13 Replies Latest reply: Aug 13, 2015 2:19 AM by davidh443993 RSS

    BWF batch converting - radio station problem workflow. Media Encoder bug

    holden driver Community Member

      Hi all,

       

      I just thought I'd share a problem I've had, and it's more of a workflow issue, even with the latest version of CC.

       

      Audition can open BWFs from RCS software ( Master Control, Selector/Linker, Zetta) fine, which is great. I can then save the files as a batch to MP3 to 320k etc.

       

      The problem that I'm experiencing is a bad workflow. If I want to convert 1500 files, I have to load 1500 files in to Audition, and then sit and wait for them to be batch converted.

      I thought there has to be a better way. So I decided to try the same thing in Media Encoder, but the program doesn't support BWF...

       

      I find this a little strange.

       

      In the next release, can you make Media Encoder support the same file formats as Audition?

       

      Thanks,

      Steve

        • 1. Re: BWF batch converting - radio station problem workflow. Media Encoder bug
          holden driver Community Member

          Oh, I did however have to go to another piece of Mac software that does the job beautifully and uses all of the threads (8) I have available.

           

          Max from sbooth.org

          • 2. Re: BWF batch converting - radio station problem workflow. Media Encoder bug
            ryclark Community Member

            As you have discovered Adobe's Media Encoder mainly majors on video encoding formats but doesn't contain some of the basic professional audio codecs unfortunately.

            • 3. Re: BWF batch converting - radio station problem workflow. Media Encoder bug
              RGTV Community Member

              Just for the record, anyone having this same problem in Windows can find the program "DBPowerAmp" which does a great job of batch converting audio files to a variety of formats.

              • 4. Re: BWF batch converting - radio station problem workflow. Media Encoder bug
                Charles VW Adobe Employee

                AME should be able to support BWF.  Can you post a file that isn't working with AME?

                • 5. Re: BWF batch converting - radio station problem workflow. Media Encoder bug
                  holden driver Community Member

                  Hi Charles, That's what I would have thought too.

                  Here's a link to one of the files.

                  Dropbox - Sidewalk Prophets--Live Like That.wav

                   

                  Just as a bit of background, this file, like thousands of others, are an export from a program called Master Control/Selector from RCS. I believe they are a BWF with a possible mpeg encoding. As mentioned, yes, there is a plugin that DB PowerAmp can  use to decode them, but on a mac - natively at least, this isn't always a good working process.

                   

                  I'll see if the RCS guys can add some more to this thread too.

                  • 6. Re: BWF batch converting - radio station problem workflow. Media Encoder bug
                    Charles VW Adobe Employee

                    So that makes a lot more sense.  The WAV file has MPEG 2 Audio Layer III encoding, which AME doesn't do if it is in a WAV wrapper (it can do it in the raw stream format, however).  Audition on the other hand, can sniff this out and can open the file.

                     

                    The fact that it has BWF METADATA is separate from the codec.  Both AME and Audition support BWF. And Audition even supports the CART chunk metadata that RCS embeds in it.

                     

                    Screen Shot 2014-07-16 at 8.30.27 PM.png

                     

                    As for the Batch Conversion in Audition, what would you want changed to make it better for you?

                    • 7. Re: BWF batch converting - radio station problem workflow. Media Encoder bug
                      holden driver Community Member

                      Hi Charles, Thanks for getting on top of this.

                      It's a weird format I know...

                       

                      The problem I had and would like to see improved I guess would be not to have files actually open in audition in the first place.

                       

                      So I guess, being able to use the Media Browser window in Au, and drop  (for example) 1500 files straight in to the batch window, choose the output format and click convert.

                      At the moment it does this, however audition actually opens the files first. So when it's doing the processing it craps out because it can't load that many items with much success, and this is on a macpro with 20G of Ram.

                      The short few I managed to process for testing worked fast, but when it got to the limit, of open files, it encoded empty files. (if I recall correctly) Short version was, it didn't work properly.

                       

                      Also, it would be nice if it could match input folders too. So if I had a directory with 20 directories in it, and files in them, it would be nice to drop the directory at the top of the tree in, and then when the files are converted, it replicate that tree to a different location.

                      The other thing I'd like to see, and if possible, is to copy or map the metadata from X field to X field. So in this example, take the title and artist and save it in the ID3 tag for an mp3 file.

                       

                      One last thing, as it is related, that could do with a tweak improvement is the save, save as screen, and it's two things, being able to set the default file format, we don't all need wave files all the time, but even if it remembered what we used last would probably be sufficient. But can you change how the diaglogue box is too? If you recall with Audition 3, specifically for presets, you could set the bit rate, file sample rate, format, channels etc all on one screen?

                      I swap formats and export multiple files types for various distribution channels, and it's just a few extra steps and clicks that now have to take place that didn't use to exist.

                       

                      Thanks for listening.

                      Steve

                      • 8. Re: BWF batch converting - radio station problem workflow. Media Encoder bug
                        ryclark Community Member

                        It would be great to be able to save user export presets for both Batch Processing and Save As.

                        • 9. Re: BWF batch converting - radio station problem workflow. Media Encoder bug
                          holden driver Community Member

                          Hi Charles,

                          I just had this reply on an internal RCS forum regarding this from one of their software engineers, thought I'd let you know further details about the audio files. You may find it helpful. Cheers, Steve.

                           

                          If they came from MC and you're having issues opening them with Adobe products, it is probably because they're MP2 (Mpeg 1 Layer 2) files. MC would use either MP2 or Linear Wave audio and in each case they'd be Broadcast Wave Files, which means the audio data is included inside a RIFF wrapper with the broadcast metadata (Cart & Bext chunks).

                           

                          Some apps - including Cool Edit, as Adobe Audition was at the time - would see the .wav extension and RIFF header and assume incorrectly that they were Linear files. The file extension is meant to be irrelevant as the RIFF wrapper describes the format of the audio, so a reading application is supposed to read that and not make assumptions.

                           

                          I am travelling at the moment so don't have access to Adobe Media Encoder, but can you try renaming the files to .mp2 or .mpg extension and see if that works? It always used to work in the old days, convincing Adobe to treat them as Mpeg audio.

                          • 10. Re: BWF batch converting - radio station problem workflow. Media Encoder bug
                            davidh443993 Community Member

                            We use Layer 2 BWF files all the time. Audition CC 2014 opens them just fine. It does however have some problems with files that have been encoded to Layer 2 BWF using dbPoweramp - it chops off the last few hundred milliseconds of the file and throws up an error.

                             

                            Given this could suggest there is a bug in the dbPoweramp encoder I now either save them to .mp2 format in Adobe Audition or using TwoLame, then use a separate utility to wrap them in the RIFF wrapper which has never created the same issue.

                             

                            The problem that the OP was referring to and I have to admit it is a real pain is that if you need to do a batch conversion in Adobe Audition of lets say several thousand files, unless there is something I am missing, you need to open all the files in Audition at the same time then drop them all in the batch convert window. This causes the machine to grind to a snail's pace.

                             

                            Older versions of Audition will open Layer 2 BWF files if you install a Layer 2 ACM codec. Only problem is 32 bit Layer 2 ACM codecs are kicking around but I haven't managed to find a 64 bit one.

                            • 11. Re: BWF batch converting - radio station problem workflow. Media Encoder bug
                              ryclark Community Member

                              You can load files straight into the Batch Process without first having them load into Audition. First open the Batch Process window then either drag and drop the audio files from an external browser or use the Add Files icon to browse for them..

                              • 12. Re: BWF batch converting - radio station problem workflow. Media Encoder bug
                                Charles VW Adobe Employee

                                Furthermore, there are two options that reduce resource load in the Export Settings dialog of the Batch Process panel.  Be sure to check/enable the following:

                                • Remove files from panel upon completion
                                • Close files upon completion

                                Screen Shot 2015-08-12 at 9.54.07 AM.png

                                • 13. Re: BWF batch converting - radio station problem workflow. Media Encoder bug
                                  davidh443993 Community Member

                                  Thanks for this. This was a real gem of a tip. Perhaps they could have made it a little more intitive. When they say "Drag and Drop Supported Files Here" in the middle of the window and hide the Add Files icon up in the corner it is conveivable that you could miss the fact that you can add files without opening them.