14 Replies Latest reply on Jan 17, 2014 6:07 PM by A.T. Romano

    Element 3 vs Element 12

    tonebone

      I have read over and over again all information you have sent and suggested.  I do not like that Element 3.0.2 takes your renderd video and creates a new folder called preview rendered files-into .avi files and no audio.  I am thinking about upgrading to Element 12.  Will I have the same problem in 12 when it comes to rendering; will the video and audio rendered together?  Will the software allow one to have the ablility to do progressive scanning instead of interlace editing?  And, will the edited video stay in focus?

       

      Thank you.

        • 1. Re: Element 3 vs Element 12
          Steve Grisetti Adobe Community Professional

          If by "render" you mean sharing or publishing a finished video from your Premiere Elements project, neither version 3 nor version 12 outputs separate video and audio streams. Any Share or Export template should give you a file that includes audio and video.

           

          Or are you talking about temporary timeline renders, which have no bearing on your final output?

          • 2. Re: Element 3 vs Element 12
            John T Smith Adobe Community Professional & MVP

            If you go to the The Elements Tutorial Links Page http://forums.adobe.com/thread/1275830 you may read about the "sharing" options to export new files

            • 3. Re: Element 3 vs Element 12
              tonebone Level 1

              Yes, I believe I am talking about temporary timeline renders.  I have a program Neat Video, that allows one to clean up video noise.  After, I cleaned up and edited various things to the video-I rendered the video.  It takes the video to a folder called

              Premiere Preview files and in the folder are all the clips in a .avi file no video.  I then rendered the audio and it went into a save file of Premiere.  So, this is what I am dealing with; what do you think?

              • 4. Re: Element 3 vs Element 12
                BobB

                I also have the Net Video application however in my case it's a plug-in to PE, not a separate program.   Is that what you are referring to?

                 

                What you described with the preview files is normal operation but those are used as work files by PE, they aren't intended to be used by themselves.   Assuming you have the PC specifications to support version 12, there are some major enhancements from 3.0.2 (but some differences in how it's used as well).  I've use PE since at least that version, and each one is usually an enhancement over the previous one.

                 

                Bob

                • 5. Re: Element 3 vs Element 12
                  tonebone Level 1

                  yes, so, what do you do? do you put it file separately back into pe, if so, this is a pain, because now you have to much the audio back; could not line the audio up well enough for some speakers. also, why can't the video and audio be rendered together as a whole instead being separate?

                  • 6. Re: Element 3 vs Element 12
                    N9JCR Level 2

                    So if you are using it as a plug-in, you don't need to "do" anything.  When you render the video and create a DVD (assuming that's what you want to do) PE will create and use intermediate files such as you point out but that should be invisible to you. And that happens if you are using Neat Video or not.  The resulting DVD will have audio and video in sync.

                     

                    Is that what you have done (create a DVD) or are you trying to do something else?

                     

                     

                    Bob

                    • 7. Re: Element 3 vs Element 12
                      tonebone Level 1

                      thank you, when using neat video after you had removed the noise, i thought the proper process was to render before going to your final process to produce a dvd.

                      as you know, you get a jerking motion during reviewing of your clip(s) after using neat video. so, what could i be doing wrong?  at one time when using pe, i thought in the dvd mode it automaticly went into a rendered process.  presently, i tried to create a dvd and i rendered in this mode, but my system frozed and closed. so, again, what am i doing wrong?

                       

                      thank you.

                      • 8. Re: Element 3 vs Element 12
                        A.T. Romano Level 7

                        tonebone

                         

                        I understand your focus to be on the process of rendering the Timeline conent in order to get the best possible preview of what you will be viewing in the Edit Mode monitor when you view the Timeline video there with the Neat applied. What I am about to write applies to Timeline video with or without the Neat applied.

                         

                        And, the following is true if you are working with Premiere Elements 3 or 12.

                         

                        The program uses a color line indicator line over the Timeline content to let you know if it believes you are looking at the best possible preview. No colored line or green line indicates you are getting the best preview and no rendering is needed or available. If you see a red line (versions earlier than 12) or orange line (version 12), that is the program telling you that you do not have the best possible preview and, to obtain it, you need to render the Timeline content.

                         

                        You do not have to render the Timeline content. However, it is your window of opportunity to catch a problem sooner than later, and it is particularly useful for titles, transitions, effects, and non native formats.

                         

                        The rendering of the TImeline contents automatically puts preview files on your computer hard drive. In the case of a SD project, the files are DV AVI whether you have rendered a still or video. If HD project, the files are MPEG2.mpg. There is no way to render a Timeline content and not get these preview files generated automatically, be it Premiere Elements 3, 4, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, or 12.

                         

                        There are many many other trivia and sometimes nuisance facts associated with this process that I will not go into now.

                         

                        Maintenance of the automatically generated files is required. Pile ups of them can seriously affect the performance of your program. The target pile ups should be:

                        preview files (from your rendering)

                        conformed audio

                        conformed video

                         

                        Typical places to find these

                        preview files...Adobe Premiere Elements Preview Files Folder, usually in Documents/Adobe/Premiere Elements/

                        conformed audio (cfa and pek sets, Media Cache Files Folder, usually in Documents/Adobe/Premiere Elements/

                        conformed video (.mcdb, usually best gotten at via Edit Menu/Preferences/Media and the clean button in the Media Cache Database area.)

                         

                        And, if you have not already, you should assure that your Scratch Disks are all directed to a hard drive space with enough free space to accept them. (See Edit Menu/Preference/Scratch Disks).

                         

                        I have generalized on locations, and I am assuming that the 3 locations will compare with what is written here.

                         

                        Please review and let us know if we have targeted your questions.

                         

                        Thank you.

                         

                        ATR

                        • 9. Re: Element 3 vs Element 12
                          tonebone Level 1

                          Thank you.

                           

                          I did notice that the time line had color or no color.  When this type of thing happens to try grab only the colored one(s)?  And, when you use the words conformed audio/video is there a way to render the clips to have both video/audio

                          together and not split?

                          preview files...Adobe Premiere Elements Preview Files Folder, usually in Documents/Adobe/Premiere Elements/

                          conformed audio (cfa and pek sets, Media Cache Files Folder, usually in Documents/Adobe/Premiere Elements/

                          conformed video (.mcdb, usually best gotten at via Edit Menu/Preferences/Media and the clean button in the Media Cache Database area.)  I have seen most of these, but not the word conformed, and what does the clean button do?  I can't remember but I found my audio as a wave file in another folder. I have tried to put all the clips and audio back together in sync with one bad clip that I can not use.  I thought there was a way to grab anything video / audio and delete what you do want? But, I am having problems with this type of task.  So, I am open to any suggestions and grateful to your response(s).

                           

                          Thank you.

                          • 10. Re: Element 3 vs Element 12
                            A.T. Romano Level 7

                            tonebone

                             

                            I will be back later with some organized further details.

                             

                            The conformed audio and conformed video are not preview files. They are imported files (video and/or audio) that the program has found necessary to conform to the project settings. These conforms are characterized by the file extensions that I cited....cfa and pek for conformed audio, and .mcdb for the conformed video.

                             

                            The conformed video are found in a different location than the other two. To clean them out, you can go to Edit Menu/Preferences/Media and hit the clean button. That is a shortcut so that you do not have to go to the hard drive save location where they are and delete them there. But, you can see the complete path to the actual files by looking in the Media Cache Database section where the Clean button is.

                             

                            More later.

                             

                            ATR

                            • 11. Re: Element 3 vs Element 12
                              tonebone Level 1

                              I am able to render but in a few files at a time due to not enough memory(this is the error message-not enough memory).  Once I am able to complete the rendering process,when I begin the dvd process will I have problems?  The total of files are about 99 and the total time of recording is about 2hours and 45 minutes.

                               

                              Thank you

                               

                              tonebone

                              • 12. Re: Element 3 vs Element 12
                                A.T. Romano Level 7

                                tonebone

                                 

                                In reflecting on the situation, there are two major factors at work here, one the size of your project vs Premiere Elements 3.0/3.0.2 computer resources and now disc capacity as you proceeded to burn to disc DVD.

                                 

                                Our prior discussions have focused on computer maintenance/optimization with regard to Scratch Disks. But, what you have falls under "it is what it is"

                                 

                                a. Premiere Elements 3.0/3.0.2 is a 32 bit application and as such has the 32 bit system limitation of maximum supported installed RAM = 4.0 GB of which 3.2 to 3.0 or less of that are available...or less if you have 3.0 or 2.0 GB RAM installed, rather than 4.0 GB RAM.

                                 

                                b. DVD standard disc is labelled 4.7 GB/120 minutes (in reality that 4.7 GB is 4.38 GB). If applicable, the DVD double layer single sided is labelled 8.5 GB/240 minutes (in reality that 8.5 GB is 7.95 GB).

                                 

                                So, in looking at the situation and its prospects we need to consider

                                 

                                a. How much installed and vailable RAM does your computer have?

                                 

                                b. With your DVD disc in the burner try and your Timeline content ready for burn to disc DVD, what does the Burn Dialog Quality Area show for Space Required and Bitrate? And, are you working there with a check mark next to "Fit Content to Available Space"?

                                 

                                Also to avoid complications, please review the place of menu markers to maker sure

                                 

                                a. there is adequate spacing between them at the Timeline level

                                 

                                b. you do not have a stop marker at the end of the last item on the Timeline

                                 

                                Please review the above and then we can decide what next.

                                 

                                Thank you.

                                 

                                ATR

                                • 13. Re: Element 3 vs Element 12
                                  tonebone Level 1

                                  Thanks:

                                   

                                  I forgot to mention,that, my RAM=2GB; I had 4GB but my computer did not seem to make a difference.  I have plenty of Disc space, I am using an external hard drive that have a lot of space.  Is is better to use double layer vs standard 4.7GB disc? I usually don't like to use "Fit Content to Available Space," and what is adequate spacing between them at the Timeline level and to make sure markers are placed properly, how do you get rid of or not have a stop marker at end of the last item on the Timeline. 

                                   

                                  Your advice has been great!!!!!!

                                   

                                  tonebone

                                  • 14. Re: Element 3 vs Element 12
                                    A.T. Romano Level 7

                                    tonebone

                                     

                                    Thanks for the follow ups and updates.

                                     

                                    First, if you have the RAM modules specified for your computer motherboard, I would encourage you to go back to 4 GB installed RAM. If you have any concerns about your RAM modules and whether they are compatible with your computer motherboard, a place like Crudial is one of the places to get good advice on that.

                                    http://www.crucial.com/

                                     

                                    Definitely work with "Fit Content to Available Space" with check mark. The only time not to do that is when you are getting Data Rate Error messages from the program. In that case, you leave "Fit Content to Available Space" without a check mark so that you can adjust the bitrate downward just to the point where you no longer get the Data Rate Error message.

                                     

                                    Nonetheless watch the Space Required and Bitrate in the Burn Dialog when you have your disc in the DVD burn tray and are about to hit the Burn button. A value less than 8.00 Mbps for the bitrate indicates that the program has lowered the bitrate to make the fit. The lower the bitrate the lower the quality. You can get away with a little lowering of the bitrate without sacrificing quality markedly, but....

                                     

                                    Let us see what your Space Required and Bitrate values look like with check mark next to "Fit Content to Available Space". You may need to go to a DVD double layer single sided disc.

                                     

                                    The user is the one who places menu markers. So, just do not put a stop markers at the end of the last item on the Timeline and you will be OK. If you have that stop marker there, then right click it and delete it.

                                     

                                    More later.

                                     

                                    ATR