.

                       

                      This monitor for example http://www.eizo.com.au/products/coloredge/cg276/index.html#tab02, “supports a video signal display rate of 24 frames per second so film can be edited as it was meant to be viewed, provides quick access to several broadcast-standard color modes: Rec. 709, EBU, SMPTE-C, and DC,I and also can display safe area markers and signal information when connected to the right kit.”

                       

                      So…

                       

                      1. Would that suit? Or is it not really “good enough?” Or is the extra $1500 I’ll spend on it more than I’d spend on a good production monitor anyway?

                       

                      2. I have a great HDTV (And can hook it up to my computer for now to save that DVD burning scenario. ). How will it compare to a dedicated production monitor?

                       

                      3. Who makes good production monitors (and how do they go with stills color spaces?). What specs should I look for? And what price point is the minimum to get a good screen?

                       

                      4. Also, how well do production monitors emulate what might get shown on a projector? (Say in a cinema, or home theater?)

                      Thanks heaps.


                      Cheers,

                                    Ben


                      • 8. Re: Best Monitors for Video editing?
                        Jim_Simon Level 9

                        You're thinking needs some slight adjustment here.  You need two displays, not one.  The first is for the computer and it's GUI, and it's quality is less critical.  The second is for full screen playback of the video from a device like those offered by Blackmagic and AJA.  This second display is the one where image quality matters.

                         

                        Sounds like you already have the HDTV for that secondary display full screen playback.  Now you just need the less critical computer monitor and the hardware output device.

                        • 9. Re: Best Monitors for Video editing?
                          Fuzzy Barsik Level 4
                          So are you saying that even though the NEC doesn't support Rec709 out of the box, I can load that profile and it will display correctly?

                          NEC does support Rec.709. Check User Manuals and you'll see that e.g. PA271W has several Picture Mode presets, including Rec.709 and DCI. And yes, even though it hadn't Rec.709 preset included, you could load its ICC profile, which comes e.g. with After Effects.

                          Would that suit? Or is it not really “good enough?”

                          The answer always highly depends on what sort of work you're actually going to do. The 'Color Correction Handbook' by Alexis Van Hurkman contains a nice chapter dedicated to setting up a colour correction environment. Get your own copy - it is worth reading. Having familiarised yourself with what is considered important in a production monitor and why, you will be able to judge, for example, whether the lack of ability to handle interlaced signal by NEC monitors is crucial in your particular workflow.

                          • 10. Re: Best Monitors for Video editing?
                            ECBowen Most Valuable Participant

                            http://www.colorwiki.com/wiki/Profiling_Devices_for_Monitors

                             

                            http://www.xrite.com/i1display-pro

                             

                            http://spyder.datacolor.com/portfolio-view/spyder4elite/

                             

                            Colorimeters are what is used to accurately calibrate display devices. Once you get outside of Panel differences, often the only real major differences between Pro Monitors and high end IPS panels are firmware and connectivity options. The Pro Displays have built in profiles set and calibrated by the manufacturers. The IPS panels often do not or may have Adobe RGB and Rec 709. If you want to ensure color accuracy though the Colorimeter is the do it yourself way to get that done.

                             

                            Eric

                            ADK

                            • 11. Re: Best Monitors for Video editing?
                              Ben_McPhee Level 1

                              My TV (a high end 47" 3D LG model) really is good enough? Even though I've tweaked settings to make it look nice? Even though I can't really calibrate it like I would a monitor?

                               

                              Would my laptop screen and a HDTV be a suitable solution? (My laptop is a newish Apple MacbookPro - no retina screen. And I'll be investing in an iMac, Mac Pro, or even a PC when it comes time to get into video in a serious way).

                               

                              As for needing two displays, I absulutely HAVE to get an NEC or Eizo for my still work. I have found models that support Rec709. Can I have my laptop/imac sgreen for my GUI and use the NEC/EIZO as a production monitor? Or would my HDTV be a better solution regardless?

                               

                              Cheers.

                              • 12. Re: Best Monitors for Video editing?
                                Ben_McPhee Level 1

                                Thanks. I can see that it supports Rec709 now (Once I import the preset).

                                 

                                Is there any reason though, that an Eizo supports it out of the box, and NEC needs to import it? Seems like a colorspace that a LOT of people would need. It makes me wonder if the NEC can display it correctly (or closely), or if it's just an approximation?

                                 

                                Also, in none of the marketing literature do they mention these monitors as being great for video (Eizo does a little, but even they don't play it up much. They say it's great for photographers, architects, medical professionals... just about everyone BUT video guys. Just wondering why?

                                 

                                Excuse my ignorance on the subject. I'm just used to still colorspaces like sRGB or AdobeRGB, and not sure if they're bigger or smaller than Rec709. The NEC models can display almost 99% of Adobe RGB, and 108% of sRGB. From what I'm reading Rec709 is very similar to sRGB, so that should be fine right?

                                 

                                Do I need to worry about refresh times? Is 8ms too slow?

                                 

                                And does a "production monitor" need 24fps support, or any of the other color formats mentioned here by Eizo supports a video signal display rate of 24 frames per second so film can be edited as it was meant to be viewed, provides quick access to several broadcast-standard color modes: Rec. 709, EBU, SMPTE-C, and DC,I and also can display safe area markers and signal information when connected to the right kit.”


                                I assume the NEC can import those presets, but what about the 24fps display rate?

                                • 13. Re: Best Monitors for Video editing?
                                  Fuzzy Barsik Level 4
                                  I can see that it supports Rec709 now (Once I import the preset).

                                  Is there any reason though, that an Eizo supports it out of the box, and NEC needs to import it?

                                  And how did you reach this conclusion? From what I can see in the User Manuals, it's completely the opposite: all three NEC monitors from your list are shipped with Rec.709 factory preset (as well as with DCI factory preset).

                                  in none of the marketing literature do they mention these monitors as being great for video

                                  Really? I though such things as a review titled 'Videomaker applauds the MultiSync PA271W' serve exactly that purpose...

                                  From what I'm reading Rec709 is very similar to sRGB

                                  sRGB and Rec.709 have the same primary colours, the difference is in their transfer functions, which result in approximated 1.9 gamma in Rec.709 and 2.2 gamma in sRGB, which in turn provide similar perceptible contrast in lower (Rec.709) and higher (sRGB) ambient light conditions.

                                  Do I need to worry about refresh times?

                                  Since movie, video and motion graphics are all about moving, not static, pictures, here is where such things as critical speed, colour flickering etc. come into play (see e.g. this article by Rick Gerard). If you want to provide cross-standard delivery, you need to add frame rate (24 fps for cinema, 25 fps for PAL and 30 fps for NTSC) and screen refresh rate (72 or 120 Hz for 24 fps compatibility, 50 Hz for PAL and 60 Hz for NTSC compatibility) into equation, as well as control over progressive (for digital cinema) and interlaced (for broadcasting) signal.

                                  • 14. Re: Best Monitors for Video editing?
                                    Ben_McPhee Level 1

                                    Hey Fuzzy, sorry about the format of this reply. Not sure to quote on here the way you did. Your points are addressed numerically.

                                     

                                    1. I haven't seen the user manuals, but using http://www.necdisplay.com/p/desktop-monitors/pa271w-bk for example, under color gamut, there's no mention of Rec709. Compare that to: http://www.eizo.com.au/products/coloredge/cg276/index.html#tab02, under preset modes. Not to mention this entire page: http://www.eizo.com/global/solutions/graphics/video_editing_and_post_production.html.

                                     

                                    Just seems like NEC isn't playing up their video editng credentials, and I wonder why?

                                     

                                    If you can link me to a user manual for any of the above models, which shows that it ships with Rec709 I'd appreciate it.

                                     

                                    2. I couldn't find that artcle, unless you mean: http://www.videomaker.com/article/15133-nec-multisync-pa271w-color-correct-lcd-display-rev iew. In any case, I meant NEC's marketing.

                                     

                                    This page has nothing: http://www.necdisplay.com/p/desktop-monitors/pa271w-bk


                                    The incedibly detailed marketing PDF here: http://www.nec-display-solutions.com/p/download/pr/File/cp/Products/LCD/Shared/Brochures/P DF-PASeries.pdf?fn=PASeries.pdf actually contains the phrase "A range of Professional Desktop Displays that are ideal for users in the Photography and Media, Architecture, Engineering, Industrial Design and Precision CAD fields. " (No mention of Video, although it is the first NEC document mentioning "Built in Rec-BT709")

                                     

                                    You have to understand that for a comsumer such as myself, not spelling these things out is going to make me look for answers. Or go to a company that does spell it out.

                                     

                                    3. Got it, thanks.

                                     

                                    4. I think I get that. I'll read the article. But... do these NEC monitors comply?

                                    • 15. Re: Best Monitors for Video editing?
                                      Fuzzy Barsik Level 4

                                      Every NEC monitor's landing page has several tabs: Specifications, Technologies, Awards & Press, Downloads, Warranty, Service Enhancements, Accessories and Ships With. Explore them.

                                      • 16. Re: Best Monitors for Video editing?
                                        naumen Level 1

                                        what u need is a true production monitor

                                        http://www.flandersscientific.com/index/