26 Replies Latest reply on Aug 11, 2014 4:53 AM by rob day

    RGB White showing as Grey.

    Precise Formwork Level 1

      When I go to Overprint Preview: I get - 'The transparency blending space is set to RGB. Oveprint Preview will only preview overprinting that involves spot colors.'

       

      My Colour settings I currently have:

      Custom

      RGM: Monitor RGB - Display

      CMYK: ColorSync CMYK - Generic CMYK Profile

       

      Color Management Policies:

      RGB: Off

      CMYK: Off

       

      In my overprint preview it shows perfectly like this:

      Screen Shot 2014-07-08 at 09.38.32.png

       

      But when I export to pdf I the white is washed out and I get this dirty grey:

       

      Screen Shot 2014-07-08 at 09.40.28.png

       

      Anyone know how to fix this? I do not want to convert to CMYK as the documents are mostly online, however I do sometimes print them.

        • 1. Re: RGB White showing as Grey.
          Eugene Tyson Adobe Community Professional & MVP

          Select the text frame that the white text is in.

           

          Window>Attributes and turn off Overprint.

           

          Plus your colour management policies set to "Off" is a misnomer, as you can't really turn off the colour management - http://indesignsecrets.com/can-you-turn-off-color-mgmt.php

           

          Read the comments also.

          • 2. Re: RGB White showing as Grey.
            Peter Spier Most Valuable Participant (Moderator)

            Do you have Simulate Paper White enabled in Acrobat's output preview? If you do, turn it off.

            • 3. Re: RGB White showing as Grey.
              rob day Adobe Community Professional & MVP

              I do not want to convert to CMYK as the documents are mostly online, however I do sometimes print them.

               

              It's the Export settings that determine whether color will be converted to CMYK, not your Color Settings.

               

              Try using the default North America General Purpose Color Settings, then make a new Web intent document, and Export with the PDF/X-4 preset.

               

              Color Settings:

               

              Screen Shot 2014-07-08 at 8.25.24 AM.png

               

              A Web intent New document will initially set all color and the Transparency Blend space to RGB. If you don't want pixels you can set the rulers to different units later:

               

              Screen Shot 2014-07-08 at 8.26.09 AM.png

               

              Export to PDF/X-4 which will prevent RGB colors from converting to CMYK, and include the correct RGB profile:

               

              Screen Shot 2014-07-08 at 8.34.38 AM.png

              • 4. Re: RGB White showing as Grey.
                Precise Formwork Level 1

                Thanks for your help guys.

                 

                Rob - I don't really have time to go creating new documents as the layouts are complex and we're talking on about thirty documents here in all with different contracts etc and I must've messed around one day with the settings on some of them.

                Also I am using CS 5.5 and when exporting to pdf I only have

                 

                Eugene: My only attribute options are Nonprinting and Overprint Stroke, both have no desired effect.

                 

                Peter: Changed, no desired effect.

                 

                Thank you again for your kind efforts.

                • 5. Re: RGB White showing as Grey.
                  rob day Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                  Rob - I don't really have time to go creating new documents as the layouts are complex and we're talking on about thirty documents here in all with different contracts etc and I must've messed around one day with the settings on some of them.

                  Also I am using CS 5.5 and when exporting to pdf I only have

                   

                  If you really want an all RGB PDF, you would have to make changes to existing documents.

                   

                  •You don't want to use monitor RGB with no assigned profile (your current color settings), so assign sRGB via Edit>Assign Profiles..., or convert to sRGB via Edit>Convert to Profile...

                   

                  •If all of your colors and swatches are RGB then the CMYK profile doesn't come into play, but in general the Generic CMYK profile is useless.

                   

                  •If any of your colors are CMYK and you don't want to take the time to convert them to RGB you can force the conversion of all color to RGB when you export like this:

                   

                  Screen Shot 2014-07-08 at 1.05.14 PM.png

                   

                  • If I take a reading off of your top screen cap the "white" type is actually light gray—around 245|245|245 not 255|255|255

                  • 6. Re: RGB White showing as Grey.
                    Precise Formwork Level 1

                    Thanks Rob, I've tried assigning profile and it does not change.

                     

                    Screen Shot 2014-07-15 at 16.49.09.png

                    When exporting a pdf the only options I have are pictured as above.

                    • 7. Re: RGB White showing as Grey.
                      Frans van der Geest (ACP) Adobe Community Professional

                      That are the options for a Interactive PDF! Use Print PDF to see the options Rob showed.

                      • 8. Re: RGB White showing as Grey.
                        Precise Formwork Level 1

                        Thanks Frans, that works and as pdf 4 the colour is exactly as I desire (thanks Rob).

                         

                        The trouble is with this setting I cannot have hyperlinks etc... How can I get these colours to export properly?

                         

                        If it works fine with some of the other documents, it must be possible to get this one to work properly.

                        • 9. Re: RGB White showing as Grey.
                          rob day Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                          If it works fine with some of the other documents, it must be possible to get this one to work properly.

                          If you are going to export to interactive PDF try converting the original to sRGB—Edit>Convert to Profile, not Edit>Assign Profile. If you are placing Photoshop files that were edited in your monitor RGB space do the same in PS.

                          • 10. Re: RGB White showing as Grey.
                            Precise Formwork Level 1

                            Thanks Rob,

                             

                            I've tried copy and pasting the original text into a new document with your recommeded sRGB setting. When embedding this text unfortunately it embeds the color profile too, which obviously now fixes nothing. I get the warning:

                            'The document's embedded color profile does not match the current RGB working space. The current RGB color management policy is to discard profiles that do not match the working space.

                            Embedded: Display

                            Working: sRGV IEC61966-2.1.

                             

                            Thanks for any guidance, this is obviously a bit of a serious problem with Indesign.

                            • 11. Re: RGB White showing as Grey.
                              rob day Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                              Could you screen capture and post the warning dialogs?

                              • 13. Re: RGB White showing as Grey.
                                rob day Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                This is the dialog you get when you open one of your older ID files that you created with the RGB policy set to Off right?

                                 

                                Before you open a files with the wrong policy and profiles set your Color Settings to this:

                                 

                                Screen Shot 2014-08-08 at 8.37.07 AM.png

                                With the Ask When check boxes checked you should get this when you open an older file, which will give you the option to convert the color to sRGB and change the Off policy:

                                 

                                Screen Shot 2014-08-08 at 8.37.54 AM.png

                                • 14. Re: RGB White showing as Grey.
                                  Precise Formwork Level 1

                                  Thanks Rob, you've gone through a lot of effort here.

                                   

                                  I've done everything suggested, nothing works. Tried a couple different variations of this, keeping edited assignments etc... all results in unwanted grey text outputted as pdf.

                                  • 15. Re: RGB White showing as Grey.
                                    rob day Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                    I assume the artwork is an image file? If you open it in Photoshop what's its color mode?

                                    • 16. Re: RGB White showing as Grey.
                                      Precise Formwork Level 1

                                      I created it in Illustrator, the artwork is not the problem, as in the file 'Letterhead.indd' (video it's attached to my stack on the bottom right) exports fine, until I copy and paste from the other file. I'm positive the problem is not the artwork.

                                      • 17. Re: RGB White showing as Grey.
                                        rob day Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                        I created it in Illustrator, the artwork is not the problem

                                         

                                        You are making a color conversion to sRGB when you export to an interactive PDF, so the color mode, transparency, and color profile that is or isn't embedded in the AI file would matter.

                                        • 18. Re: RGB White showing as Grey.
                                          rob day Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                          Open the illustration in Illustrator. What's the document Color Mode (Edit>Document Color Mode)? What's the profile assignment (Edit>Assign Profile...)?

                                          • 19. Re: RGB White showing as Grey.
                                            Precise Formwork Level 1

                                            When I export the document prior to pasting in the text it exports fine, colours as I want so the artwork cannot be the problem or it would fail to export.

                                             

                                            It is when pasting in the text from the other document, then exporting problems occur.

                                             

                                             

                                            In Illusrator the settings are the below, however if there was a problem I do not see the above being able to work properly. Thanks

                                            Screen Shot 2014-08-09 at 15.52.04.png

                                            • 20. Re: RGB White showing as Grey.
                                              rob day Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                              I wasn't asking for the Color Settings. I want to confirm that the document color mode is CMYK (Edit>Document Color Mode) and I  want to know if there's a profile assignment (Edit>Assign Profile...). Both might have an impact when you open the ID doc and attempt to make policy and assignment changes.

                                               

                                              Also what's the Transparency Blend space of your ID doc?

                                               

                                              I can understand your frustration but your original color workflow—color policies set to Off, no profile assignments, and the Generic CMYK and Display RGB working spaces is a real problem and pretty much opposite of best practice. Color policies and color assignments get saved with the document on creation, so it can be hard to get documents created this way right. If you would like to post the problem files I can take a look—include the AI file.

                                              • 21. Re: RGB White showing as Grey.
                                                Precise Formwork Level 1

                                                Thanks, menu is file > document color mode and is set to RGB.

                                                 

                                                Transparency blend mode ID is document RGB.

                                                 

                                                Here is a link to the files;

                                                Thanks for help, if you export working letterhead indesign file thie exports a pdf fine.

                                                When pasting in text (select all) from Problem File, then try to export the problem occurrs.

                                                 

                                                Sorry I had to upload to my website, as file handling is quite poor on this forum.

                                                Many thanks

                                                • 22. Re: RGB White showing as Grey.
                                                  rob day Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                                  Thanks, menu is file > document color mode and is set to RGB.

                                                   

                                                  The AI file you posted is CMYK:

                                                   

                                                  ScreenSnapz001.png

                                                   

                                                  I think the problem is that all interactive PDFs have their color converted into sRGB, and because you have a mix of color spaces and missing profiles the conversion to sRGB on export is variable.

                                                   

                                                  Converting the AI file to sRGB should solve the problem—I would save a copy of the original.

                                                   

                                                  Make sure you Illustrator Color Settings' RGB Working space is sRGB:

                                                   

                                                  Screen Shot 2014-08-10 at 11.30.30 AM.png

                                                   

                                                  Set the AI Document Color Mode to RGB, which will convert all color to sRGB.

                                                   

                                                  Resave the file and check Embed ICC Profiles

                                                   

                                                  Update or relink to the RGB file in ID and make sure ID's RGB Working Space is also sRGB, then try the export.

                                                   

                                                  I can't really test here without your problem ID files, but if the above doesn't work post them.

                                                  • 23. Re: RGB White showing as Grey.
                                                    Precise Formwork Level 1

                                                    'I can't really test here without your problem ID files'

                                                     

                                                    All three files are on the link.

                                                    • 24. Re: RGB White showing as Grey.
                                                      rob day Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                                      I'm not seeing the problem here.

                                                       

                                                      Here from left the Letter file unchanged exported to interactive, the letter with pasted text from the problem file exported, and the Letter in ID:

                                                       

                                                      Screen Shot 2014-08-10 at 3.22.08 PM.png

                                                       

                                                      Where are you looking at the PDFs? If you are looking at them in AcrobatPro with Output Preview turned on the simulation profile would change the preview—set it to sRGB.

                                                       

                                                      Do you see the problem in Acrobat Reader?

                                                      • 25. Re: RGB White showing as Grey.
                                                        Precise Formwork Level 1

                                                        I was previewing in Apple Preview, how strange, put it into Acrobat Pro and it's fine.

                                                         

                                                        Don't understand why it was fine with some, and not with others. Just looked at the preferences in Preview and there don't seem to be many options to change the output preview.

                                                         

                                                        Thanks for your perseverance on this Rob, you've put a massive amount of work in; really appreciate it.

                                                         

                                                        It has dawned on me how little I know about colour preferences in ID.

                                                        • 26. Re: RGB White showing as Grey.
                                                          rob day Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                                          I think Preview can have trouble with live transparency. If it's important to you to have more consistency in different PDF readers, you could try and flatten the letterhead art. Save a copy of the letterhead art as PDF out of Illustrator using the PDF/X-1a preset and see if that works.