15 Replies Latest reply on Jan 19, 2014 8:29 AM by MW Design

    Nested styles: I can't seem to make this work

    rguthrie

      I can't seem to do this nested style: All Adobe Garamond. Headline: 24/25 centered. Return. Byline: 9/10 centered, stacked. "by" is italic with a .5, one inch wide  rule above. Return. Author's name is small caps with the same rule below. Return. Body text is 9/10 regular, first paragraph has a 3 line bold drop cap, the other paragraphs have a .25 indent.

       

      Nothing seems to work when I try to set this up. Rules everywhere...and I am supposed to have the document set up in 14 hours....help!

        • 1. Re: Nested styles: I can't seem to make this work
          MW Design Level 4

          Well, I would just chain the paragraph styles together. Hit Enter and the next style is set. In the example below, I was unclear as to whether the drop cap body text was indented or not, looked better indented to me.

           

          I first formatted the various styles. Then went back and set each style to trigger the following style for the Next Paragraph. do remember that if you set the rules to Frame and then set the indents, that if the frame is narrowed or widened, it affects the rule length. I usually just use Text for that setting.

           

          capture-001006.png

          • 2. Re: Nested styles: I can't seem to make this work
            MW Design Level 4

            Oh yeah.

             

            For the rules, if you have the option/control of the design and it works for you, consider just setting the rules on the Author style and set to Text for the length. Alter the offset for the rule above to hit above the "By" line. An Example...

             

            capture-001007.png

            • 3. Re: Nested styles: I can't seem to make this work
              rguthrie Level 1

              I am so lost on this, is there any way that you can help? You seem to know exactly what you are doing. I have all of the styles created; they are all paragraph styles. When I choose the headline paragraph style, set up as garamond 24/25 centered, then double click it to go to drop caps and nested styles, then click on new nested syle, in the drop down list none of my other styles appear (shouldn't they? So that I can "nest" them? I have watched a few tutorials and they seem to indicate that only character styles can be nested into a paragraph. Maybe you can send me a screen shot?

              • 4. Re: Nested styles: I can't seem to make this work
                rguthrie Level 1

                This looks perfect, but I still can't seem to duplicate it. Is it all one style?

                • 5. Re: Nested styles: I can't seem to make this work
                  Willi Adelberger Most Valuable Participant

                  WHY do you want NESTED styles. A nested style affects only character properties INSIDE THE VERY SAME paragraph, never a second paragraph will be envolved.

                  You have to create several paragrpaph styles:

                  1. Headline 2 Next by-style
                  2. by-style (in the paragraph style a forced line break, first line a nested line character style), next style intro-text
                  3. intro-text style where a drop cap, 1 letter, 3 lines is defined, next para style normal
                  4. normal para style
                  • 6. Re: Nested styles: I can't seem to make this work
                    Peter Spier Most Valuable Participant (Moderator)

                    Nested Styles are character styles added inside a paragraph style that  affect only certain parts of the text, based on trigger patterns that  you set up. Typically you would use a nested style to do somthing like make the first three words of a paragraph Italic, or make a price bold on a menu.

                     

                    It's probably technically possible to achieve your title using nested styles, forced line breaks as triggers, and paragraph rules above and below with the proper offsets, but what you want to do is not typically done with nested styles, but rather with a series of individual paragraph styles that are applied in rotation automatically using the "next style" attribute.

                     

                    Mikes example is using three paragraph styles for the heading. PStyle1 (just a place-holder name for a pragraph style here) is applied to the text Headline 2, and as part of that style defintion the "next style" is set to PStyle2. PStyle2 is applied to the By line, and its next style is set to PStyle3, which is applied to MW Design. Each of these lines is a separate paragraph (he should have shown you the non-printing characters so you could see the hard returns at the end of each line). PStyle3 should have its next style set to your style for the first paragraph of body text that includes the drop cap, and that one needs a next style set to the paragraph style for your other body text. This last body style should have the next style set to "same style."

                     

                    If you are typing directly in ID, for each story, set the style to PStyle1 and begin typing. When you hit Enter to move to the by line, the style will change automatically, and will change again each time you hit Enter until you are inthe second paragraph of the body copy, where it will keep the same style until you change it manually again.

                     

                    If you are working with imported text you can select an entire story froom the fiorst line of the title to the last last paragraph of body copy, then right click on the PStyle1 name in the Paragrapgh Styles panel and choose Apply PStyle1 and Next Style and the whole shebang will get the correct styles applied in one click.

                    • 7. Re: Nested styles: I can't seem to make this work
                      rguthrie Level 1

                      Excellent help, finally explained. None of the Adobe tutorials really explain that nested styles are contained within one paragraph. Since there is availability of "through-forced return" I made the assumption that it could be a multiple paragraph nested style. If any of you are willing to do a video tutorial on this particular kind of set up, I think it would be really valuable, doesn't every magazine and newspaper use something like this (perhaps without the rules)?

                       

                      I'm so grateful to have finally learned this.

                      • 8. Re: Nested styles: I can't seem to make this work
                        BobLevine MVP & Adobe Community Professional

                        May I suggest some quality time with Lynda.com? Here’s a link for a free one week trial: http://bit.ly/RS0GXs

                        • 9. Re: Nested styles: I can't seem to make this work
                          Peter Spier Most Valuable Participant (Moderator)

                          Forced return or forced line break, as it's known in ID, could be used to to do this as nested styles, by using Shift + Enter at the end of each line rather than just Enter, but the rules get to be a bit of a hassle since your options for length are either relative to the text width, or relative to the column width, and neither one is likely to be correct most of the time unless you use only a rule below with a custom stroke style of type stripe to make both lines. The lenght of the rule, when set to text, is governed by the length of the first line of the paragaph for rule above and the last line for rule below.

                           

                          It's doable, but so much more work than rotating paragraph styles that it's hardly worth it.

                          • 10. Re: Nested styles: I can't seem to make this work
                            rguthrie Level 1

                            I am actually a paying member of Lynda, but none of the tutorials there actually get this deep into doing what I had wanted to do. Of course, in my haste, I may not have searched thoroughly but, I did watch four lengthy tutorials. If you know of the very tutorial I should watch, please post the URL, as I mentioned, I have a subscription. Your help is appreciated.

                            • 11. Re: Nested styles: I can't seem to make this work
                              MW Design Level 4

                              https://www.dropbox.com/s/ssaumlleyhi23qz/rguthrie.zip

                               

                              Is the sample. Click into each paragraph and examine the styles. Look especially at the General section that opens when you first edit the Style. Look a the Next Style drop down.

                               

                              Mike

                              • 12. Re: Nested styles: I can't seem to make this work
                                Willi Adelberger Most Valuable Participant

                                rguthrie schrieb:

                                … "through-forced return" …

                                Be aware, that a forced return is ALWAYS a new line in the SAME paragrpah.

                                • 13. Re: Nested styles: I can't seem to make this work
                                  MW Design Level 4
                                  (he should have shown you the non-printing characters so you could see the hard returns at the end of each line)

                                   

                                  But he did at least write: Hit Enter and the next style is set.

                                   

                                  Took the entirety of last night off of being on-line. Man, it felt good...

                                  • 14. Re: Nested styles: I can't seem to make this work
                                    Peter Spier Most Valuable Participant (Moderator)

                                    MW Design wrote:

                                     

                                     

                                    Took the entirety of last night off of being on-line. Man, it felt good...

                                    Are you kidding? I go into serious withdrawal after 4 hours of disconnect.

                                    • 15. Re: Nested styles: I can't seem to make this work
                                      MW Design Level 4

                                      Hey, it was only the first couple hours I twitched. The next hour I kept looking totwards "the room with the computer." After that, it was a piece of cake. Well, other than my fingers kept wanting to type something.