12 Replies Latest reply on Nov 25, 2013 11:14 AM by VDOSurfer

    Elements 11 Video Stutter

    Cameradude63

      I have installed Elements 11 and have video stutter in the time line, which gets worse until it doen't run at all. Is this due to the Video card which is a Nvidia Quadro  fx1500 ?  I have a spare Geforce GT610 with 2GB memory, would this be better and solve the problem?

      Thanks

        • 1. Re: Elements 11 Video Stutter
          A.T. Romano Level 7

          Cameradude63

           

          What computer operating system are you running Premiere Elements 11 on?

           

          The video card and its driver are always a factor to be ruled in or out of the troubleshooting?

          a. Do you have the latest version of the driver for either video card, according to the web site of the manufacturer of the video card?

          b. Have you looked at rolling back the video card driver version?

          c. Yes, you could use the GT610 for troubleshooting purposes.

           

          d. But, what are the properties of your source media and what project preset did you or the program set? (You can check with Edit Menu/Project Settings/General.) Are you looking at the rendered or unrendered Timeline as you play back the Timeline content in the Edit Mode monitor?

           

          e. Then the usual questions...do you have the latest version of QuickTime installed on your computer with Premiere Elements 11?

          Are you running the program as Run As Adminstrator or from a User Account with Administrative Privileges? What do your computer resources look like?

           

          Let us start here and then move forward based on your answers.

           

          Thanks.

           

          ATR

          • 2. Re: Elements 11 Video Stutter
            Cameradude63 Level 1

            a. Do you have the latest version of the driver for either video card, according to the web site of the manufacturer of the video card?

                Yes down loaded the latest driver.

             

             

            b. Have you looked at rolling back the video card driver version?

            No but had the same result before i updated the video driver.

             

            d. But, what are the properties of your source media and what project preset did you or the program set? (You can check with Edit Menu/Project Settings/General.) Are you looking at the rendered or unrendered Timeline as you play back the Timeline content in the Edit Mode monitor?

             

            The media has come from a Go Pro hero 3, and Panasonic (HX-WA10 1080i 30fps) I'm not sure of the Gopro file firmat.

            The project set automatically to HDV, I wasn't sure what i should capture as so used the file option. I've tried to render but with no change, as far as i can see it doesn't seem to think there is anything to render.

             

            e. Then the usual questions...do you have the latest version of QuickTime installed on your computer with Premiere Elements 11?

            Are you running the program as Run As Adminstrator or from a User Account with Administrative Privileges? What do your computer resources look like?

             

            Yes I downloaded the latest Quicktime, would premiere automatically use this or is there a setting i need to change?

            Running as the Administrator, there are no other accounts on the machine, everything else seems to be running OK there doesn't seem to be any conflics.

             

            Thanks for your help so far.

            • 3. Re: Elements 11 Video Stutter
              A.T. Romano Level 7

              Cameradude63

               

              Let us first explore factors related to project set up. You say that your Timeline is a combo of footage from the Go Pro Hero 3 and the Panasonic HXWA10. You say that you are not sure of the format of the Go Pro Hero 3 but give 1080i30 for the Panasonic.

               

              If you let the program set the project preset, it will do so based on the properties of the first video drag to the Timeline. So what is being set which of the two you drag to the Timeline first. Sometimes the program does OK with the set, sometimes not. When does not, it does not give the closest possible project preset, but rather defaults to its default NTSC AVCHD Full HD 1080i30 for the NTSC setup.

               

              Pending further information, I am going on the belief that you have a mix of 1080p30 (1920 x 1080 @ 30 progressive frames per second) and 1080i30 (1920 x 1080 @ 29.97 interlaced frames per second).

               

              Panasonic Video Check Out....

               

              1. Premiere Elements 11. Set the project preset manually before you import the video into the project. To do that....

              a. Open Premiere Element 11 to its Expert workspace, go to File Menu/New/Project and set the project preset for

              NTSC

              AVCHD

              Full HD 1080i30

              Before you exit the new project dialog, be sure to have a check mark next to "Force Selected Project Setting on This Project".

              b. Back in the Premiere Elements 11 Expert workspace, then import your video using Add Media/Files and Folders/Project Assets from where you drag the video to the Timeline. Is there a colored line over the Timeline? There should be no colored line. What does the playback of that video look like in the Edit Mode monitor?

               

              Go Pro Hero 3 Check Out....

               

              1. Premiere Elements 11. Set the project preset manually before you import the video into the project. To do that....

              a. Open Premiere Elements 11 to its Expert workspace, go to File Menu/New/Project and set the project preset for

              NTSC

              DSLR

              1080p

              DSLR 1080p30

              b. Same as before with Panasonic footage.

               

              Please review the above and let us know if all assumptions are correct to proceed with that plan.

               

              Thanks.

               

              ATR

              • 4. Re: Elements 11 Video Stutter
                Cameradude63 Level 1

                I've got the Panasonic footage to work using your settings but in Pal. Still working on the GOPro, this is also pal 1080 25 i. I'm not sure if this is AVCHD ? or which selection to import it with?

                 

                Thanks

                • 5. Re: Elements 11 Video Stutter
                  A.T. Romano Level 7

                  Cameradude63

                   

                  Could you clarify your details on that GoPro. Your "i" in the description may be causing some confusion for me?

                   

                  What I need for you to confirm

                   

                  Is the Go Pro Hero 3 footage

                   

                  1920 x 1080 16:9 @ 25 interlaced frames per second

                   

                  or like the other (Panasonic)

                   

                  1920 x 1080 16:9 @ 25 progressive frames per second

                   

                  From the specifications that I see for the Go Pro Hero 3, it would seem that both Go Pro and Panasonic are 1080p, that is, 1920 x 1080 16:9 @ 25 progressive frames per second (if you are using PAL specifications).

                   

                  If both are the same, then both should have the same DSLR project preset.

                   

                  Please review and then let us know the follow up details.

                   

                  But, any questions, please do not hesitate to ask for futher clarification.

                   

                  Thanks.

                   

                  ATR

                  • 6. Re: Elements 11 Video Stutter
                    Cameradude63 Level 1

                    Hi, yes i'm using Pal Specifications, 1080p that is 1920 x 1080 16:9 @25 progressive fps. If i inport the Gopro using these settings then i still get some judder, but if i use the interpret footage tab and set to 30 fps and then render in the time line all comes good. The propertities of each clip still say they are 25fps. I don't understand why this is happening. But all seems to be OK if i do it this way.

                    • 7. Re: Elements 11 Video Stutter
                      A.T. Romano Level 7

                      Cameradude63

                       

                      Thanks for the update.

                       

                      To get at an understanding on what might be happening with Panasonic and GoPro footage on the same Timeline...

                       

                      I think that the "i" after your frame rate number and you saying that you are using 1080p needs clarification.

                       

                      Specifically what is the Panasonic footage

                      1920 x 1080, is that interlaced or progressive 29.97, 30, or 25 frames per second?

                       

                      Likewise, what is the GoPro footage

                      1920 x 1080, is that interlaced or progressive 29.97, 30, or 25 frames per second?

                       

                      From what you just wrote in your post 6, the answers would seem to be:

                      Both camera are giving you 1920 x 1080 @ 25 progressive frames per second.

                       

                      If that is the case, then the project preset for this project (with both Panasonic and GoPro files) should be

                      PAL

                      DSLR

                      1080p

                      DSLR 1080p25

                       

                      Please review the above and then let us know if we are in sync on the details. That will help me in offering an explanation for what you are seeing.

                       

                      Also, have you gotten to exporting of this Timeline yet? We can discuss those plans and results next.

                       

                      Thanks for the follow ups.

                       

                      ATR

                      • 8. Re: Elements 11 Video Stutter
                        whsprague Level 4

                        It used to be that GoPro footage was commonly difficult in several NLEs.  The solution was to pre-process the footage in the software provided by GoPro.  I may still be true. 

                        • 9. Re: Elements 11 Video Stutter
                          A.T. Romano Level 7

                          Lots of GoPro cameras and several NLE's so I will confine my comments to GoPro cameras in general with specifics to Premiere Elements editing of footage from them. I cannot confirm the used to be in the following.

                           

                           

                          It used to be that GoPro footage was commonly difficult in several NLEs.  The solution was to pre-process the footage in the software provided by GoPro.  I may still be true.

                           

                           

                          There was a user with ID KLX450R who used GoPro Hero HD Helmet and wanted to edit it in Premiere Elements 8.0/8.0.1. He posted his issues which were worked through to some magnificent conclusions without any pre-processing of the footage as far as I was able to determine.

                          http://www.elementsvillage.com/forums/showthread.php?t=58732

                          It is a long thread, this was his first try based on discussions

                          http://www.advrider.com/forums/showpost.php?p=13243420&postcount=28

                          subsequent video

                          http://vimeo.com/12721282

                           

                          He went on to post other videos with this the GoPro source, new versions of Premiere Elements, one better than the previous one.

                           

                          ATR

                          • 10. Re: Elements 11 Video Stutter
                            VDOSurfer Level 3

                            As suggested already, converting GoPro is the easiest and the most commonly used workflow. Use their software, which some years back was only a converter now seems to be a full editor.

                            http://gopro.com/software-app/gopro-studio

                             

                            The feature set is definitely less than what Premiere Elements has, but this kind of is so commonly used for GoPro that it is a necessary pass through for all video ediiting for footages from GoPro cameras, even Hero3.

                            • 11. Re: Elements 11 Video Stutter
                              A.T. Romano Level 7

                              VDOSurfer

                               

                              Generalizing, for some, use of a non Premiere Elements program or conversion of a particular video format may be easier by one non Premiere Elements route or another. One example, the frequent chat about Windows Movie Maker instead of Premiere Elements as the sole video editor. And, more often than not, the rationale for the video editor choice is pinned to the level of the experience of the user.

                               

                              I would question your generalization about "video editing for" as it relates to GoPro footage

                              ..

                              ..that it is a necessary pass through for all video editing for footages from GoPro cameras, even Hero3.

                               

                               

                              What have you found to be the liabilities of importing the footage with the correct Premiere Elements project settings from the camera's file saved to the computer hard drive without any GoPro software intervention? If you have the time, perhaps you could elaborate on the gains to be gotten from what I am understanding as GoPro software pre-processing of it before import into Premiere Elements. Is my understanding of your point on this correct?

                               

                              Thanks.

                               

                              ATR

                              • 12. Re: Elements 11 Video Stutter
                                VDOSurfer Level 3

                                The secret of GoPro as I understand is in their camera file encoding. They use a long GOP variant of H264, I think named Ambarella ( or something like that )AVC. The thing with the long GOP is that for every I-frame, there can be a 100 or so P/B frames. Now this is really good for playing back. A player has to decode one I-frame and then continue to decode the little P or B frames. I-frames are used only to store big scene changes or 100 frames, whichever comes first. Thus saves space and their bit rates are lower. They used to be ~9 Mbps at 1280x720 at 29.97p. That's really low, made possible by the encoding schema.

                                 

                                Now editing is a different ball game altogether. The needs are different and hence the inputs need to be different. Typically there is an I-frame inserted every 30 or so frames in a 20-30Mbps 1920x1080 AVCHD from a say Canon camera. These are more edit friendly because of the reduced effort in decoding them on request. To explain, take a small example of a frame seek. This needs that specific frame in question to be decoded, which in turn needs the reference frame corresponding to this frame decoded. The reference frames we know can be really far away, so large number of frames in between end up needing decoding. This can be very many frames, much higher in number than regular AVCHD camera files. Raw decoded frames are huge, we know this very well. Thus the memory required to retain all these decoded frames can be alarmingly high. So high that the available RAM is completely utilized. Even if you have 8gb of it, that will only be few secs of it. And what have we done? Just moved the CTI over a frame.

                                 

                                This problem is multiplied if we do a scrub over the timeline and once we go into any level of editing, just unmanageable! 

                                We have always suggested conversion to a more friendly AVC format for this very reason. This is a fact that the folks at GoPro seem to recognize all too well and that is why they present a converter in their site. I know of very few other camera manufacturers offering a free converter for their files.

                                 

                                This is the same reason we have seen success after folks converted their videos to MS AVIs and then edited them in this very forum. Ever wondered why does playback become smoother after rendering? Same reason again. All frames that the rendered file holds are I-frames. No expense in decoding-for-seek whatsoever. The GoPro files are the exact opposite! Apple software converts any input file to an AIC format, Apple Intermediate Codec. Again, easy to edit, low intra-frame-interval. This has been a universal paradigm that GoPro has chosen to bypass for "file size" reasons. Good for them...

                                 

                                We editors have to convert our way around this problem. And if their latest offering Hero3 has the same editing issues, conversion is here to stay!