38 Replies Latest reply on Mar 14, 2017 10:08 AM by Laubender

    Master Page Items Moving on Custom-Sized Page

    JustBob Level 1

      Here's an odd one.

       

      I have a calendar with several pages getting a Custom Size for extended flaps.

       

      Every now and then, more often than not, the elements on the master page will unexpectedly center themselves on the custom-sized page. I just noticed that if I create a page above one of these custom sized pages, the master elements on the page below it (which is also a custom size) will shift. This is very frustrating.

       

      Recently, I have been making some pages twice as high so I can create comps to show what the printed calendar will look like. Everything is fine, then BOOM!—the master page elements on some page will move, just like that!

       

      I have never had this issue until this year.

       

      I will upload a page that just shifted. Check it out, please! Everything was fine, and now, without explanation, some elements on the master shifted and this page is unusable!

       

      Screen Shot 2014-05-15 at 10.39.17 PM.png

        • 1. Re: Master Page Items Moving on Custom-Sized Page
          JustBob Level 1

          Update: I deleted InDesign Defaults preferences and Saved Date files. The issue persists. Then, I held down Command-Option-Control-Shift and clicked to delete Preferences. Same problem. Finally, I saved the document as an idml file and opened it in InDesign CC. No good. Moving any page within the file causes some paster page items, that are applied to a page that has a custom size, to shift. This is beyond maddening…It is beginning to appear as if I cannot use custom sizes, any more.

          • 2. Re: Master Page Items Moving on Custom-Sized Page
            Willi Adelberger Most Valuable Participant

            Did you resize the page with the page tool, or di you change the size with document set up?

            • 3. Re: Master Page Items Moving on Custom-Sized Page
              JustBob Level 1

              I resized the page with the Page Tool, as I have done many times in the past.

               

              I also click the Reference Point icon in the tool bar to add extra space below (or above) the page, not resizing from the center. This leaves items on the Master Page in their correct position, relative to the space that has been added for the flap.

               

              But now, most every time another page is dragged to a new position in the Pages panel, the Master Page items on the re-sized page shift, maybe centering themselves on the new-resized page, as if the Reference Point were initially clicked in the center position when the page was resized, though I have not checked to see if the Master Page items are truly in that position. As you can see in the screen shot, many things have shifted, but it is hard to tell if there is any rhyme or reason.

              • 4. Re: Master Page Items Moving on Custom-Sized Page
                Willi Adelberger Most Valuable Participant

                I recommend to use the page tool only if you have pages with different sizes in your document. Because it messes up a lot of automatism like layout adjustment and breaks the link to the document set up.

                When you resize with the page tool, you have a symbol a square with 9 smaller squares, there you can define your fix point.

                And when you select the page tool, you can play araound what happens if you will change the page size, it is—as long as you don't hold down the alt key—only temporarily.

                • 5. Re: Master Page Items Moving on Custom-Sized Page
                  JustBob Level 1

                  I was only using the page tool to extend the bottom of a few calendar pages to account for a 2" flap that some commercial customers can buy. This has been a big benefit for me as I could keep all of the pages in the same document. It has worked fine for me since it's introduction until just now.

                   

                  I did use the 9-point square symbol when resizing with the page tool, as mentioned.

                   

                  I might note that elements shift on pages that were resized last year, as well as pages resized just recently. All of the resized pages from last year have had elements shifted, making them useless.

                   

                  Bob

                  • 6. Re: Master Page Items Moving on Custom-Sized Page
                    Willi Adelberger Most Valuable Participant

                    Would it work, if you turn OFF layout adjustment?

                    • 7. Re: Master Page Items Moving on Custom-Sized Page
                      JustBob Level 1

                      Layout Adjustment, in the Layout >  Margins and Columns dialog box? It is not checked.

                       

                      I just tried a very simple experiment:

                       

                      1) Create a new ID file, 12" x 12" (uncheck Facing Pages).

                       

                      2) On the Master Page, create a box the size of the margins with a 1 pt rule. (This is the box that will shift, and I created mine 3 picas from all edges so it is easy to see the shift.

                       

                      3) In the Pages Panel, Duplicate Page one by Option-Dragging it. You now have two pages.

                       

                      4) On Page 1, click the Page Tool. The Page Adjust thing-a-ma-jig appears with nine handles. Ignore that. In the Options Bar, click the top-center square so the page will extend down, then add 2" to the Height.

                       

                      5) Now, swap Page 1 and Page 2 in the Pages Panel. Bingo! The rule on the master page is now centered on the extended page! It has never been this way. Sounds to me like a bug in the current version of InDesign, unless it is only happening on my system (even so, it may still be a bug if there is some kind of conflict).

                      • 8. Re: Master Page Items Moving on Custom-Sized Page
                        utopastac

                        This issue has made InDesign unusable for me in my current workflow - it's infuriating.

                        • 9. Re: Master Page Items Moving on Custom-Sized Page
                          rajsre Adobe Employee

                          By the given steps: a regular page has been resized and there is no corresponding master page of that page size (customization has been done by entering values in control panel).

                          The shuffle caused the master to reapply (the master is however not matching with the regular page size)

                          To resolve this, is it possible to adopt a workaround as follows:

                          1. Since you resized a regular page to a custom size and there is no corresponding master of that size, make a separate master for it instantly

                              (Shortcut for this: Just drag drop the resized regular page to master page section of the Pages panel to create a master from it. Delete unwanted elements from this master. Your new master is ready)

                          2. Apply the newly created master to the resized regular page (no shift should happen now because page sizes are matching)

                          3. Now try shuffling/swapping pages as you did in your step (5)

                          • 10. Re: Master Page Items Moving on Custom-Sized Page
                            JustBob Level 1

                            Rajsre: As you are staff, is Adobe admitting this is a bug? Any chance of getting it fixed?

                             

                            I have had to use your work-around, but this is not the way it should be!

                            • 11. Re: Master Page Items Moving on Custom-Sized Page
                              rajsre Adobe Employee

                              It is a bug in my view. It has already been reported too, but could not get a high priority fix in this release. I will revive it based on this posting. Thank you very much for highlighting it. The already reported problem is that for uneven/multiple page size documents master items dislocate on regular pages after page shuffles.

                              • 12. Re: Master Page Items Moving on Custom-Sized Page
                                francoischay

                                is there any way of being notified ?

                                I'm working on several alternate layouts for digital projects and nearly all my pages have differents heights.

                                This update has made InDesign nearly impossible to use

                                • 13. Re: Master Page Items Moving on Custom-Sized Page
                                  Bensonn

                                  Thank you so much for this workaround! This issue has been driving me crazy of late.

                                   

                                  I'd like to add another call for this to be fixed. We are using InDesign for creation of web & mobile wireframes within our agency in an effort to  streamline handoff to designers. I have been creating masters of standard screen sizes, then extending them as needed to fit content on subsequent screens. This bug has been creating a lot of extra work. Again, I'm really happy to at least find a work-around for now, but I hope the fix can be worked into an upcoming release.

                                   

                                  Thank you.

                                  • 14. Re: Master Page Items Moving on Custom-Sized Page
                                    mikescopino

                                    I am going to try this workaround now and I hope for the best in regards to my workflow. Similar to other posters, this bug has really become a disaster since recently upgrading from CS5 to CC.

                                    • 15. Re: Master Page Items Moving on Custom-Sized Page
                                      Willi Adelberger Most Valuable Participant

                                      Can anyone supply to a llink to such a document, so we can examine it and look what the problem is.

                                      • 16. Re: Master Page Items Moving on Custom-Sized Page
                                        mikescopino Level 1

                                        Hi Willi,

                                         

                                        I've created a simple file with descriptions in it on how to reproduce the bug. You can download it here: Dropbox - Maste Page Item Bug.indd

                                         

                                        Thanks,

                                        Mike

                                        • 17. Re: Master Page Items Moving on Custom-Sized Page
                                          JustBob Level 1

                                          Excellent example, Nonfiction! I'd like to add that it doesn't matter if the file uses liquid layout or pinned objects or not. I thought the problem was fixed with the latest, but sadly, it is not. This problem is at least 1.5 years, and maybe 2 years, old!

                                          • 18. Re: Master Page Items Moving on Custom-Sized Page
                                            Laubender Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                            Hi Mike,

                                            I can confirm all this. Just downloaded your InDesign document and tested with InDesign CC-2014.2.

                                            If I duplicate page 1 the two text frames applied with Master A will shift. On page 1 and on page 2 (the duplicate) !!

                                             

                                            Exporting to IDML and open the IDML in InDesign CS5.5 is not showing the problem.

                                            Also opening the IDML and procede in CS6 v8.1.0 by duplicating page 1 will not show the bug.

                                             

                                            The problem begins with InDesign CC v9.3.0.

                                             

                                            Uwe

                                            • 19. Re: Master Page Items Moving on Custom-Sized Page
                                              taco d o

                                              Just want to add myself to the list. This is a really irritating bug, especially when using InDesign for web design (for which it is otherwise brilliant), where every other page is a different height. I'm ending up with as many master pages as normal pages!

                                              Please fix!

                                               

                                              thanks

                                              t

                                              • 20. Re: Master Page Items Moving on Custom-Sized Page
                                                Spen Level 1

                                                Count me in. Nonfiction's example explains it perfectly.

                                                 

                                                I can't believe this bug hasn't been addressed as it's so fundamental to multi-device design. We also use InDesign for web and app development and it's awesome! but this bug is so frustrating. What's the point in using master pages when you have to create a new master for every page size. I was hoping that CC 2015 would fix the bug but sadly no. In fact it seems slightly worse now as elements in the master page no longer move when moving the master page overlay. The whole thing seems a bit broken.

                                                 

                                                Adobe, please please fix this.

                                                • 21. Re: Master Page Items Moving on Custom-Sized Page
                                                  rob day Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                                  The bug might be (sort of) addressed via scripting.

                                                   

                                                  If you duplicate the page in Nonfiction’s example and then override all of the page's master page items, what you would expect happens—all of the mp items are overridden and their bounds remain unchanged. But if you do it via scripting they move back to where they should be relative to their masters. Now the master page items are overridden but they respond to changes from the master as if they aren't—if you make a x,y bounds change from the master the overridden items on the pages respond.

                                                   

                                                  Here's an AppleScript. Go to and make the A-Master active before running:

                                                   

                                                  tell application "Adobe InDesign CC 2014"

                                                      set apage to active spread of active window

                                                      if class of apage is not master spread then

                                                          display dialog "Please View a Master Spread and Try Again"

                                                      end if

                                                   

                                                      tell active document

                                                          set ps to every page of every spread whose applied master is apage

                                                          repeat with p in ps

                                                              set mpis to master page items of p

                                                              repeat with x in mpis

                                                                  override x destination page p

                                                              end repeat

                                                          end repeat

                                                      end tell

                                                  end tell

                                                  • 22. Re: Master Page Items Moving on Custom-Sized Page
                                                    Spen Level 1

                                                    Thanks for the script Rob,

                                                     

                                                    It works. As you mentioned it's not perfect but it does (sort of) solve the problem.

                                                     

                                                    The only issue I can see is that the master page items are (semi) overridden after running the script. This means any text changes or additional elements added to the master page item will not be picked up in the document pages. Basic properties like x,y positions, height and color are picked up which is really cool. I guess one way to get around this would be to create a separate document for the master page items and link to it from the master page. This way you would only be using the script for the x,y positioning, not the more granular control of the master page item.


                                                    Also (correct me if I'm wrong) but this script does not rely on any liquid layout rules. It has nothing to do with liquid layouts.


                                                    Re. running the script, I opened your script in Apple Script Editor and I'm running it from there each time I add a new page. Is this the best way to do it?


                                                    Thanks again for your help.



                                                    • 23. Re: Master Page Items Moving on Custom-Sized Page
                                                      rob day Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                                      You can run the script from the InDesign scripts panel if you save it (in Script format) to your scripts folder /Applications/Adobe InDesign CC 2015/Scripts/Scripts Panel. You can assign key command to scripts.

                                                       

                                                      I have not spent anytime looking at the bug, I just realized that overriding via a script produced a different result than overriding via the GUI, so you'll want to test it on some more complex docs and make sure there are no problems.

                                                       

                                                      This means any text changes or additional elements added to the master page item will not be picked up in the document pages. Basic properties like x,y positions, height and color are picked up which is really cool.

                                                       

                                                      You should be able to run the script multiple times—that's working for me in my limited testing. So if you add a new item to the MP, just run the script again.

                                                       

                                                      Text changes are more problematic. It would be possible to add some lines to the script that would update a text change, but it would also clear any overrides plus text changes on the pages that were meant to be exceptions. So I think it would be better to address that problem with another script.

                                                       

                                                      Select the text frame on the master that's been edited and run this script:

                                                       

                                                      ----------------------------------------------------

                                                      tell application "Adobe InDesign CC 2014"

                                                         

                                                          --make sure there is a selection

                                                          if selection is {} then

                                                              display dialog "Please Select a Master Page item"

                                                              return

                                                          end if

                                                          set s to object reference of selection

                                                         

                                                          --make sure it's a master page

                                                          set apage to active spread of active window

                                                          if class of apage is master spread then

                                                              tell active document

                                                                  set ps to every page of every spread whose applied master is apage

                                                                  repeat with p in ps

                                                                      set pis to all page items of p

                                                                     

                                                                      --reset the master page item

                                                                      repeat with x in pis

                                                                          set ompi to overridden master page item of x

                                                                          if overridden master page item of x is s then

                                                                              remove override of x

                                                                          end if

                                                                      end repeat

                                                                      --override again for custom pagesize bug

                                                                      override s destination page p

                                                                  end repeat

                                                              end tell

                                                          else

                                                              display dialog "Please Select a Master Page item"

                                                              return

                                                          end if

                                                      end tell

                                                      • 24. Re: Master Page Items Moving on Custom-Sized Page
                                                        rob day Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                                        Here are both scripts compiled in a zip archive:

                                                         

                                                        http://www.zenodesign.com/forum/CustomPageBug.zip

                                                        • 25. Re: Master Page Items Moving on Custom-Sized Page
                                                          Spen Level 1

                                                          Thanks Rob,

                                                           

                                                          Strange all of a sudden I'm getting an error and InDesign is crashing when I run the script. The script works fine on other documents so I've obviously done something to this file that's causing it to crash.

                                                          Screen Shot 2015-07-24 at 1.08.54 pm.png

                                                          • 26. Re: Master Page Items Moving on Custom-Sized Page
                                                            rob day Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                                            The 609 error is a OSX error, so there's probably nothing I can do about in the script. I assume you've tried running it from the scripts panel? Also, is the file local or on a server?

                                                            • 27. Re: Master Page Items Moving on Custom-Sized Page
                                                              jdbanana Level 1

                                                              Just chiming in here. It's now October 12th and imagine my joy and surprise at discovering the ever-shifting master page items! Doubly strange to me, because I picked up a document that worked perfectly last year. Symptoms are exactly as described by other users. Interestingly enough, if you shift from Normal view to Prevew, the master page elements that have been applied to document pages show correctly - - it is only in Normal view that they re-center and seem to base their edges on a non-custom page size.

                                                               

                                                              Obviously Adobe knows about this problem. Why it is not considered a priority to solve is beyond me. Using Master Pages is one of the most basic functions of a design program. So here's my vote for escalation of the problem.

                                                               

                                                              My lazy-boy workaround is to override master page elements, and deal with the consequences. Onward. For reference, I am using fully updated CC 2015.

                                                              • 28. Re: Master Page Items Moving on Custom-Sized Page
                                                                jdbanana Level 1

                                                                Hey one more thing. I seem to have fixed this problem by selecting a master page, and then right-clicking (command-click) to bring up the menu. I selected "override all master page items" even though this seems completely counter-intuitive.

                                                                 

                                                                Suddenly all is well. Go figure.

                                                                • 29. Re: Master Page Items Moving on Custom-Sized Page
                                                                  Daz1

                                                                  Its now November the 18th 2015, any sign that this irritating bug is going to get a fix?

                                                                  Thought I had better put the year in my post incase it drags on for another year or 2 or 3 or ...

                                                                  • 30. Re: Master Page Items Moving on Custom-Sized Page
                                                                    ah62321523

                                                                    Please raise the priority of this issue. I work on web pages and am constantly changing the size of pages. Its not practical to make masters of so many sizes. I use masters for the page headers . This broken thing is a nightmare.

                                                                    thanks

                                                                    • 31. Re: Master Page Items Moving on Custom-Sized Page
                                                                      ulfnotulf

                                                                      Can this issue please be fixed soon? I have been using Indesign for Web- and App-UI-Design for ages, and the current version is not usable. This contradicts the concept of a Master Page. Thanks.

                                                                      • 32. Re: Master Page Items Moving on Custom-Sized Page
                                                                        Laubender Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                                                        Hi ulfnotulf,

                                                                        I can only confirm this bug and that it's a known bug for the developers.
                                                                        Please write a bug report and send it over to Adobe to make fixing this issue more pressing.

                                                                         

                                                                        Use the following form:

                                                                        Wishform - Adobe InDesign

                                                                         

                                                                        Uwe

                                                                        • 33. Re: Master Page Items Moving on Custom-Sized Page
                                                                          brandyb36057982

                                                                          I submitted a bug report, but it would be helpful if we could see the existing report and upvote it somehow - and also follow its progress.

                                                                          • 34. Re: Master Page Items Moving on Custom-Sized Page
                                                                            bekalekah

                                                                            I also have this aggravating problem. I submitted a bug.

                                                                            • 35. Re: Master Page Items Moving on Custom-Sized Page
                                                                              dhobanpskw

                                                                              March 13, 2017 bug still exists! Needs to be fixed ASAP if indesign wants to be competitive in web design.

                                                                              • 36. Re: Master Page Items Moving on Custom-Sized Page
                                                                                Laubender Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                                                                Hi together,

                                                                                 

                                                                                yes. I can confirm this bug is still there.
                                                                                I can see it with: CC 9.3.0 , CC 2014.2 , CC 2015.4.1.102 and CC 2017 12.0.0.81.

                                                                                 

                                                                                And I cannot see the bug with CS6 8.1.0 on Mac OSX 10.10.5.

                                                                                 

                                                                                Regards,
                                                                                Uwe

                                                                                • 37. Re: Master Page Items Moving on Custom-Sized Page
                                                                                  rob day Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                                                                  Uwe, I'm looking at the script I posted in #21 & 23 using CC2014, and it looks like it could be simplified.

                                                                                   

                                                                                  In my tests I only see a problem with master page items that have not been overridden. If I override a master page item before moving the page it stays in place. If I move the page without overriding first, overriding after the move keeps the MP item in the wrong position. But if I override via scripting after the move, the overridden MP item moves to its correct position, so there's something about the GUI that's part of this bug.

                                                                                   

                                                                                  So the simplified script could be something like this, which you would run after moving the custom sized page via a key command:

                                                                                   

                                                                                  -------------------------------------------------

                                                                                  --select the page to fix in the pages panel and run script

                                                                                  tell application "Adobe InDesign CC 2014"

                                                                                      set p to active page of active window

                                                                                      set mpi to master page items of p

                                                                                      repeat with x in mpi

                                                                                          set a to override x destination page p

                                                                                      end repeat

                                                                                    

                                                                                      --refreshes the preview

                                                                                      set screen mode of active window to preview to page

                                                                                      set screen mode of active window to preview off

                                                                                  end tell

                                                                                  • 38. Re: Master Page Items Moving on Custom-Sized Page
                                                                                    Laubender Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                                                                    Hi Rob,

                                                                                     

                                                                                    and one would run the script best on the page before one likes to duplicate it.
                                                                                    Otherwise you'd have to run the script on the original page as well.

                                                                                    And not only on the dup.

                                                                                     

                                                                                    Regards,
                                                                                    Uwe