10 Replies Latest reply on Sep 9, 2014 2:09 PM by ssprengel

    All noise reduction is lost on export and in Library in Lightroom version 5.6

    KFey

      I wanted to start a new discussion on this because all the previous discussions are quite old.  My noise reduction changes to my photos are not showing up in library and no matter how high the quality is set, the exported photos looks just like the ones in library, very noisy.  I have an olympus OM-D-E-M10 and have the latest raw support (8.6).  Using Lightroom version 5.6 and was hoping the update would fix the issue, however it did not.

        • 1. Re: All noise reduction is lost on export and in Library in Lightroom version 5.6
          Ibarim Level 1

          I got the same problem. In Develop module the noise reduction works ok, it can be seen on screen, but in Library module I can't see the NR changes. After export there is no NR as well.

          I exported photo with different settings: low quality, high quality, full resolution, smaller resolution, high dpi, low dpi, with and witout 'output sharpening'. Nothing helps, the picture look far from the quality I seen in develop module.

          I've read that this bug was repaired in previous updates of LR5, but apparently not. It's strange, coz 1. this problem was known before, as far as I remember LR 4 had this problem and it was fixed. 2. it's clearly a major bug which forces me to edit all 250 wedding photos again in external editor to add noise reduction since LR's doesn't work.

           

          I'm using LR 5.6 on Win 7.

          • 2. Re: All noise reduction is lost on export and in Library in Lightroom version 5.6
            ssprengel Adobe Community Professional & MVP

            Can we see screenshots, at 1:1 or 100% zoom?  Can we have an original raw file and an XMP, or DNG with metadata updated, with all the settings you’re applying?  Use somewhere like www.dropbox.com or similar and post a public download link.  It can be a non-keeper, blurry or out-of-focus, as long as it demonstrates the issue.

             

            I use LR 5.6 every day and it adds whatever NR I tell it to apply.

            • 3. Re: All noise reduction is lost on export and in Library in Lightroom version 5.6
              KFey Level 1

              ssprengel-  Here are my files of screenshots, raw, jpeg, and DNG.  The ORF is my raw file.  In the full screen screen shot you can see the smoothness in develop vs the digital look in library. 

               

              Dropbox - Example of Lightroom noise reduction issues

               

              Let me know if you need anything else.  I appreciate your help!

              • 4. Re: All noise reduction is lost on export and in Library in Lightroom version 5.6
                ssprengel Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                KFey, for your night-sky picture, I'm seeing the same difference in the number of stars using Fit view with more in Library and less in Develop.  This is normal because the two modes use different resampling algorithms to create the Fit or other zoomed-out views with Develop's being less accurate, usually, because it is faster.  In other words, using Fit view in Develop is artificially smooth, so rather than NR not being applied in Library and Exports, it is being applied, just that Develop looks smoother than it should, due to shortcuts in speed.

                 

                However, as you can see at 100% or 1:1 zoom, the two views look almost identical other than the banding that occurs in Library because that's using an Adobe RGB profile before displaying whereas Develop is using 16-bit math before converting to the display profile so is usually smoother.

                 

                For your own information it might be useful to click the down arrow at the right side of the tool bar below the main image area, and turn on the Zoom slider so you can tell what magnification you're using.

                 

                Basically, I don't see anything wrong with LR using the evidence of the images you've posted, just that the resampling algorithms are different between Library and Develop.

                 

                I do have some suggestions with your processing, however.  You are seeing all sorts of crazy noise details around the edges of the stars and tree branches that are caused by the Sharpen / Detail slider having a non-zero value.  For images that have lots of detail having the Sharpen / Detail slider up to the default of 25 can be fine, but for a very smooth image that only has noise for most of the fine texture, having a non-zero Detail slider will add all sorts of false texture.  The other things I'd do differently would be the dial back both the sharpening and noise-reduction if you're going to be resizing down to 2K like your output JPG is.

                 

                Here is the difference between your (left) and my (right) Develop / Detail settings:

                 

                Here is a side-by-side of your (left) and my (right) output JPG resized down to 2048 on the longest side:

                 

                My images have a slight grain to them, but more detail in the branches and less haloing around the stars and branches.  If I wasn't just trying to demonstrate difference in the Detail processing, I probably would also add more Clarity to help with the branch contrast against the sky, but not enough to show haloing around the general area of the trees.

                 

                You will need to click on each image, and perhaps right-click View Target/Link in New Tab and click to zoom to see them at 100% unless your monitor is larger than my 1680x1050.

                • 5. Re: All noise reduction is lost on export and in Library in Lightroom version 5.6
                  ssprengel Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                  Another thing you can do to neutralize the sky is to eye-dropper WB on the main orange area, then use the HSL: Saturation targeted-adjustment-tool (the little ring at the top left of HSL) to click-drag-down on the green area to desaturate it.

                  • 6. Re: All noise reduction is lost on export and in Library in Lightroom version 5.6
                    Ibarim Level 1

                    Thank You for help, You're absolutely right

                    I was using non-1:1 zoom so I didn't see the proper NR effects. I had to apply a lot more NR in Develop module to get the effect I wanted in Library or export.

                    But now those photos in develop look too smooth, people are like plastic dolls. I understand the reason is speed of resampling algorithms, but this solution is not very intuitive. As for now it's hard to apply other effect when everything is blurry from NR and every change I have to confirm in Library 1:1 because the develop view is not accurate and over-smoothed.

                     

                    So KFey maybe this is the same situation with Your photos?

                    • 7. Re: All noise reduction is lost on export and in Library in Lightroom version 5.6
                      ssprengel Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                      It may not be intuitive, but there is a warning exclamation-point in a circle in the Detail area of Develop that when you hover over it with a mouse says you need to view at 1:1:

                       

                      If you are viewing things at 1:1 Library and Develop should look the same.  The look in Fit-zoom in Library is also only an approximation to what Export will look like because you can sharpen during Export after resizing smaller.

                       

                      Here is a review of the types of Sharpening:  Capture Sharpening, Creative Sharpening, Output Sharpening.  LR can do Capture Sharpening with a Mask slider in Develop / Detail, and it can do Output Sharpening during Export.  Photoshop can do all three.

                      Guide to Image Sharpening

                      • 8. Re: All noise reduction is lost on export and in Library in Lightroom version 5.6
                        KFey Level 1

                        As I don't have access to my computer for the week, I can't look into this. However, I do believe that this is my same issue.  Kind of disappointing that what you see is not what you get.  I'll respond further when I get a chance to look at it on my computer! Thanks again for the help.

                        • 9. Re: All noise reduction is lost on export and in Library in Lightroom version 5.6
                          Keith_Reeder Level 4

                          ssprengel wrote:

                           

                          there is a warning exclamation-point in a circle in the Detail area of Develop that when you hover over it with a mouse says you need to view at 1:1:


                          http://www.cambridgeincolour.com/tutorials/image-sharpening.htm

                          Dunno, Steve - the message "For a more accurate preview..." seems quite a long way from "you need to view at 1:1".

                           

                          I think Adobe could be a lot more explicit about this, given the recent flurry of similar posts - which is in itself interesting: I'm pretty sure that this "issue" is a recent one, and I seem to recall that in previous releases of Lr, even the view-to-fit previews looked like the eventual output.

                           

                          In any event I know that I never used to routinely preview at 100%, whereas these days there's a clear need to.

                          • 10. Re: All noise reduction is lost on export and in Library in Lightroom version 5.6
                            ssprengel Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                            Adobe could prevent anything bit 1:1 preview or higher when the Detail section is active.  If I see a message about more accurate preview needing 1:1 I’m probably at least going to try it, once I am seeing some discrepancies, and figure out that is what I need to do. 

                             

                            Adobe can’t say “need” because that suggests you WILL see what the Export looks like, which wouldn’t be true since there is Export sharpening and color profiles involved.   It is also possible that someone with a higher resolution monitor won’t need to use 1:1 and see things relatively accurately.  I don’t know but I don’t have one.  At least people that are viewing a small crop of a larger image that somehow fits into Loupe at 1:1 even though they are set to Fit also wouldn’t need to use 1:1 because Fit already would be equivalent to 1:1 despite not saying so.

                             

                            The issue is that people do expect Fit in Develop to look exactly like whatever they export without imagining that it might not, and the verbiage is a hint in the right direction without being condescendingly direct and slightly wrong.

                             

                            There does seem to be a change in how Develop renders things with every new version, sometimes too smooth and sometimes too sharp.  Adobe used to not show NR or sharpening at Fit view and it was obvious because there was color noise.