7 Replies Latest reply on Jul 31, 2014 4:49 AM by photoyogi

    Color settings :working space adobeRGB but what does  Monitor profile doing?

    photoyogi Level 1

      Recently I was reading at Dry Creek Website concerning Photoshop and  monitor profile in  RGB but it was confusing . It wanted us to make sure we had the correct monitor profile but not ise it as working profle. SO it did not want us to click save

      My monitor is callibrated ,I keep my it at ADOBE RGB ,but wondering where do I check in PS CC to confirm it's playing nice with  monitor profile ?

        • 1. Re: Color settings :working space adobeRGB but what does  Monitor profile doing?
          jdanek Level 4

          Typically, when you calibrate your monitor, you save it using a unique name.  Are you using Windows or Mac?  The monitor profile you named and saved is accessed as the monitor profile.  It is a system based setup.  You set it and forget it.  Photoshop profiles have nothing to do with system based profiles and vice-versa.  You set Adobe RGB as your RGB work space.  It ends there. 

          • 2. Re: Color settings :working space adobeRGB but what does  Monitor profile doing?
            photoyogi Level 1

            From what you said the set up I have is all working ok.

            each time I calibrate the monitor I do name and save the profile with unique name .

            I am on mac.

            When I click on  monitor profile ( which is option in set )  I see my monitor profile name.

            I was trying to trouble shoot  he color differences between the way the photos look on monitor and how they look with soft proof. I am trying to test several labs for fine art prints and found when I soft proof the images are looking different enough to be an issue for my quality control. Really makes for work slow if I have to retouch per lab and medium after retouching the master .

            • 3. Re: Color settings :working space adobeRGB but what does  Monitor profile doing?
              jdanek Level 4

              You already posted this...

               

              "My monitor is callibrated ,I keep my it at ADOBE RGB ,but wondering where do I check in PS CC to confirm it's playing nice with  monitor profile ?"

               

              which sounds confusing to what you are now posting...

               

              "...each time I calibrate the monitor I do name and save the profile with unique name ."

               

              unless you named the monitor profile "adobeRGB.icm" ( which is not unique ) on purpose, you are using a system based profile for your monitor.  I suggest you speak with all of your print vendors and see if tehre is consistency amongst them as to what they require as Photoshop working space.  They cannot control what you do with your monitor.  It is going to require quite a bit of trial and error to establish a satisfactory work flow where you can soft proof ( I don't recommend any type of soft proofing ) and expect consistent results from your print vendor.  For instance, you establish a correct calibration of your monitor and save the profile as "My Crazy Profile.icm".  You then set it in the monitor settings.  In Photoshop, you apply whatever profile the print vendor gives you.  Send that vendor a test file and see what comes back.  It should be satisfactory.  If it isn't, there is a problem with your calibration and settings in Photoshop's Color Settings.

              • 4. Re: Color settings :working space adobeRGB but what does  Monitor profile doing?
                photoyogi Level 1

                I am surprised you suggest NOT to use Soft Proofing.

                 

                Re your comment "I suggest you speak with all of your print vendors and see if there is consistency amongst them as to what they require as Photoshop working space. "


                I have done that . Basic SRGB or RGB depending upon the  equipment. AND they recommend using  their ICC profiles for  soft proofing

                I will callibrate again  review setting again.


                FYI here is quote from  John Paul Caponigro on soft proofing and would like your feed back

                 

                Compare Two Views At Once

                It’s helpful to see a file both before and after it has been softproofed simultaneously. To do this, look at two versions of the same file simultaneously. First, softproof the file. Second, duplicate the file (Image: Duplicate); the duplicate will not be softproofed. Comparing the two versions will help you see how your image will change when printed and how to compensate for these changes with additional output specific adjustments.

                - See more at: http://www.johnpaulcaponigro.com/blog/6862/softproofing/#sthash.AR6mu3GC.dpuf



                Make Output Specific Adjustments

                Soft proofing does not change the file, it simply previews how the appearance of an image will change when printed. Once you see how an image will change when printed, you may decide to adjust the file to compensate for those changes, before printing. You can make a printer/paper specific set of corrections, while a file is being softproofed. Start by making a new Group with the printer/paper combination included in the title. Then create a set of adjustment layers to make the softproofed image match the unsoftproofed image as closely as possible. Typically, midtone contrast is added with Curves (to compensate for dynamic range compression) and Hue/Saturation is used to boost the saturation of in-gamut colors (to compensate for gamut compression). Use these corrections for printing to that specific output condition (printer/ink/paper/profile) only. Turn the layer set off for all other uses of the image.

                • 5. Re: Color settings :working space adobeRGB but what does  Monitor profile doing?
                  jdanek Level 4

                  Here's my feedback...

                   

                  "Compare Two Views At Once

                  It’s helpful to see a file both before and after it has been softproofed simultaneously. To do this, look at two versions of the same file simultaneously. First, softproof the file. Second, duplicate the file (Image: Duplicate); the duplicate will not be softproofed. Comparing the two versions will help you see how your image will change when printed and how to compensate for these changes with additional output specific adjustments."

                   

                  this has been possible since the personal computer became available for professional image preparers.  Nothing new there.  On your second reference to softproofing...

                   

                  "Make Output Specific Adjustments

                  Soft proofing does not change the file, it simply previews how the appearance of an image will change when printed. Once you see how an image will change when printed, you may decide to adjust the file to compensate for those changes, before printing. You can make a printer/paper specific set of corrections, while a file is being softproofed. Start by making a new Group with the printer/paper combination included in the title..."

                   

                  Again, this has been an option for a long time now.  It's a lot of extra work and still a bit unpredictable as long as you are making judgements based on what you see on your monitor.  I prefer to proof my images on a proofer using a paper similar to what will be delivered from the print vendor.  There is a whole industry created to convince users that softproofing is possible.  I understand the limitations of the computer and the seduction it creates.  Now, in defense of the possibility to softproof, the user must know how to apply certain settings to maximize the output.  In reality, you are talking about two totally different rendering: 1.) transmissive ( monitor ), 1.) reflective ( print ) which will never match ( RGB vs. CMYK ).  So, what's the answer?  Simply establish a workflow that maximizes the print output.  That will require matching the print vendor's profile requirements and, yes, based on their equipment.  I use Adobe RGB in Photoshop for prints.  I have also used ProPHOTO RGB for certain applications.  But, for standard output, Adobe RGB is what I use in my closed-loop work flow.  You have an open-loop workflow, so one profile might not work for all vendors.  Depends on their requirements as you've already mentioned.

                  • 6. Re: Color settings :working space adobeRGB but what does  Monitor profile doing?
                    D Fosse Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                    Monitor gamut limits the usefulness of on-screen soft proofing. There will nearly always be printable color that falls outside the monitor gamut, and inversely, you will nearly always see clipped color on-screen that will not be clipped in print.

                     

                    If you have a standard gamut monitor, I'd say soft proofing is a complete waste of time. It won't tell you anything, as it's already soft proofed to something around sRGB. With a wide gamut monitor it starts to become slightly more useful, but still not entirely reliable. I fully agree with jdanek that proofing on paper is far more useful.

                     

                    Back to the original question - if you don't get a general match from screen to paper (excluding gamut clipping), then either the display profile is wrong/broken/corrupted, or your calibration targets are wrong.

                    • 7. Re: Color settings :working space adobeRGB but what does  Monitor profile doing?
                      photoyogi Level 1

                      Thank you both for your replies. FYI when I work with commercial clients  with CMYK output I have sent client RGB  Tiff files and let them deal with it

                      In this  situation I am working to set up on line fulfillment of art images and am testing varied labs for comparison of product, customer service etc.. It is not a situation where I ideally wanted to have to order test prints of each image in each medium.  Unfortunately even when I do soft proofs with different ICC profiles from different labs on same paper  the results were not identical !  UGH.  I will be recallbrating monitor again today to see if that changes things . This is high end monitor but already couple years old. Hoping that is not the issue.

                      thanks, PS…. interesting how negative you both are on soft proofing and yet photo labs usually are happy to give the icc profiles and expect it to help!