18 Replies Latest reply on Mar 7, 2014 5:02 PM by D Fosse

    Resolution issue b/w monitors and Internet

    jackaroe222

      I've been working on some night photos I took of the northern lights and I've run into an issue.  After doing my usual processing with Photoshop my pictures look the way I'd like them to on my desktop monitor.  I then do my usual Convert to Profile--Working RGB-SrGB and then Save for Web, followed by uploading them to the Internet.  When I view these particular photos on the Internet on my monitor they look awful.  The colors look grainy and unnatural and the photos have noise in the detail.   I have spent hours running them through noise filters and making other changes.  They will always look good in Photoshop and then terrible on-line.  Then I decided to view them on my iPad and found that they look good!  I don't think it's the desktop monitor resolution because they look good in Photoshop on the same monitor.  Does anyone have any idea as to why they look terrible on-line on the desktop monitor but good on my iPad?  I'm at a loss here.

       

      The  Profile is:

      Settings: North America General Purpose 2

      RGB: sRGB

      CMYK: US Web Coated(SWOP) v2

      Gray: Dot Gain 20%

      Spot: Dot Gain 20%

      Color Management Policies:

      RGB: Preserve Embedded Profiles

      CMYK: Preserve Embedded Profiles

      Gray: Preserve Embedded Profiles

       

      Here's an example of one of the photos:

       

       

      redgreen7.jpg

        • 1. Re: Resolution issue b/w monitors and Internet
          Mylenium Most Valuable Participant

          Don't embed color profiles.

           

          Mylenim

          • 2. Re: Resolution issue b/w monitors and Internet
            jackaroe222 Level 1

            That didn't work, but thanks.

            • 3. Re: Resolution issue b/w monitors and Internet
              Noel Carboni Level 8

              That looks very nice from here.

               

              Keep in mind that some browsers are not properly color-managed.  What browser do you use, specifically?

               

              What is your color-management situation?  Have you calibrated/profiled your monitor?  What color profile is associated with your monitor?

               

              -Noel

              • 4. Re: Resolution issue b/w monitors and Internet
                jackaroe222 Level 1

                I think you may be on to something.  The pictures looked terrible in Firefox but looked better in IE.  My monitor is calibrated.  How do I get the pictures to look right in Firefox?

                • 5. Re: Resolution issue b/w monitors and Internet
                  D Fosse Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                  You're using very loose and mixed terminology here, so it's not easy to understand what the problem really is. Can you post a side by side screenshot, good and bad?

                   

                  Firefox and Photoshop should always display identically, both being fully color managed. If they don't your monitor profile may be corrupt, or you're using a v4 monitor profile which Firefox doesn't support by default (it can be enabled manually). Or you may have saved the image without an embedded document profile. That was once standard operating procedure because browsers weren't color managed anyway, but today they are and you should always embed.

                   

                  The exception is IE, which will read the document profile, but substitutes sRGB for the actual monitor profile. So it will always display slightly differently and never entirely accurate.

                   

                  The pictures looked terrible in Firefox but looked better in IE.

                  So based on the above, I'd say you have a monitor profile problem of some sort. But let's see a comparison screenshot.

                  • 6. Re: Resolution issue b/w monitors and Internet
                    D Fosse Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                    Mylenium wrote:

                     

                    Don't embed color profiles.

                     

                    Mylenim

                    Why would that help with anything?

                    • 7. Re: Resolution issue b/w monitors and Internet
                      Trevor.Dennis Adobe Community Professional

                      Looks fine to me (IE10),  Maybe not quite so good in Firefox.  Looks best of all in Chrome, but due to more contrast with shadow end blocked out a tiny bit, which is cheating with an image like that.  All very very subtle differences though, and none of them look even slightly nasty.

                      • 8. Re: Resolution issue b/w monitors and Internet
                        jackaroe222 Level 1

                        I'm not sure how to post a comparison screenshot since the issue is how it looks in a browser. 

                        I've attached a link to where my photo is on the web if that helps:

                        http://jackstraw22.smugmug.com/Other/Iceland/37489549_XXNKLR#!i=3109530247&k=dFGmSVf&lb=1& s=A

                        • 9. Re: Resolution issue b/w monitors and Internet
                          D Fosse Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                          Jut put a Firefox window up beside Photoshop, and hit "print screen". Paste into a new file in Photoshop.

                           

                          Then, when you have the screenshot open in Photoshop, assign your monitor profile, then convert to sRGB. Post that.

                           

                          If they don't match - which they should, but you say they don't - there are a couple of things to go through: does the file have an embedded profile and which one? What calibrator? Does the OS load the correct display profile? v2 or v4 display profile? and a couple of other things.

                           

                          It's not as bad as it sounds, it's just establishing that the color management chain is operational in both applications. The basic chain of events is just "document profile > display profile", and that simple equation should yield the same result each time.

                           

                          Unless the display profile is bad, in which case anything can happen.

                          • 10. Re: Resolution issue b/w monitors and Internet
                            Noel Carboni Level 8

                            The image posted in this thread, above, and at the smugmug link given, are both tagged with the sRGB IEC61966-2.1 color profile.  That's fine.

                             

                            But...

                             

                            The color values in the images are significantly different.  The image you posted at the smugmug.com web site is a good bit lighter than in the image posted in this thread.  That implies you either processed the image differently or reprocessed it between saving those two versions.

                             

                            Specifically, redgreen2.jpg is lighter than redgreen7.jpg.

                             

                            It's a bit hard to diagnose an issue when there's a moving target.

                             

                            Can you describe exactly what you did between those two images?  Perhaps the problems you're seeing with differences are because of something you're inadvertently doing.  It crossed my mind that you may be looking at two different images and making the assumption that they should be the same.

                             

                            -Noel

                            • 11. Re: Resolution issue b/w monitors and Internet
                              Noel Carboni Level 8

                              There's one key thing to keep in mind, and I touched on it above by asking what browser(s) you're using:

                               

                              Internet Explorer does not do full color-management.  It IGNORES your monitor profile entirely and ASSUMES the monitor is sRGB.  Thus a difference from what other browsers show on anything other than a monitor calibrated to faithfully display sRGB is to be expected.

                               

                              Put another way, unless you have that special monitor setup (I do), image color will ALWAYS be wrong as shown in Internet Explorer.

                               

                              Microsoft has utterly given up on advancing the state of the art in color-management.

                               

                              -Noel

                              • 12. Re: Resolution issue b/w monitors and Internet
                                D Fosse Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                Never checked the link. They're certainly different:

                                 

                                redgreen27.jpg

                                • 13. Re: Resolution issue b/w monitors and Internet
                                  jackaroe222 Level 1

                                  I processed this photo in several different ways because I kept thinking it wasn't coming out correctly on the Internet.  So the photo I posted here may not be the same version from SmugMug.  When I get home tonight I'll post a side by side comparison of 2 identically processed photos from Firefox and PS.  Thanks for everyone's help, this has been very informative.

                                  • 14. Re: Resolution issue b/w monitors and Internet
                                    D Fosse Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                    What you can do immediately as a quick test is to set sRGB as default monitor profile in Windows (Control Panel > Color Management > Devices. Reboot). This should take the monitor profile out of the equation and hopefully narrow it down. If they're identical then, you know your calibrator is doing something wrong.

                                     

                                    I just want to mention one thing that often passes below the radar: interface color. It can make a huge perceptional difference whether you view it against a dark or a light backdrop, to the point where they can appear to be substantially different. The new default dark PS interface is great for preparing images for web, but it can be a disaster for print.

                                    • 15. Re: Resolution issue b/w monitors and Internet
                                      Lundberg02 Level 3

                                      Has the OP set color management to 1 in about:config in Firefox?

                                      • 16. Re: Resolution issue b/w monitors and Internet
                                        D Fosse Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                        Probably not, and I was planning to bring that up. But it turns out the files in question have an embedded sRGB profile, so Firefox's color management should be working normally.

                                         

                                        Another thing is v4 monitor profiles. I think the Spyders have started to churn out v4 by default, which is not a good idea, support being what it is. V4 support has to be manually enabled in Firefox (in fact it's directly above the gfx.color_management.mode setting).

                                        • 17. Re: Resolution issue b/w monitors and Internet
                                          jackaroe222 Level 1

                                          As soon as I got home tonight I calibrated my monitor.  It had been several months since I had done that.  And now the photos look okay in Firefox.  But I don't understand what monitor calibration has to do with the photos looking good in PS, IE and Google Chrome, but not Firefox.  Can someone please explain that?  Thanks for everyone's help.  I wasted several hours working on one photo over and over trying to get it to look correct in Firefox.

                                          • 18. Re: Resolution issue b/w monitors and Internet
                                            D Fosse Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                            It's pretty common with corrupt or broken profiles that they may work in some applications, while others choke on it. It just happens.

                                             

                                            In fact, one of the giveaways for diagnosing a broken display profile, is if color managed applications display differently. Simply because they shouldn't.