4 Replies Latest reply on Jan 30, 2014 11:10 PM by Takasaurus

    Lost frames

    Takasaurus Level 1

      Having problems with a client.  He sends me AVID output to H.264.  Generally 29.97 Drop.  1080.

       

      I stick it in After Effects.  Do my graphics work, output and send back as H.264.

       

      When he imports into Avid.  The first frame is black and the pie      ce is short by at least 2-3 frames at the end.

       

      I am creating my comp exactly to the length of the footage he gives me.  Exactly.    Matching frame rates exactly.

       

      This happens on every piece I send back to him.  I open in Quicktime and the first frame is fine.  But on the AVID first frame is black.

       

      Any thoughts?

       

      TAK

        • 1. Re: Lost frames
          Mylenium Most Valuable Participant

          Well, but with what settings are the files re-imported? The issue may not be at all on your end.

           

          Mylenium

          • 2. Re: Lost frames
            Rick Gerard Adobe Community Professional & MVP

            Unless you are using an lossless version of h.264 you should not be using that format at all as a digital intermediate...

             

            Second thing, frame rate and interlacing issues sound like the most likely culprits.

             

            Third thing, see the first thing. h.264 is not a production format except for one specific lossless setup and Avid might not like it at all... Try running with one of Avid's codecs. That's why they are available for download.

            • 3. Re: Lost frames
              Todd_Kopriva Level 8

              I agree with Rick. H.264 should not be used for intermediate files. That's why our applications have built-in DNxHD codecs. There are some other good choices for intermediates, including lossless options like PNG and slightly lossy options like ProRes 4444.

              • 4. Re: Lost frames
                Takasaurus Level 1

                I generally use H.264 throughout the testing and approval stages.  Its just faster to send through the internet.  My finish work is usually Pro Res or DNxHD.

                 

                The problem doesn't seem to be related to H.264 however.  I got an apch file from my client.  It is 14:18 long.  I drop it onto the composition icon at the bottom of the Project Window which creates a composition 14:18 long.  However, when I output the files are coming in at 14:16.  I have tried all sorts of test... using Drop Frame 29.97.  Non Drop Frame 29.97. Both in the Video interpretation and in the composition.  I have Field Render to Lower field, upper field and none.  But it keeps coming out at 4:16.

                 

                Normally I give my clients a little head or tail on my work but when they send me footage that is cut to time, these frame drops are a problem.

                 

                I am continuing to test.

                 

                TAK

                 

                UPDATE:  I ran some tests using a timecode overlay.  Five seconds and 1 frame.   In AE the numbers run from 00;00;00;00 to 00;00;05;00.

                 

                I output to H.264.  If I bring that output back into AE I see all the frames including 00;00;05;00.  However if I open the same file in Quicktime I don't see the last frame.  The last number showing is 00;00;04;29.

                 

                If I output the same comp to Pro Rez I get all the frames even in Quicktime.

                 

                Two clients with AVIDs tell me that the first frame of my H.264s always show up as black.  We are experimenting to see if the frame is covering frame one or pushing frame 1 to frame 2.

                 

                Message was edited by: Takasaurus

                 

                It appears, at least when dealing with AVID, that H.264 adds a frame of black at the top. It doesn't cover the first frame... it pushes it one frame forward... however it also causes the last frame (sometimes more than 1) to disappear.

                 

                The black frame doesn't show up in Quicktime but the missing end frame does.

                 

                I guess the solution is to always add 10 frames or so at the end.

                 

                Thanks for the input

                 

                TAK

                 

                Message was edited by: Takasaurus