9 Replies Latest reply: Sep 24, 2014 5:00 PM by Derjis RSS

    XAVC exports dropping frames

    Derjis Community Member
    Derjis Sep 24, 2014 2:51 PM

      I'm working on some low-midrange VFX for a local production; their post workflow is all 4k (shot on Red, edited on PPro). They're sending me trimmed PPro seq, I bounce the individual shots to AE using the Replace w/ AE Comp feature, work on them, render the shots out and send the finished stuff back to the client. I've been exporting XAVC .MXFs through AME (XAVC Intra 4k Class 480 3840x2160), but I've found that a good portion of the shots render out 1 frame short. The source and output settings are both 23.976 progressive, so it's not a DF/NDF issue. The comp length, ins and outs in AE are definitely all fine. Rendering out in a different codec (QT Animation or DPX, for instance) works perfectly fine. Adding a frame to the end of my comps doesn't seem to do the trick, either, for some reason. Any suggestions?

      If nobody can help fix the problem, does anyone have any suggestions for alternate codecs? The colorist has specifically asked that I NOT send QT Animation files; DPX files end up being ENORMOUS... ~170 frames clocks in at a little over 5GB. Everything still needs to go to color, so I need something that's as high-quality as possible. ProRes is out. DNxHR is still a couple of months away. They'd prefer self-contained files, rather than image sequences (although, 'eff 'em right in the A, if need be. Dealing with an image seq isn't exactly a big deal...).

       

      Ideally, I'd just like to get this XAVC thing sorted, though.

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        • 1. Re: XAVC exports dropping frames
          Todd_Kopriva Adobe Employee
          Todd_Kopriva Sep 24, 2014 3:17 PM (in response to Derjis)

          What exact versions of AME, After Effects, and Premiere Pro are you using?

          • 2. Re: XAVC exports dropping frames
            Derjis Community Member
            Derjis Sep 24, 2014 3:29 PM (in response to Todd_Kopriva)

            They're all the most current versions, so

            AE 13.0.2.3

            AME 8.0.1.48

            PPro 8.0.1 (21)

            • 3. Re: XAVC exports dropping frames
              Todd_Kopriva Adobe Employee
              Todd_Kopriva Sep 24, 2014 3:41 PM (in response to Derjis)

              I'm seeing a bug in our database regarding a frame being dropped in XAVC export if the number of frames being sent to AME is odd. Perhaps this is the bug that you're hitting.

               

              Regarding other codecs, though: Why is ProRes out? What about Cineform? You say that the colorist has said no to Animation in QuickTime. Why? Also, you say that they don't want image sequences, but again that seems like cutting off a valid workflow.

               

              Specific to their dislike of Animation codec: For anyone who uses Animation these days, I recommend the PNG codec in a QuickTime container instead. It is also lossless and can have an alpha channel, and it compresses to about half the size as Animation for photorealistic images. The Animation codec was designed for and excels at flat colors (like in cartoons, hence the name).

              • 4. Re: XAVC exports dropping frames
                Derjis Community Member
                Derjis Sep 24, 2014 3:56 PM (in response to Todd_Kopriva)

                Is the frame-drop bug going to be addressed? It seems likely that it's a related thing, although as I'd mentioned, adding an extra frame on the backend of the AE comp didn't make a difference.

                 

                I hate ProRes with a passion, though that's a moot point, since I'm running Win7Pro. I have no idea why the color guy doesn't want Animation --- he's kind of an ***, TBH... it's easier for me to just nod and give him what he asks for that it is to start an argument. Louder-and-Dumber always triumphs over reason in an argument.

                I'll give the PNG export a go, and keep my fingers crossed that he doesn't start moaning about it.

                • 5. Re: XAVC exports dropping frames
                  Todd_Kopriva Adobe Employee
                  Todd_Kopriva Sep 24, 2014 4:05 PM (in response to Derjis)

                  I'm not on the AME team, so I can't comment on when their bugs might be addressed. If I'm reading this bug record correctly, though, it seems that this might be a limitation of XAVC not dealing well with odd numbers of frames.

                  • 6. Re: XAVC exports dropping frames
                    Thomas Nord Adobe Employee
                    Thomas Nord Sep 24, 2014 4:12 PM (in response to Todd_Kopriva)

                    Todd is correct, this is a limitation of the XAVC spec.

                    • 7. Re: XAVC exports dropping frames
                      Derjis Community Member
                      Derjis Sep 24, 2014 4:22 PM (in response to Thomas Nord)

                      Seriously? That's crazy! How could that possibly be acceptable in a modern codec!?

                      Good to know. Thanks, guys! Is there somewhere I can find out more about this? I couldn't find any sort of reference to the problem when I was troubleshooting prior to posting here...

                      • 8. Re: XAVC exports dropping frames
                        Thomas Nord Adobe Employee
                        Thomas Nord Sep 24, 2014 4:31 PM (in response to Derjis)

                        Let me see if I can dig up some more detail on the issue. And just to cover the bases, in case that isn't your issue, would it be possible to provide a project file (no media required) that I could investigate on my end?

                        • 9. Re: XAVC exports dropping frames
                          Derjis Community Member
                          Derjis Sep 24, 2014 5:00 PM (in response to Thomas Nord)

                          Sure, thanks! I just sent you a PM