4 Replies Latest reply on Aug 14, 2014 6:09 PM by - JM -

    auto profile noise reduction?

    - JM - Level 3

      Seems like all the other raw processors, and noise filters (neatimage, ninja etc) have the ability to auto profile noise reduction or use camera profiles for noise reduction. Not just applying a preset to a single image but being able to batch a bunch of raw images and apply noise reduction based on different image data, iso etc. We can apply auto to most other aspects of the conversion but noise reduction isn't one of them.

       

      I don't need this for critical work stuff which tends to be processed in sets of images with similar shooting environment. But now that all my P&S cameras shoot raw this would be helpful to batch process directly out of ACR. This week I found myself hunting around for other raw converters just to do this and I was pleasantly surprised to see many to choose from that offer this feature.

       

      It does occur to me that I may be overlooking this and ACR already does this?  or is it a missing feature?

       

      thanks

        • 1. Re: auto profile noise reduction?
          ssprengel Adobe Community Professional & MVP

          There is no such feature in Adobe’s raw engine, currently, although the noise-reduction settings do increase by ISO behind the scenes, so a +25 at ISO 100 smooths much less than a +25 at ISO 3200, for example.

           

          My issue with implementing this would be that there needs to be a difference in shadow noise-reduction vs light-area noise-reduction, namely more smoothing in the shadows than in the bright areas, AND this tuning needs to be sensitive to how much brighter an area has been tonally adjusted, which increases the effective ISO noise of a particular area compared to other areas.

           

          Oftentimes you’ll see an almost black area brighten significantly with either a positive adjustment of Shadows or Clarity and the noise of this formerly shadowed area is much more apparent after being brightened.

           

          In other words, any automatic adaptive noise reduction needs to be tunable to both the original tonal values (dark vs light) as well as the effective increase in local contrast of a particular area due to toning adjustments.  rom what I have seen adaptive noise reduction in other products can adapt to different levels of noise based on final brightness level, but such a tool built into LR would also adapt to both final brightness and original brightness.

          • 2. Re: auto profile noise reduction?
            - JM - Level 3

            Thanks for the response. Yes, I believe the same type of adjust is made for sharpening amount based upon a couple metrics.

             

            Just curious - if ACR did offer auto noise reduction and you had 100 raw images, different ISO's and cameras, and all you needed was a quick set of jpgs. Would you use auto noise reduction?

             

            My issue with implementing this would be that there needs to be a difference in shadow noise-reduction vs light-area noise-reduction, namely more smoothing in the shadows than in the bright areas, AND this tuning needs to be sensitive to how much brighter an area has been tonally adjusted, which increases the effective ISO noise of a particular area compared to other areas.

             

            I wouldn't expect it to be perfect, but there have been several types of auto functions already in ACR that need tuning afterwards to achieve perfection. And there are several ways to achieve this, PhotoNinja, Dxo, Neatimage all seem to sample, but I believe that NeatImage and others also allow for the end-user to create presets-sets that will be applied automatically. What I like about this method is that noise presets would be much faster than sampling each image, but still be able to be applied in batch, and the presets can be shared as they are with NeatImage libraries.

             

            I wouldn't use it if I have a difficult image or one that I need to be perfect, in the same manner I don't use the Auto exposure setting in ACR, but I do use lens profiles and auto-chromatic abberation adjustments. But if I have a bunch of snaps that need to be converted to jpgs... you bet I'd apply auto noise reduction.

             

            I'm just wondering why Adobe has chosen not to include this with ACR. It can't be that they have limited resources compared to the other companies that do offer it.

            • 3. Re: auto profile noise reduction?
              MadManChan2000 Adobe Employee

              While we don't provide an automatic, detailed per-image profile, our built-in noise profiles are built on a per-camera and per-ISO basis (as Steve noted above).  So, using a given value of the sliders will do a proportional amount of noise reduction on the various images from various models.  Thus you can meaningfully use a given set of numbers as a reasonable starting point for per-image hand tweaking.

               

              (Yes, it would be a useful addition to have per-image auto analysis for a bunch of our knobs, including NR.  However, we actually do have team resource limits, and every feature pursuit means that others are not pursued.  Yes, there may be other products that offer this already, but I believe we also offer things they don't have ...)

              • 4. Re: auto profile noise reduction?
                - JM - Level 3

                MadManChan2000 wrote:

                However, we actually do have team resource limits, and every feature pursuit means that others are not pursued. ....

                Yes, there may be other products that offer this already

                I won't give up on ACR and CC, but it sounds like I will need to explore what else is out there for this task. Knowing that these features have been around for quite awhile I have new found appreciation for the relatively small developers of the other products.

                 

                regards

                 

                j