21 Replies Latest reply: Aug 4, 2014 3:29 PM by Jacob Bugge RSS

    Could you give some advice on creating a logo?

    nvbnvbnvb Community Member

      Hi!

       

      I wonder if anyone would have a moment to give me a few pointers... I'm a competent amateur photoshop user with a good background in design, and I'm about to create the branding, website and brochure for a small company I'm starting up with my partner. For now I'll just be creating the website using wordpress, weeble or similar as I don't have access to dreamweaver or muse and want to keep the whole process simple to start with.

       

      I'm about to create the logo which I will then use on the website, to create headed paper (for invoices, letters etc), in our brochure, in email signatures, etc. My question is, in what format should I create the logo? If make it as a vector will it size up and down for any purpose? Or will I need both a vector and image version, and if so which should I use where? I'm most proficient with photoshop but I do have illustrator too, though I'm considerably slower using it.

       

      Thanks in advance!

        • 1. Re: Could you give some advice on creating a logo?
          MichaelKazlow CommunityMVP

          Vectors will scale to any size you need. They are described by a mathematical formula. That is their reason for existence. You can convert to raster image when the need occurs. That is not to say that you cannot get a better reproduction for an image designed for a given size and dpi or ppi using a raster image, but the moment you change the ppi or dpi or size of the graphic you will be better off with the vector image.

          • 2. Re: Could you give some advice on creating a logo?
            Jacob Bugge CommunityMVP

            Jenny,

             

            In addition to what Michael said, you may use Illustrator (or a similar application), and you should consider whether you are having things printed by a printing company (using CMYK) or you are having them printed on office printers (more likely from what I gather).

             

            In the former case, you may consider creating the artwork using CMYK colours for greatest possible colour consistency. In the latter case, you are (probably) better served with RGB colours. In Illustrator this is called Document Color Mode. CMYK colours are inherently duller than RGB colours, so if you have the best/brightest web version as top priority, you should use RGB in any case, knowing that the printed stuff will be a duller representation, unless you have (access to) a special printer that has more colours than CMYK; in this case, RGB is also the obvious choice.

             

            Apart from that, you may consider creating the artwork with points/pixels as the unit, and set it at the largest planned size in pixels. This is especially important for crispness of non photo raster images such as PNG24 (which is better than PNG8 and GIF): when you create the artwork for web and similar, it is important that you fill whole pixels to the highest possible degree.

             

            Illustrator actually has pixels as a unit identical to a point and equalling 1/72 of an inch, which may be a bit confusing until you get used to it.

             

            For actual logo, and other artwork, creation in Illustrator, you may ask in this forum:

             

            Illustrator

            • 3. Re: Could you give some advice on creating a logo?
              jdanek Community Member

              First of all, you should design for print first and web second.  You are in a good position to learn more about Illustrator and its use in creating logos and stationery because you know Photoshop.  When I design a logo, I start with pencils using tissue paper to develope ( that's right, I spell develope with an "e" at the end ) sketches of conceptual ideas.  Then, I present 3 polished pencils for approval(s).  It's not until I get approval on the pencils will I create the artwork in Illustrator after I've discused color with the client.  Working in CMYK document color mode is important, but that doesn't mean you have to use CMYK Process Colors.  Instead, you should be creating the logo in "Spot" color(s).  Only then can you create an optional logo version in Process Color equivalents.  This should be outlined in a "Branding" Guide, where you can also display the logo in Black and White and Grayscale versions.  Once you have established the "Brand" identity ( or logo ), then you can move on to web by creating a web version using hex code color to match the spot version via "Save-For-Web" in Illustrator.  What you save it as depends on the logo itself.  All stationery elements can be created using Illustrator.  If you need to learn more about Illustrator, you should look for an evening course at a local college for a program in Illustrator.  I have recommended this because you will meet other people in your situation who can help you, as well as the instructor.

              • 4. Re: Could you give some advice on creating a logo?
                OldBob1957 Community Member

                In the dusty, musty, archived bowels of these fora dwells an old thread on that very subject. It is a bit lengthy, but has much good advice, and is well worth the reading.

                 

                BLUDVLZ's Logo Manifesto

                 

                --OB

                • 5. Re: Could you give some advice on creating a logo?
                  nvbnvbnvb Community Member

                  Thanks guys, that's really helpful!

                   

                  I'm still really struggling with the vector drawing aspect of the logo, due partly to a lack of experience and partly due to my software being old and outdated.

                   

                  Would anyone here be able to create a useable vector file for me to have ownership over, if I provide a low res b&w JPEG of what I'm trying to create? No design work needed but my wobbly sketch would certainly need cleaning up. Do please give me a quote if it's something you can help with!

                  • 6. Re: Could you give some advice on creating a logo?
                    Jacob Bugge CommunityMVP

                    Jenny,

                     

                    I'm still really struggling with the vector drawing aspect of the logo, due partly to a lack of experience and partly due to my software being old and outdated.

                     

                    Since a logo is presumably relatively simple (meant to catch the eye at first glance), I doubt whether your software can be that outdated. If you have Illustrator (maybe in one of the versions where you can still see her face), you may ask for suggestions over here:

                     

                    Illustrator

                    • 7. Re: Could you give some advice on creating a logo?
                      nvbnvbnvb Community Member

                      I have illustrator 10, so the auto trace function is a very early version, and the photoshop file gets very pixellated when I export over.

                       

                      I'm getting used to the pen tool in Photoshop, and worked out how to convert font to vectors, so may yet have some luck there!

                      • 8. Re: Could you give some advice on creating a logo?
                        jdanek Community Member

                        Find a way to connect with me off-the-list and I will help you ( send the file using a third party transfer method and then post a link to it that includes your e-mail ).  Illustrator's Pen tool is similar to Photoshop's.  I find it more efficient to just draw using Illustrator's tools than doing a trace.  Everyone is differrent.  The version of Illustrator is pretty much irrelevant.  You could create the logo in Illustrator 6.0.

                        • 9. Re: Could you give some advice on creating a logo?
                          Jacob Bugge CommunityMVP

                          Jenny,

                           

                          Whatever you do, forget about Auto/Live/Image Trace for a logo.

                           

                          And 10 the the last version where you can see her face.

                          • 10. Re: Could you give some advice on creating a logo?
                            nvbnvbnvb Community Member

                            Thanks again for everything! I've persevered and with the tips here and a few online tutorials I've managed to create what I was after in illustrator. A last question - what format should I save it in for use on a website, email signature, and printed material?

                            • 11. Re: Could you give some advice on creating a logo?
                              Jacob Bugge CommunityMVP

                              Jenny,

                               

                              • PDF (CMYK) for PostScript printing as vector artwork,
                              • PNG24 (inherently RGB) for crispness for web, email, and the like (screen/monitor), and quite possibly also for insertion in colour in word processing applications in connexion with documents printed on non PostScript printer(s),

                               

                              Possibly others, possibly including

                               

                              • TIFF for possible insertion in colour in word processing applications in connexion with documents printed on non PostScript printer(s).
                              • 12. Re: Could you give some advice on creating a logo?
                                jdanek Community Member

                                It's going to be difficult for anyone to recommend what to save the file as for specific applications without actually seeing the file.  Assuming you have a vector file now, you will want to retain a "live" file in .ai format that includes any layers and/or raster effects ( I sense you probably do not have a complex piece of artwork ). I'd be interested in what you are using for color(s). 

                                • 13. Re: Could you give some advice on creating a logo?
                                  nvbnvbnvb Community Member

                                  Hi again guys,

                                   

                                  It's taken much longer than I expected to figure everything out... But I have a final vector logo, as well as some extra branding created in silhouettes. I'm currently coding a basic HTML email signature but am having trouble getting the logo to look sharp, any tips?

                                   

                                  My logo is text (in vector form) and a small image, with stroke and fill in a single pantone colour. All advice I've found online suggests using GIF for email signatures, but it just looks a little blurry at the edges. I've tried a variety of settings when saving to web, mostly using GIF, Adaptive, No Dither, 64 colours, no Lossy. I've tried both preserving transparency and not, and I've also tried to rasterise the logo before saving to web, setting at Screen 72ppi, Type Optimized (Hinted), based on some advice I found online.

                                   

                                  Fiddling with settings doesn't seem to produce any noticeable change. Also, if I want the logo to appear smaller how do I resize before saving as a GIF? At the moment I'm just grabbing and resealing the vector which I suspect is making things worse..

                                   

                                  Thanks for your patience, and any help would be appreciated!

                                  • 14. Re: Could you give some advice on creating a logo?
                                    Jacob Bugge CommunityMVP

                                    Jenny,

                                     

                                    You may consider PNG24 instead of GIF. If you use GIF, you should set Matte and use a colour identical to the (average) background clour; with Matte set to None or a wrong colour your GIF will look uglier. That issue is avoided with PNG24 which is also much richer in colour.

                                     

                                    With PNG and GIF it is crucial to set the size in pixels by pixels to the exact size that it is being used for, scaling is uglifying.

                                     

                                    There is no need to change the original vector artwork, just set the size in the Image Size window where you can Text or Art Optimize.

                                     

                                    If your optimization is an unsatisfactory compromise (having to choose between Text and Art Optimatized) there is a way out.

                                    • 15. Re: Could you give some advice on creating a logo?
                                      nvbnvbnvb Community Member

                                      Thanks, I'll give this a go tomorrow! I can't see anywhere I can change the size in pixels though, maybe because I'm using illustrator 10?

                                       

                                      If you can bear one more question, I'm making headed paper to use in MS Word at the moment. I have a good tutorial for exporting it as PNG and the setting up correctly in Word, but should I change the format of the vectors in illustrator before exporting the finished item as a PNG? What's the best way to resize the vectors in illustrator I so I can create the composition I want?

                                       

                                      sorry again for the boring questions - know you're really helping and I am getting it done very slowly..!

                                      • 16. Re: Could you give some advice on creating a logo?
                                        Jacob Bugge CommunityMVP

                                        Jenny,

                                         

                                        When you use Save for Web, under the settings you can open Color Table, Image Size, or Layers. When you open Image Size, you can set either Width or Height (or untick Constrain Proportions and set both).

                                         

                                        That is also where you can tick Anti-Alias, to reduce/soften the inevitable pixelation.

                                         

                                        Working with the vector artwork in Illustrator allows you to create things exactly as you want them. You may see your saving/exporting as your attempt to get as close as possible in a raster format. So just create the artwork exactly as you wish to have it for any purpose.

                                        • 17. Re: Could you give some advice on creating a logo?
                                          jdanek Community Member

                                          Do you have "Anti-Aliased Artwork" selected in your Illustrator Preferences?  Sometimes increasing the amount of colors will reduce pixelation going with GIF for web, but like Jacob already suggested, selecting ant-alised artwork will help.  Please post a screen shot of your artwork.  It may benefit you to also consider JPEG, but would depend on the logo itself.

                                           

                                          Word is misery for any type of branded document.  Your artwork is based on Pantone color which will present a shift when placed or inserted into Word.  I find Exporting > RGB > TIFF @ 150ppi @ 100% ( use the PC encoding ) to work, sizing is the only tricky part in Word.  You could Export > CMYK, but Word tends to be RGB based color, so CMYK doesn't hurt or help.  Have you created a Grayscale version as well?  What color are you using for the e-mail signature?  That's my only concern is how the Pantone is converting over to RGB or HEX.

                                          • 18. Re: Could you give some advice on creating a logo?
                                            nvbnvbnvb Community Member

                                            Thanks guys. The PNG24 does look marginally better, and Jacob I appreciate that the image won't look as crisp on the web as the vector does, have lowered my expectations a little! Anti-Aliased was selected everywhere all along, so no change there.

                                             

                                            The colour seems to match ok... I have a B&W vector, I'll get round to grayscaling.

                                             

                                            I agree that exporting to MS Word would not be my first choice either, but my business partner doesn't have any other software on his machine and I don't want to be the only one that can create/edit documents. For now everything has to be zero startup cost - if everything takes off I'll invest in better!

                                            • 19. Re: Could you give some advice on creating a logo?
                                              Jacob Bugge CommunityMVP

                                              For my part you are welcome, Jenny.

                                               

                                              and I don't want to be the only one that can create/edit documents.

                                               

                                              In connexion with Worst, you do have two options: the usual one where you use the logo as an image in the document, and the nicer one where you have the high(er preferably Pantone/CMYK) quality logo (and possibly other things) printed on the paper (from a PDF or AI document) before someone does her/his Worst with it. You may make it nicer even with your normal office printer, at no extra cost.

                                               

                                              Of course, you need to know a bit more what you are doing and be careful  (including using the right paper), to avoid typing over the logo and the like, but you may have a template (first) page where you do it the same way every time. You may have a set of different papers/templates for different purposes.

                                               

                                              Much like in the old days.

                                              • 20. Re: Could you give some advice on creating a logo?
                                                nvbnvbnvb Community Member

                                                Of course, that's very true! In our case however we are rarely going to be printing paperwork at all, but sending invoices, quotes, etc as PDFs. While we start up we'll both be working other jobs too, so we need the flexibility for either of us to be able to create and send these documents as and when - so a Word header and footer will have to do for now. We will be printing a product brochure, and also a final 'travel pack' for each client (we're an education based travel company) - it will be my job to put these together in which case I definitely won't be using Word!

                                                • 21. Re: Could you give some advice on creating a logo?
                                                  Jacob Bugge CommunityMVP

                                                  Good luck, Jenny. I hope you will soon get over the Worst part.