21 Replies Latest reply on Oct 19, 2013 11:09 AM by jay226

    Question

    jay226

      How do I make a crazy in the wall opening up and snakes coming out and me melting like in terminator 2 and morphing into an animal or something

       

      Message was edited by: jay226 Crack not crazy

        • 1. Re: Question
          Rick Gerard Adobe Community Professional & MVP

          You start with production planning so that you get the right elements in your shots, then you start to implement your plan. The you get your shots, collect your assets and then you use layers, blend modes, masking and a bunch of other techniques no matter what software you choose. You have to know about rotoscope, procedural mattes, camera tracking, color matching and a hand full of other skills. It's nothing more than layers and layers and layers and masking and distortion and more layers and patience and time. There is no plug-in that will put a crack in a wall and make snakes come out.

           

          If you have no clue how to get started then I would suggest that you study up on the art of visual effects. You need to know what the process needs to be before you start learning AE. There are dozens of great books that tell you how it's done. You do it the same way no matter what the software. You plan, use layers, masking, color grading, blend modes, and experiment with your tools. There is no click and play solution to any visual effect as complex as you are describing.

           

          Can this be done in AE? Absolutely. Without 3rd party plug-ins? Sure, but it would require a complete understanding of the program. In an afternoon? Not a chance. Not even if you were ILM or Weta Digita. I've been creating visual effects for film and TV for more than 40 years and I'd budget at least a week for this project just to get to the first render tests.

          • 2. Re: Question
            jay226 Level 1

            Anyone with an actual tutorial and not telling me to go study

            • 3. Re: Question
              Pierre Devereux Level 2

              Hi,

               

              No offense meant, but as Rick said above, this type of effect is going to take ages to complete - at least to get it looking almost good. For someone to put a tutorial together to produce what you want will take weeks, if not longer. The background workings of After Effects are way too complicated to have the effects you want in a plug-in. There will be tons of manual work needed to pull it off. I have been using After Effects professionally now for just over two years, and I wouldn't know where to start pulling a scene like that off. 

               

              Sorry, but spending time studying is going to be your only hope.

               

              BUT..... in the meantime, to give you a kick start, check this site out:

               

              http://www.videocopilot.net/tutorials/

               

              There are tons of tutorials here, and I think if you look, you might find several that can be put together to pull off something like the shot you want.

               

              Good luck man...

               

               

              Pierre Devereux

              1 person found this helpful
              • 4. Re: Question
                Todd_Kopriva Level 8

                Pierre and Rick are right.

                • 5. Re: Question
                  jay226 Level 1

                  All I wanted was a video tutorial

                   

                  Sent from my iPod

                  • 6. Re: Question
                    Todd_Kopriva Level 8

                    There is not always a video tutorial to show you how to do exactly what you want. Sometimes you need to work, think, plan, and experiment yourself.

                    • 7. Re: Question
                      jay226 Level 1

                      Should I use blender cinema 4d etc to make an object(snake, crack, terminator melt) and composite it into the shot?

                       

                      Sent from my iPod

                      • 8. Re: Question
                        Pierre Devereux Level 2

                        Hi,

                         

                        Im going to go out on a limb here, as I dont use 3D animatio in my project at all, but I would think "Yes"?

                         

                        Use a 3D app to create the 3D objects and then use After Effects to composite them and add the special effects you want. Creating the objects in another program will also have the added advantage of using the built in lighting and 3d space passes that the specific program would come with.

                         

                        once again, I am talking , NOT from experience, but from what I gather from readin otehr posts! 

                         

                        Pierre

                        • 9. Re: Question
                          jay226 Level 1

                          Isn't cgi creatures objects etc the special effect added?

                           

                          Sent from my iPod

                          • 10. Re: Question
                            Pierre Devereux Level 2

                            Hi,

                             

                            I guess it could be, yeah. When I say *Special Effects*, I generally refer to anything added to your base layers. In my case a base layer is footage of an asset and a background plate, in your case, the CGI asset and a background plate. Special effects then refers to added effects (like dust, debris, extra lighting, and the many other effects your specific request would require). And of course compositing your CGI assets alone could be your *Special Effects*.

                             

                            Pierre

                            • 11. Re: Question
                              jay226 Level 1

                              I think in beginning to figure out that special effects require more than one layer and just can't be draw on a shot ( fire water creature etc)

                               

                              Sent from my iPod

                              • 12. Re: Question
                                Todd_Kopriva Level 8

                                > I think in beginning to figure out that special effects require more than one layer and just can't be draw on a shot

                                 

                                Correct. Typical visual effects shots can contain hundreds or even thousands of layers, with several of those being precompositions that themselves contain hundreds or thousands of layers.

                                 

                                Creating visual effects is a lot of work and takes a long time (and a lot of thought). That's why the credits at the end of movies go on for such a long time. It takes a lot of person-hours to do this kind of work.

                                • 13. Re: Question
                                  jay226 Level 1

                                  I always thought it was just draw a dinosaur onto the video and that was it. Suggestion: blender cinema 4d maya or whatever else..what's better/easiest. I don't have the money for cin or maya though

                                   

                                  Sent from my iPod

                                  • 14. Re: Question
                                    Rick Gerard Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                    Ok, here's a short tutorial on add a simple crack to a wall.

                                     

                                    1. Shoot some footage of a wall.

                                    2. Take a picture of a crack on a white wall. If you can't find a white wall with a crack then draw a crack in Photoshop or Illustrator or with a pen on a piece of white paper and then scan the paper.

                                    3. Import the footage of the wall and the photo or picture of the crack to After Effects.

                                    4. Start a new composition using the footage of the wall.

                                    5. Put the footage of the crack on top of the wall

                                    6. Add Effect>Color Correction>Levels to the footage of the crack

                                    7. Set the blend mode of the Crack layer to Multiply

                                    8. Adjust the White point of the Levels effect until you get the crack to look the way you want it to.

                                    7. Animate the opacity of the crack or the scale or what ever you want to make the crack appear. You could even animate the crack by drawing it by hand or by photographing something with a high speed camera while you crack it, or by revealing the crack by placing the crack layer in a pre-comp and using any one of a dozen techniques to reveal the crack.

                                     

                                    There you go. Now you have your crack.

                                     

                                    If you have somebody walking past the wall then you have to duplicate the footage of the wall, place the duplicate above the crack, then use masking to cut out the person walking past the crack so they are in front of the crack.

                                     

                                    You can mask the person using Rotobrush, by hand masking, or if the wall is the right color, you can use a procedural matte or a combination of procedural matte and masking to cut out (roto) your person.

                                     

                                    Every thing you want to add to the composite follows these steps. The snakes, the melting person, everything. The better you plan and the more you understand the elements you need to pull off this shot the easier it will be.

                                     

                                    Here's a crack with the whites pulled back and the blacks raised in the center. Drop it over some footage and see what the multiply blend mode does.

                                     

                                    crack.jpg

                                    Like I said before, the complete effect you are describing would take me a week to get to the first draft test. At least you now have one of about 1000 different ways you can add a crack to a wall.

                                    • 15. Re: Question
                                      jay226 Level 1

                                      Wasn't too hard was it haha. I'll have to get the trial, what's better ps or il

                                       

                                      Sent from my iPod

                                      • 16. Re: Question
                                        Szalam Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                        Photoshop is for editing photos and some creating of graphical elements. Illustrator is for creating vector art. They both have their place in the motion graphics workflow. Photoshop would probably be more useful of in a visual effects workflow.

                                         

                                        If you're new to AE, I'd strongly suggest that you start here. Without a working foundational knowledge in AE, you'll just end up frustrated - ESPECIALLY if you don't have experience with Photoshop.

                                        • 17. Re: Question
                                          Szalam Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                          jay226 wrote:

                                           

                                          Should I use blender cinema 4d etc to make an object(snake, crack, terminator melt) and composite it into the shot?

                                           

                                          Sent from my iPod

                                           

                                          You can use them to make the object and then you would use AE to composite them into the shot.

                                           

                                          However, you could probably do some decent snakes in AE without using a 3d program at all, but that really depends on the kind of shots you're hoping to pull off. If it's a sequence of shots, I could see some shots being fully 3d, some shots using an actual snake, and some shots being mostly After Effects. Most professional VFX sequences use a variety of tricks for each shot in the sequence.

                                          • 18. Re: Question
                                            jay226 Level 1

                                            Say snakes coming out of a crack in the wall/ground

                                             

                                            Sent from my iPod

                                            • 19. Re: Question
                                              Szalam Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                              jay226 wrote:

                                               

                                              Say snakes coming out of a crack in the wall/ground

                                               

                                              I understand the concept of what you are asking. I can read.

                                               

                                              You, however, do not understand how visual effects work.

                                              Watch a film and notice how, quite often, they use more than one shot together in sequence.

                                              Each shot may require a different technique.

                                               

                                              And, if you want this all in one shot - rather than using a sequence of shots - so that it will be "simpler", it will be harder to make believable. Quick cuts between different shots help to hide how fake a shot is.

                                               

                                              But even if you do want to do it in one shot, THAT STILL DOESN'T HELP US HELP YOU. Is the camera moving in this single shot? What is the angle? How many snakes? What kind of snakes? What kind of wall? How big is the crack? Does the crack form slowly or violently? How are the snakes moving? Are they coming out so quickly and so many that they're falling over each other and are pretty much pouring like water? Do some fall? Perhaps they're sort of oozing out one at a time in a menacing manner and just sticking to the wall. Are they intent on attacking on a particular object or character?

                                               

                                              This, and many other questions, would need to be decided before someone could even begin to offer you the kind of help for which you're asking. Furthermore, with the level of skill you seem to have, you won't be able to pull it off without a step-by-step tutorial.

                                               

                                              And there is no step-by-step tutorial for this. There are some tutorials out there for making a crack show up in a wall or floor. There are some tutorials out there to make someone melt. There are tutorials out there to make someone morph. And I'm pretty sure there's a tutorial or two out there for making a snake. I know there are some for flocking behavior (which may or may not be needed - we don't know yet). Each one of these things, to make it look right, could easily take a week or more (as Rick mentioned previously). And you would have to have the know-how to piece them all together. But you don't have that know-how because you won't take the time to learn the very basics of AE.

                                               

                                              I apologize if it might seem as if my tone is a bit harsh, but you really don't understand the level of work this sort of thing entails. There is a reason people get paid decent amounts of money for this. We're not getting paid to conceive of cool shots; we're being paid because we know the entire pipeline of things needed to make the cool shots a reality.

                                               

                                              Let's say you go the 3d snake route and there are only a few snakes. You still need to model, rig, and texture a snake. (Each of these steps is a significant task). Then you would need to set up your crack in the wall. Then you would need to animate a bunch of duplicates of these snakes. (This step alone could easily be days of work.) Don't forget, you probably want to make the snakes all somewhat different from each other so they don't look too much like clones. Then you need to render it out. WAIT! Don't forget the camera tracking and geometry matching first. That's a huge task. Oh, and lighting - a whole seperate job!

                                              And let's not forget that to actually get a 3d animation out, the rendering process can be tricky. Render wrangling is a whole job in and of itself in Hollywood. So many technical details to master!

                                               

                                              And we're not even into using After Effects yet. You would still need to do keying, rotoscoping, rig removal, color correction, and tons of other compositing tasks there. And we haven't even touched on your melting/morphing (which is it?) thing yet.

                                               

                                              And, before ANY of this happens, you would need to do a lot of preproduction work. Storyboards, planning, etc. Do you need tracking marks in the shot? If so, how many and where? Will you need to cover them up in post? How is it being lit?

                                               

                                              Do you understand now? This isn't simple. If you're looking at folks on YouTube like FreddieW and thinking that it's easy, you have to remember, this is their full-time job and it's a team of people, AND they didn't start out doing the big stuff they're doing now. They started small. I would suggest you do the same. Start here to learn After Effects or follow Rick's book suggestions; they're excellent.

                                              • 20. Re: Question
                                                jay226 Level 1

                                                I was thinking of freddiew. You sound mad. I just always thought you draw on the video. Now I'm afraid of the processes

                                                 

                                                Sent from my iPod

                                                • 21. Re: Question
                                                  jay226 Level 1

                                                  I wanted to show the cracking forming from beginning to end and maybe it opening up. But I should start very small. Ghost effects, matrix still image thing where the camera goes around a still person if person without multiple still cameras

                                                   

                                                  Sent from my iPod