What DNG converter 8.2?
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This may or may not make a difference, but have you set your DNGC ACR compatibility options, in DNGC’s preferences, low enough to support our ancient ACR plug-in version in CS2? I think that would be ACR 2.4 in your case.
Grain is normal in raw files. Adobe has enhanced their noise-suppression in newer versions of PS/ACR, probably since 2010, so do yourself a favor and update to much newer software. If your system is new enough Lightroom is a cheaper alternative to Photoshop, especially when it comes to upgrading. Of course LR 5.x has minimum system requirements of Windows 7+ (or a PC) and OSX 10.7+ on a Mac (I think), so if your computer is as old as your PS, then that may not be an option without upgrading your hardware, first.
Can you post a screenshot of the grain you’re seeing? Maybe what you’re seeing and calling grain is some other problem.
220.127.116.11 not sure if that's the answer but that's what it says at the top.
Yes the preferences are set low enouth 2.4 you are right.
The grain is like noise, as if I've taken the pic at ISO400 sort of thing.Here is a link to the pic.
My computer is not as old as my PS well not quite . Thank you for being so polite . But I'm coming to the conclusion that I probably need to get lightroom. What is the most basic one I need in order to work on RAW files. I'm an underwater photographer and shot in RAW as it is difficult to get the white balance right underwater and sometimes i need to tweak it. Occasionally I use it to alter the exsposure as well. What would you recommend. There seem to be so many!
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Underwater photos are challenging because the red light, then green light, disappears with depth so artificial light is needed to bring back the “real” colors, but also distance between the camera and subject tends to color everything blue or blue-green where white-balance can undo some of that.
The photobucket image is quite small but maybe I can see some noise. Can you post an original raw, maybe one from this new camera that shows the noise and one from your old camera, that apparently doesn’t have the same issue? Upload to http://www.dropbox.com/ and post a public download link. I’d like to try each in the most modern LR and PS/ACR to see if I see the same thing or how much an improvement there is.
What OS version do you have? This will determine the minimum LR version that you would run. And is it a 32-bit or 64-bit OS? How much memory? How many cores? What GHz speed for the CPU? These things will determine how fast it’ll run.
The S95 was first supported in LR 3.3, but Adobe only sells the latest version of their software, which would be LR 5.x with a minimum OS level of Windows 7 or OS 10.7.x. You may be able to get a copy of the previous series, LR 4.x, from Amazon, as long as it was from Amazon, not a loosely affiliated Amazon Marketplace entity that might be selling pirated or blacklisted serial numbers from a stolen shipment.
I have put all the photos in a folder in drop box called raw pics. You have the JPEG, the converted DNG and the orginal CR2 you also have a RAW file taken with my Olympus. Hard really to compare the two as you are not really comparing like with like. I don't have any shots from my olympus taken in the sort of conditions I had with the S95. My olympus was used in the UK (green water diving) and conditions are very different to the other photo which was taken in the Red Sea (blue water diving) I do very little wide angle work as the conditions in the UK are not good for it and tend to stick to macro. However, I've tried to find a similar sort of shot.
I'm not sure how you access the dropbox folder. Don't use it often.
I hope I've done that correctly
You've put a lot of questions at the bottom of your helpful message many of which I don't understand. Sorry but as you've probably guessed, I'm a bit of a dinosaur when it comes to computers. Anyway I'll try and tell you about my computer. It's a Vario laptop with Vista. It's got a sticker on it saying Core2 Duo and there is a sticker underneath that says model PCG 7Y1M. Hope that helps.
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That link is broken. Need to remove the "http://" at the front.
This one works:
thank you! I'm not very good at this stuff.
Your asked about why the Canon S95 is noisier than the Olympus C5050. There seem to be several factors:
First, there are more pixels on the S95 sensor, so each pixel is a little smaller, and a single stray electron of noise is a higher percentage of the maximum pixel value so each extra electron of noise will show up a little more prominently; however, I think there are more important differences between your green-water Olympus shots and your blue-water Canon shots:
Because the eye is most sensitive to green, camera sensors are designed to have twice as many green pixels as red or blue, so your green shots will have much finer detail that will obscure noise. Furthermore, when you white-balance from a mostly blue shot to one that has more red, there is very little red to begin with so any noise in the red is magnified by several times, and likewise with the blue, although maybe not quite as much.
If you have a blue shot or a green shot with both cameras, then it would be easier to tell how much of the increase in noise is due to the color of the light and how much is something else.
Anyway, I did test to see if the DNG Conversion using ACR 2.4 compatiblity had anything to do with anything, and it does not appear to change how the image looks, so that is not a factor.
The main issue is that you're using CS2 and ACR 3.x which has the original (and worst) Adobe raw-conversion algorithm, now known as Process Version 2003. There have been two Process Version since then: Process Version 2010 increased the resolution of the raw conversions significantly as well as changing how sharpening and noise-reduction work in general and Process Version 2012 added a new way of toning (lighten/darken/contrast/etc) the images that is easier to use once you get used to it.
To demonstrate the difference, here is a side-by-side that shows the way CS2 does things at the left and the way the newer ACR 7/8 or LR 4/5 way on the right, where you'll see a coarser texture and more noise using the CS2 way and a finer texture and less noise using the newer methods---click on the embedded image to see it larger:
In my opinion, the noise in the lefthand image is too much, still, and the noise in the righthand image is suppressed too much, but I wanted to show what 50% slider values would do in each case.
Regarding your computer and version of LR. From Googling the brand and model number you gave and finding a 2011 used-computer-for-sale listing with system specs, it seems like your computer is a Core2Duo with a 1.8GHz processor and 1 or 2 GB of memory, and you said it has Vista. The newest version of LR you can run on Vista is LR 4.x that might still be available on Amazon (in the US at least), but you'd be much happer with a much newer computer and either LR 4 or LR 5 on it. Like some sort of i5 or i7 quad-core with at least 8GB of memory. It'd be a few hundred dollars and a bit extra if its a laptop instead of a desktop with the same abilities. Make sure you get one with a screen size of at least 768 or maybe it's 800 or 900 pixels high, so you can see all the buttons along the bottom.
While you're thinking about that, if you want to test how your current computer would work with the most recent LR that will run on it, you can download the LR 4.4.1 update and run it in trial mode for 30 days, by which point you'd either need to buy it or abandon it. Here are the LR download links for Windows -- click on the LR 4.4.1 one:
Thank you so much. This must have taken a lot of your time to answer this question in such a full and detailed way requiring a lot of effort and work on your part. I shall download LR at the weekend and have a play around with it. Funds will not permit a new computer at the moment so I shall have to be content with this one and the best LR can do on it. However, after all your help and advice I am sure I shall achieve a better result.
If you find that Lightroom is too much for your computer to handle, another Adobe offering would be Photoshop Elements 12, which is compatible with Windows XP, Vista, 7, 8, and has a smaller resource footprint than LR. Of course it doesn't have as many raw-editing capabilities as LR, but it will allow Toning, Sharpening, Noise-reduction, Camera Profiles, which may be all you require during the raw conversion stage.
I would try LR out, first, and see if your computer is ok with it, and you're ok with how fast or slow it operates. If it is too slow to be manageable, then you can download the trial of Elements 12 from: http://www.adobe.com/elements and see how well that works.
I've just tried to download LR following the link you gave above and 4.4.1 but it refuses to download. It seems to start to download for around 5 minutes then just stops. Not sure why.
Don't think PS elements would be much good to me, I can get all that stuff on PS2 and more. What I'm really after is being able to alter the white balance and occasionally tweak the exposure which I can only do with a RAW file.
The point of using PSE12 is to get the new noise-reduction and other tools in the Camera Raw plug-in that comes with the newer Adobe products, and does not come with the much older version of the plug-in that accompanies CS2.
Obviously Photoshop has more things it does, but PSE12 at least has layers to some extent, and it wasn’t clear what all you were doing in Photoshop, itself.
LR 4.4 would also provide the same, more advanced editing capabilities as demonstrated in my side-by-side, above. The download is 800+MB so would take quite a while and needs to be done on an internet connection that is fast and not intermittent. Also, your computer shouldn’t go to sleep while the download is occurring otherwise that would stop it.
This thread started with the issue of too much in the raw files from your Canon when processed in CS2. Using PSE12 or LR 4.4 would give you better tools to deal with it.
Managed to download LR this week. I think the connection wasn't brilliant the first time I tried. Anyway, all downloaded and now I've just got to work out how to use it. Thank you.
Here are some tutorials on Adobe TV -- Skip the What’s New section at the beginning and watch some of the others including Workspace, Importing, and Developing:
Once you have created your catalog, the basic workflow is:
File / Import, Sort/Flag/Rate/Keyword in Library as necessary, Adjust in Develop, Output via File/Export or Print.