16 Replies Latest reply on May 9, 2014 9:29 AM by MW Design

    Frustrated with "available" fonts

    wherearemyfonts

      Folks - along comes cloud that promotes unlimited fonts - well, I work with an ad agency that sends me files and my fonts are now substituted - typekit does not have them.

      Also some of the fonts I do have now dont work in the cloud - I am sorry, but this stuff is BRANDED substitutes are not an option.  I called customer service they took my info and said they'd call back...that was 6 days ago.

      Anyone with me?

        • 1. Re: Frustrated with "available" fonts
          Peter Spier Most Valuable Participant (Moderator)

          I don't believe Adobe promised you unlimited fonts, they said you'd have access to typekit and all the fonts they supply, which are, in my opinion, mostly useless.

           

          Why is the client not packaging the files and including the fonts?

          • 2. Re: Frustrated with "available" fonts
            Frans van der Geest (ACP) Adobe Community Professional
            which are, in my opinion, mostly useless

             

             

            • 3. Re: Frustrated with "available" fonts
              John Mensinger Adobe Community Professional & MVP

              wherearemyfonts wrote:

              ...some of the fonts I do have now dont work in the cloud...

              I can't imagine what that might mean. Fonts work at the OS level. Where is "in the cloud"?

              I called customer service they took my info and said they'd call back...that was 6 days ago.

              It's no surprise they have no idea how to address your complaints. I wouldn't either. You may have a perfectly legitimate gripe, but you haven't communicated it here.

              • 4. Re: Frustrated with "available" fonts
                Steve Werner Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                I'm trying to understand what your relationship with the ad agency is. If you're a freelancer, and you produced a job for the agency using your Typekit fonts, what you need to know is that if you send the file you created to them, the fonts cannot be packaged. The agency, or other people you work with, also have to have access to the Typekit fonts. However, if you produced the job in InDesign CC, they would have to have InDesign CC to open your job. They WOULD have access to the fonts because they would also have a Creative Cloud account, and could download them as needed.

                • 5. Re: Frustrated with "available" fonts
                  rob day Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                  TypeKit was available before CC as a web font server—it serves webfonts on a subscription basis so that a web page's CSS font families aren't limited to system fonts. It's more convenient than embedding webfonts.

                   

                  I've only used Typekit for web projects, but I don't think there's a problem using them for print (if a print version is available) except the delivery is different. Your print provider would have to have a CC or Typekit subscription and they would have to enable your fonts from the typekit page at typekit.com/fonts. You or your provider can't download the Typekit fonts—they become available in your CC type menus when you sync them to your account. So here I've added JAF Facit from my account:

                   

                  Screen Shot 2014-05-08 at 8.00.20 PM.png

                   

                   

                  And it shows a few minutes later in my ID menu, but the font is not in my system and I can't manage it with a font utility or package it with a job:

                   

                  ScreenSnapz002.png

                   

                   

                  So if an agency sends you an ID file with typekit fonts you'll have to log in to your CC account and activate the fonts

                  • 6. Re: Frustrated with "available" fonts
                    rob day Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                    which are, in my opinion, mostly useless.

                     

                    There are about a dozen FontFont pro families—I don't think of Spiekermann and friends as typographic lightweights

                    • 7. Re: Frustrated with "available" fonts
                      Peter Spier Most Valuable Participant (Moderator)

                      A dozen or so out of how many hundred? That meets the definition of "mostly" in my book. I'm sure anyone can find a few fonts they might like to use in Typekit or any other collection, but I think the Adobe Font Folio collection would have been a more useful offering for most users.

                      • 8. Re: Frustrated with "available" fonts
                        rob day Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                        True if you are designing exclusively for print, but I think TypeKit was conceived as a webfont server so if you are designing HTML5 pages it has a lot of value and many of the fonts were designed for screen. Converting fonts into web fonts and getting them to load into a page is a pain in in most cases probably a violation of the license. On the print side I see Typekit as an expansion of the freebies that shipped with CS—you're right hardly a promise of unlimited fonts.

                        • 9. Re: Frustrated with "available" fonts
                          Peter Spier Most Valuable Participant (Moderator)

                          I view it as a one more sign that Adobe is moving away from supporting the print world.

                          • 10. Re: Frustrated with "available" fonts
                            rob day Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                            Or maybe continued support for both—how long is your print feature wishlist?

                            • 11. Re: Frustrated with "available" fonts
                              Peter Spier Most Valuable Participant (Moderator)

                              My own presonal list isn't all that long because I do mostly advertising and don't need to use the pitiful long-doc features that often. But Adobe is moving to the subscription model and can partner with Typekit, why is it they can't offer their own type collection (which costs about $5,000 for the whole shebang last I looked) by subscription too? Maybe it's because they can't find a way to prevent packaging/embedding without reworking them all.

                              • 12. Re: Frustrated with "available" fonts
                                rob day Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                why is it they can't offer their own type collection (which costs about $5,000 for the whole shebang last I looked) by subscription too? Maybe it's because they can't find a way to prevent packaging/embedding without reworking them all.

                                 

                                I think that's where they are headed, but they wouldn't want to include the $5000 library in a $50 per month subscription. I'm sure Adobe and other font vendors would love to make the subscription model work for fonts. There's no sign of the Facit face I enabled in #5 as a file on my system so there's no obvious way I can "lend" it to you—that has to be very appealing to a type designer who spends thousands of hours developing a high-end family.

                                • 13. Re: Frustrated with "available" fonts
                                  MW Design Level 4
                                  There's no sign of the Facit face I enabled in #5 as a file on my system so there's no obvious way I can "lend" it to you—

                                  You could always buy the font

                                  JAF Facit - Desktop font « MyFonts

                                   

                                  —that has to be very appealing to a type designer who spends thousands of hours developing a high-end family.

                                  Hmm. As a type designer, not really. The risk/reward is better selling the fonts. Though I haven't ever looked into the licensing to a place like Typekit, I don't think it would be a viable revenue source. It might be that one day the better option is a Typekit sort of distribution.

                                   

                                  Mike

                                   

                                  (OK, I have to get this out of my system. This is my first post for a while--predating the forum change. I really, really dislike the forum change. While I now successfully stay logged in one day to the next, this thing is painfully slow and disorganized. I most often use my phone to reply to posts. It is nigh unto "impossible" now and it is a massive bandwidth waster. My hat's off to the forum regulars for sticking it out. Even with an improvement in my health, I will be an even more infrequent visitor. OK. I feel a little better now.)



                                  • 14. Re: Frustrated with "available" fonts
                                    Peter Spier Most Valuable Participant (Moderator)

                                    Hey Mike, good to see you back, and I hope you'll give it another shot.

                                     

                                    Yeah this version of Jive is all about social networking and isn't really designed for this type of forum use, but it's all we have right now. If we don't stick around, who's going to help all the users with problems? Phone support?

                                     

                                     

                                     

                                    You can stop laughing now.

                                    • 15. Re: Frustrated with "available" fonts
                                      rob day Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                      You could always buy the font

                                      JAF Facit - Desktop font « MyFonts

                                       

                                      But I have a license to use it via my cloud subscription—I assume FontFont doesn't make their fonts available to Adobe for subscription without some kind of compensation. I can print it and I can PDF it, but I can't copy it and give it away, which I think is a good thing for the designer. It's good for me too–I no longer have an ethical dilemma when a client asks me for copies of the fonts

                                       

                                      Hmm. As a type designer, not really. The risk/reward is better selling the fonts.

                                       

                                      Subscription is more like the new music or app business model—you could sell 10 copies of your software at $100 a copy and watch the buyers give it away, or you can distribute it via subscription for a $1 to 10,000 users who no longer have any incentive to steal the software.

                                      • 16. Re: Frustrated with "available" fonts
                                        MW Design Level 4
                                        Yeah this version of Jive is all about social networking and isn't really designed for this type of forum use, but it's all we have right now. If we don't stick around, who's going to help all the users with problems? Phone support?

                                        Hah. (There were really more Hahs.)


                                        I think that for a company such as Adobe—and just about all software companies are/have been doing the same—who rely on a forum for actual, real, concrete support of their products to make these kinds of (lack of) usability changes is a bone-headed move. It just has the feel of a twenty-something (or an older wanna-be twenty-something) thinking this is a good, a positive, change. If I ruled the world, I would order a change away from the former Jive software to something that is actually conducive to helping the good people who have the inclination to support "my" products in the most efficient means possible. Efficiency, usability and good design are not mutually exclusive.


                                        Here in the ID forum, if a certain 10-12 people stopped the true and actual support of InDesign by vacating the forum, it would be all but the blind leading the blind. People would be left ferreting out their own issues. And over time a new core would develop. Maybe. Not a very politically correct viewpoint I suppose, but that's never been an attribute of mine.


                                         

                                        But I have a license to use it via my cloud subscription...

                                         

                                        I was half joking about purchasing it. The subscription model for fonts is likely here to stay. But I will still purchase my desktop/web/app fonts for use. Why? I still don't trust the subscription services in general to stay afloat in the long-term.

                                         

                                        ...you could sell 10 copies of your software at $100 a copy and watch the buyers give it away...

                                         

                                        Or get hacked. Ala the day after Adobe went to CC.

                                         

                                        ...or you can distribute it via subscription for a $1 to 10,000 users who no longer have any incentive to steal the software.

                                         

                                        Locks are only a viable means of security designed to keep honest people honest. Apps get ripped off all over the world now. If the monetized font subscription service ever looks enticing to hackers, they'll get and release Typekit et al fonts in the wild too. Cynical? Yep. It's also reality. But if ripped-off fonts are such a hit financially to the foundries, how do they stay in business?


                                        Anyway, I have to get to work. Drawing glyphs for a type foundry that will likely get ripped off one day.