25 Replies Latest reply on Sep 29, 2014 10:05 AM by adobenewbie123

    Compression to reduce file size

    adobenewbie123 Level 1

      Hi everyone,

       

      I am trying to reduce a 14GB video file  down to 4 GB so I can upload directly to a web site.  My current project settings is DSLR 1920x1080 and I typically export to a .mp4 1920x1080 p 30.  (which yields a 14 GB file)   So my theory was to try downsizing to 720 p which would hopefully reduce the file size enough  but still maintain an HD setting. So here is what I am curious to hear from the experts on this board.  Is that a good strategy?  What 720p setting should I choose in the Share section?  (none of the options for 720 p shpws 30 fps so i am guesing I will have to change that to 60fps?)And finally, what degree of quality woud you expect I would lose downsizing from 1080p to 720p?

       

      Thanks for your time and input!

        • 1. Re: Compression to reduce file size
          A.T. Romano Level 7

          adobenewbie123

           

          Are you still working with Premiere Elements 10 on Windows 7, 8, or 8.1 64 bit?

           

          ATR

          • 2. Re: Compression to reduce file size
            adobenewbie123 Level 1

            Good question.  Sorry I neglected that data.  Premiere elements 10, Windows 8, 64 bit.

            • 3. Re: Compression to reduce file size
              A.T. Romano Level 7

              adobenewbie123

               

              On this one I would try for a high definition wmv file.

               

              In Premiere Elements 10

              Share

              Computer

              Windows Media with Presets = HD 720p30

              Then under the Advanced Button/Video Tab of the preset customize the export settings for 1920 x 1080 @ 29.97 progressive frames per second.

              The bitrate opportunities there are

              Average

              Peak

              and each are in units of Kbps (kilobits per second) with the default Average 5000 Kbps and Peak 8000 Kbps.

              You could start there with the default bitrates and then increase the bitrates until you find a good compromise between bitrate, quality,

              and frame size.

               

              We can discuss alternatives after you try this .wmv HD format.

               

              ATR

              • 4. Re: Compression to reduce file size
                adobenewbie123 Level 1

                Okay I am going to give the .wmv a shot this weekend. Thanks ATR!   Am I safe to assume that you feel .wmv is the  ideal option because  the mp4's would need to increase to 60fps and .wmv can stay at 30fps?  Also, if it turns out that I can not upload at a .wmv format, can you review with me what problems I might  see with an exported .mp4 720p 60fps setting? I need to followup with the site about acceptable formats beyond .mp4)

                • 5. Re: Compression to reduce file size
                  adobenewbie123 Level 1

                  Hey ATR,  I wrote to the site to get more info on file settings for the upload and this is what they had to say:

                   

                  FilmFreeway accepts all major video formats for upload.

                   

                   

                  We transcode videos for streaming and playback compatibility. We recommend that you use settings close to our output settings, which are described below:

                   

                  maximum video bitrate: 2200 Kbps, H.264, mp4

                  audio bitrate: 128 Kbps, AAC

                  aspect ratio preserved; maximum video width of 1024 pixels

                  • 6. Re: Compression to reduce file size
                    A.T. Romano Level 7

                    adobenewbie123

                     

                    I think we are a bit out of sync.

                     

                    I thought the original question was that you had a AVCHD.mp4 (1920 x 1080p30) file with a huge file size, and you had to decrease in file size to get a 1920 x 1080p30 with a much much less file size. A HD .wmv file would be expected to give you a drastically smaller file size than what you have. That is the basis for my suggestion.

                     

                    If your requirement is as you seem to be stating in post numbered 5

                    H.264.mp4 1024 x 576 @ 29.97 progressive frames per second

                    Then I would try exporting your 1920 x 1080p30 Timeline to 1024 x 576 and determine what the file size is for that.

                    Publish+Share

                    Computer

                    AVCHD

                    with Presets = 1024 x 576 @ 29.97 progressive frames per second after you customize the MP4 H.264 1920 x 1080p30.

                     

                    Did you determine if a wmv file would be unacceptable even though it seem to have the highest potential for giving us the smallest file

                    size?

                     

                    ATR

                    • 7. Re: Compression to reduce file size
                      adobenewbie123 Level 1

                      Hey ATR,

                       

                      Just to clarify, my goal is not to achieve the smalled file size but just get it down to the 4GB maximum  with the highest possible quality.  I think both .wmv and mp4 at 720p would accomplish that reduction so I was trying to fous on which oof those  two  would give me the best  quality.  When I wrote to the site for more specific info, they gave me the info I pasted above.

                       

                      Since they told me now that "  FilmFreeway accepts all major video formats for uploads"  it sounds like .wmv is definitely an option.  So I guess the question is would the mp4 or wmv yield a higher quality picture since I feel like both will offer enough compression at the smaller frame size to make their  4 GB limit.


                      The 1024 pixel width above  was new information as well.   But since that is higher than 720, would I still maintain the HD settings/  1024 seems like such  an odd number to me as it  does not apppear in the drop down in the share section for the various options.  ) Everything is either 1080 or 720. So that really  threw me for a bit of a loop. 

                      • 8. Re: Compression to reduce file size
                        A.T. Romano Level 7

                        adobenewbie123

                         

                        Thanks for the update.

                         

                        If you can achieve the wanted file size, I would probably try for the AVCHD.mp4. But, the Windows Media Video.wmv with the appropriate bitrate should get you a good product. You could create both and decide on the quality issue if both met the file size requirements.

                         

                        Based on the resolution requirements that you posted, my resolution 1024 x 576 was suggested to maintain the 16:9 aspect ratio for the given frame width of 1024.

                         

                        Focus on the Advanced Button/Video Tab and its settings under the preset you have selected for your export and customize of the export settings there.

                         

                        Are we OK on the details at this point?

                         

                        We will be watching for further results.

                         

                        Thank you.

                         

                        ATR

                        • 9. Re: Compression to reduce file size
                          adobenewbie123 Level 1

                          I think i finally got it.  So I will go into my typical export settings under  share of MP4 H.264 1920 x 1080p30

                           

                          Then I go into the Advanced tab but instead of dropping down to 720p, I am going to drop down to 576p (by choosing a 1024x576 frame size)

                           

                          Just out of curiosity, if dropping down to 720p in the  premiere export was enough to bring  the size within 4 GB limit, in which case the upload would still go through to the website, what would  happen next? .  The actual web site would compress the 720p file  down to 576?   Also would you expect there to be a big difference in quality between 720 p and 576p.  Is 576p still considered high definition?

                          • 10. Re: Compression to reduce file size
                            A.T. Romano Level 7

                            adobenewbie123

                             

                            Depends what part of the world you are in whether 576p is considered standard or high definition.

                             

                            But, I suggest you look at your 1024 x 576 @ 29.97 progressive frames per second as 1024 x 576 @ 29.97 progressive frames per second if

                            that is the requirement of your recipient for your video.

                             

                            ATR

                            • 11. Re: Compression to reduce file size
                              adobenewbie123 Level 1

                              Okay I'm ready to give it a shot.  Thanks so much for your valuable recommendations and insight!

                              • 12. Re: Compression to reduce file size
                                A.T. Romano Level 7

                                adobenewbie123

                                 

                                Looking forward to your results.

                                 

                                Depending on the resolution, you might want to triple check with the recipient of your video on the video resolution to determine

                                if a resolution greater than 1024 x 576 would be accepted.

                                 

                                ATR

                                • 13. Re: Compression to reduce file size
                                  adobenewbie123 Level 1

                                  Hi ATR,

                                   

                                  For my first test, I wanted to experiment with just reducing just 1 clip from the project  from 1080p to 720p.  However, instead of choosing the mp4-HD-720p preselect, i wanted to get practice oing it your way... That is, tarting with a MP4-1920x1080p  selection, which matches my project settings, and then going into the advanced tab to change frame to 1280x720.  (that way, we keep the 30 fps which was not an option on the HD-720p pre-selects.)  However, I noticed that the file size is not changing when I make the edits in the advance tab.  I attached a screenshot  from after I submitted the changes in the advance tab screen, which shows a file size of 113.84 MB, the exact same figure that I would see in  the 1920x1080 settings.  (when I actually select a 720p pre-select, the file size goes all the way down from 113  to the 20's.)

                                   

                                  Can you let me know if it appears I am doing anything wrong?

                                   

                                   

                                  reduction-720p.png

                                  • 14. Re: Compression to reduce file size
                                    A.T. Romano Level 7

                                    adobenewbie123

                                     

                                    Under the Advanced Button/Video Tab of the preset, compare the bitrate used in a 1080p and a 720p preset.

                                     

                                    ATR

                                     

                                    Add On...good to explore, but I do not believe your file size is to be gained in 1920 x 1080 to 1280 x 720 (you saw that already).

                                    I suspect that the change in video compression and bitrate juggling are where your gains will be found in the file size quest.

                                    • 15. Re: Compression to reduce file size
                                      adobenewbie123 Level 1

                                      Hey ATR,

                                       

                                      Yes, I see a change.  For all the mp4 1080p pre-selects,  it says 32 target bit rate and 40 Maximum Bit rate. In all the mp4 720p pre-selects, it says 6 target bit rate and 10 maximum bit rate.So I am guessing you want me to make that change from 32-40 to 6-10 in the advanced tab?

                                       

                                       

                                      By the way, if I just use the 720p 60fps preset, it looks like I  will get enough size reduction to get my entire project down to 4GB, which was the original goal.  Assuming the web site can handle 720p, that would really be my easy button without any danger of  me messing anything up by customizing.  The only drawback I see with using the pre-select is the change from a 30 fps project to a 60 fps export.  (since none of the preselects offer 720p at a 30fps.  Can you give me your opinion on what issues one might face merely by going from 30fps to 60 fps?

                                      • 16. Re: Compression to reduce file size
                                        A.T. Romano Level 7

                                        adobenewbie123

                                         

                                        You will have a better chance adjusting the bitrate rather than the frame size to gain your file size reduction.

                                        Determine just how low your can take the bitrate of the MP4 H.264 1920 x 1080p30 before the decrease affects the quality at playback of the export.

                                         

                                        Also, there should be no problem comparing the above with

                                        Publish+Share

                                        Computer

                                        AVCHD

                                        with Presets = MP4 HD 720p60 and customizing the preset to 720p29.97 under the Advanced Button/Video Tab of the preset.

                                         

                                        ATR

                                        • 17. Re: Compression to reduce file size
                                          adobenewbie123 Level 1

                                          Okay I really like your suggestion  to just change the fps of 720p60.  It looks like that pre-set gets me down to 3.6 GB's so I should not need to mess with any of the other settings.

                                           

                                          I am going to do that export over the weekend and will then report my results. (it will take a while to run)

                                           

                                          Thanks again!!

                                          • 18. Re: Compression to reduce file size
                                            A.T. Romano Level 7

                                            adobenewbie123

                                             

                                            Hope that this works for you. Looking forward to the results when you get a chance.

                                             

                                            Often with customizing these presets, if you go far enough, you can change one into another.

                                             

                                            ATR

                                            • 19. Re: Compression to reduce file size
                                              adobenewbie123 Level 1

                                              Is it possible there is a major underlying reason why Premiere does not offer a mp4-720-p30 pre-set?  Is it possible that mp4's at 720p are not supposed to be viewed at 29.97fps?

                                              • 20. Re: Compression to reduce file size
                                                A.T. Romano Level 7

                                                adobenewbie123

                                                 

                                                I have not found anything to support

                                                Is it possible that mp4's at 720p are not supposed to be viewed at 29.97fps?

                                                 

                                                To the contrary, one example, if you look at

                                                Publish+Share

                                                Computer

                                                AVCHD

                                                with Presets = Vimeo HD

                                                note the default with the Frame Width = 1280, Frame Height = 720, Frame Rate = 29.97 progressive frames per second

                                                And, this export with the AVCHD video compression does have a file extension of .mp4.

                                                 

                                                ATR

                                                • 21. Re: Compression to reduce file size
                                                  adobenewbie123 Level 1

                                                  Hey ATR,

                                                   

                                                  Thanks for that very interesting find!  I still have not finished editing yet so the export  experiment got put on hold until this week.  Question.... Would you recommend just using the Vimeo pre-set  as opposed to playing around in the advanced tab under the mp4-720p preset?    Would you agree that either scenario should produce the same exact output?

                                                  • 22. Re: Compression to reduce file size
                                                    A.T. Romano Level 7

                                                    adobenewbie123

                                                     

                                                    You can essentially customize the Publish+Share/Computer/AVCHD preset settings for Vimeo HD to match those given as default for MP4 720p60 and vice versa. Also, note that both show audio as "AAC 256 kbps 48 kHz Stereo".

                                                     

                                                    Now as to whether or not you should get "the same exact output" when both were set to the same export settings and same project preset using the same source, I would venture a Yes. But, the proof would be in the comparison of the two first hand.

                                                     

                                                    ATR

                                                    • 23. Re: Compression to reduce file size
                                                      adobenewbie123 Level 1

                                                      I never even thought about customizing the audio as well.  Would you consider AAC 256 kbps 48 kHz Stereo to be a good setting for the audio? I don't even know what those figures mean so I am relying on the pre-sets to handle that correctly.

                                                      • 24. Re: Compression to reduce file size
                                                        A.T. Romano Level 7

                                                        adobenewbie123

                                                         

                                                        AAC (Audio Coding)

                                                        Advanced Audio Coding - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

                                                         

                                                        256 kbps (Bitrate)

                                                        That would be 256 kilobits per second

                                                        That would mean to me that there are 256 kilobits of data stored in every second of the music. Lots of online articles

                                                        on the influence of bitrate on your music.

                                                         

                                                        48 kHz (Sampling Rate)

                                                        Sampling (signal processing) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

                                                         

                                                        Stereo (Channels 2)

                                                         

                                                        You may find the following interesting

                                                         

                                                        Adobe Audition "A Digital Audio Primer"

                                                        http://ifsstech.files.wordpress.com/2008/06/audaudioprimer1.pdf

                                                        and

                                                        on Premiere Elements Audio Tools (written using 12 to demo, but essentially applicable to your version 10)

                                                        http://www.atr935.blogspot.com/2014/05/pe12-audio-features.html

                                                         

                                                        ATR

                                                        • 25. Re: Compression to reduce file size
                                                          adobenewbie123 Level 1

                                                          Really good reading material. Thanks ATR.  (ingesting it now)